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#1 Entropy

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Posted 25 June 2017 - 07:01 PM

Ever since we got rid of rule 5, people have been trying to use alts in all sort of 'creative' ways.

Until now, there were some unwritten rules about alts, but I want to make them 'super official' by adding a section about alts in the Rules forum.

Here are a few things that will be in that section, but I am looking for feedback also.

 

You are not allowed to use alts to:

1. Place them at spawns for the sole purpose of monitoring the spawn (Ivan, Joker, etc.)

2. PKing them so that they spam channel 6 with PKing messages.

3. Pin mobs with them (especially while afk)

 

Are you ok with these rules? Would you like more rules being added?

 

P.S. The alt rules will also apply to your brother, sister, parents, cat, ficus, etc. Anything on the SAME IP will be considered an alt for the purpose of these rules.



#2 Aislinn

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Posted 25 June 2017 - 07:54 PM

I would add that if we catch you trying to circumvent this by using a proxy or vpn or some other trick, that counts as well.



#3 aravinth

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Posted 25 June 2017 - 08:21 PM

Rule 1 and 2 seems ok and makes sense to me.
Though I do have a problem with rule 3, but since you have said (especially whike afk) maybe not.
I do use alt to pin bosses in hard invasion when they are for example 20 cocalar in bethel, or trassian etc, or for ranging (but that rarely happens).


#4 Burn

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Posted 25 June 2017 - 08:21 PM

There's time to get this into the official rules before the next client release.

 

Once decided, Ais or radu make a final post with the official final wording and I'll make sure it gets in as rule 29... or as part of a current rule. Can lemme know your preference for that as well. ;-)

 

 

----

 

 

Only part I have an opinion on really is the spawn monitors. Glad to see those go.

 

They were part of the reason I sent the new Joker spawns, hehe.

 

(I remember there used to be one alt that sat almost 24/7 on the Melinis wall where Neno would spawn, seems to be gone now.)


Edited by Burn, 25 June 2017 - 08:22 PM.


#5 Entropy

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Posted 25 June 2017 - 08:28 PM

I made it clear already that placing alts at spawns is not ok, but I want to put it on the forums too.



#6 CherUT

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Posted 25 June 2017 - 08:29 PM

I think they are all great rules.  



#7 FairyTail

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Posted 25 June 2017 - 08:41 PM

:hiya:

 

I know I have an opinion on everything, but this one is something that I have an actual 'view' on...

 

I started playing when #5 was still in effect & while I see/understand all the pro's & cons of getting rid of it I still think of my alt as a separate player. He is built differently, for different things to be done etc. I do trade between them of course but I try to run them as 'separate characters that help each other as friends' as opposed to just another set of eyes to monitor / hold stuff.

I don't disagree with alts at all - it would be incredibly hypocritical of me to even try to pretend otherwise!

However, they do get a little... abused... by some people. I am trying to build a good fighter on this so I have an alt I harv with and one I have trained craft/manu on. But they are 'separate people' really. Not an extension / monitoring tool for this char.

I do also agree with the point on pvp training with them. It just feels wrong to me. Maybe it is, maybe it isn't - everyone has an opinion, this is just mine.

Besides, why pretend to be lots of other people? I want a very good char & have a couple of alts as 'support services'.
 

I mean, I thought alts were so you could manu with one char to a good level while leaving the other free of committing those pp's so as to be able to do something else - again to a good level. Or have a decent fighter but an alt who has lower a/d levels so you can still join in with friends whose chars are also lower - in invances / instances etc.

Anyway, I guess the above meandering waffle boils down to this: Good idea, glad it is clearer.

Thanks for that - I know it has been a bone of contention for many so I hope this will cause less arguing / bitching.

 

 

:medieval:



#8 kazumonstro

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Posted 25 June 2017 - 11:22 PM

Ok ;

 

1 Rule- Very fair.

 

2 Rule- just take care, because some players use alts to train ranged/Mana Drain, and sometimes they are killed by any missclick. Or add the rule "#don't use your alt to train". <== what ill make really hard to lvling magic/ranged or broke armors, because EL don't have so much players who waste time on that kind of skills/quest.

 

3 Rule- I don't agreed. Mobs want attack players, especially in invasions. And use alt's to pin mobs at invasions & or Train defense ( Like i do with my alt) is just a wise Strategy.

 

--Just to add... It's really hard take all mobs to gap def and make a good tank char. Especialy at Bethel (at the barrel or any other of the 5 places). When u finally got all mobs and be ready for fight, some player come and kill all your Desert C/Cyclops. It's ok i understand. it's part of the game. But train a good tank it's hard enough now, don't make it harder, we don't need that. And low level's players who are going to n00b instances, they really need a good tank for low instances to teach and make the game more fun.

 

Anyway, just my Feedback;

 

Luzbell.



#9 Entropy

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Posted 25 June 2017 - 11:38 PM

Rule 2 is to not spam it. If it happens every once in a while it's ok, but it if happens a few times an hour it isn't.

 

Rule 3 is mostly for AFK purposes, like if you keep a mob busy while you are afk.



#10 kazumonstro

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Posted 26 June 2017 - 12:02 AM

So,

 

1-it's still allowed use an alt to pin mobs in invasions?

 

2- it's still allowed use an alt to pin mobs in bethel while you play at main char? 



#11 Entropy

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Posted 26 June 2017 - 12:17 AM

You can pin them only if someone (like your main) is there to fight them. Can't use alts to have them pinned more than a minute or two if there is no one going to fight them. And I also do NOT want people to use alts to pin many mobs so that their alt will come and fight 7 mobs at once.



#12 caladina

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Posted 26 June 2017 - 07:25 AM

I'll ask a few questions so i know the answers ahead of time regarding using alts together.

 

A. is it illegal to use an alt when you have a daily (ida lion for example) to sit on one spawn to see which lion you killed so your main knows which one to run back to?

i ask as this is an action that fits the description of spawn watching but is only a temporary one, but looking at the wording in your op it seems you are referring most to pure 'sit there all day' on lucrative spawns

 

B. also is it allowed to be killing two separate spawns at the same time with two alts, ie one on each of the two sedi tigers, i ask this to make sure this isnt seen as spawn holding or watching, its more a case of multi tasking.

when people do want one of the spawns i send one alt away, i don't use them to hog or block spawns

 

C, are we allowed to have an alt to sit out of the way but near by to take and give supplies to your main on a map your main is hunting regular yellow top creatures

 

D are there any rules about using more than one alt at a harvesting item?

  D1 second alt to heal harvester and any other non connected players that need healing, D2, both alts harvesting same item at the same time, (obviously not blocking that item from others getting to it)


Edited by caladina, 26 June 2017 - 07:35 AM.


#13 yethq

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Posted 26 June 2017 - 02:24 PM

There is some uses of alts that I also question whether they are right and know that some people use alts in these manners and want to bring them into the discussion:

 

some seem to be using alts as what I would call an illegal or undeclared bot for storage purposes and have heard people say things like "I keep all of {this} on my alt etc.  I heard Radu say the other day that alts are supposed to be played so it would seem that using one primarilly as storage would break that intention but I wonder radu if you dont want to add that to the new rules just to make it more official or if you dont due to it would perhaps be a hassle to police I dont know...but it seems to me that you intended that our alts be played characters and not use for other purposes such as illegal bots and spawn protectors etc.

 

I have a lot of alts but I do try very hard to keep playing them all some get neglected a little but my intentions are to level (if I live long enough I am slow to level) all my alts and my main...

 

I guess that is all that comes to mind right now--I would suggest that we might add that alts need to be played and they should not be used primarilly for storage...

 

decided to add more:

 

I wonder in this discussion about all the various uses of alts and I use them for but not exclusively for some of these as well  

 

such phenomina as "Harvest Slaves" which I would call alts that have no function of life of their own other than to harvest for the main and I am not saying this should or should not be tolerated I would of course leave that up to Radu but maybe here it should at least be addressed...

 

is it ok to have alts that are only played to better the position of the main and have no life of their own..ie they do not level any skills other than what they do for the main..such as harvesting for instance or 

mixing essies (and only mixing essies for the main)  

 

Before anyone argues please note I am not suggesting one way or the other whether this should be a legal way of playing an alt or not...I am asking only for it to be considered and made clear here.

 

I  have as said many alts but I myself have a kind of role play game with them and each of them has its own speciality that it does and none of the others do...such as Chavalah is my potter, Mammalushke my tailor,

Kruella is learning manu, Frumasara will hopefully be a mage....Yenta I hope to make a bot.  And Gimel I dont play she was one I meant to kill.  So anyway, I still at times use them more for helping YethQ but that is not my intended main use for any of them although they are an asset yes. (well sometimes they cost me a lot to maintain too lol)


Edited by yethq, 26 June 2017 - 03:01 PM.


#14 Blue_dragon

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Posted 27 June 2017 - 11:36 AM

I am in favour of implementation of all the 3 rules that Radu have mentioned. :icon13:



#15 The_Piper

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Posted 27 June 2017 - 11:19 PM

1. Place them at spawns for the sole purpose of monitoring the spawn (Ivan, Joker, etc.)

Makes sense,fine for me

 

2. PKing them so that they spam channel 6 with PKing messages.

Is that really a problem?

if i'm right, the closest PK place to underworld is KF, but it still takes some time to go there from Underworld.

Is that really worth a new rule?

 

3. Pin mobs with them (especially while afk)

Isn't that more a tactic than an abuse?

If that's really a problem, making the monsters run away after a given time, like 30 seconds, from an attackable, but not reachable  player might be a better solution IMO.

 

Anyways, no problem with such rules, since they don't affect my game play.

 

Piper


Edited by The_Piper, 27 June 2017 - 11:20 PM.


#16 Rokk

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Posted 28 June 2017 - 12:39 PM

Reinstate rule 5, EL was cooler when social interactions were needed to play.
Odd to abolish a rule infavour of many complicated subrules aiming to do the same thing as the origional rule was in place for

#17 RipTide

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Posted 28 June 2017 - 05:17 PM

Reinstate rule 5, EL was cooler when social interactions were needed to play.
Odd to abolish a rule infavour of many complicated subrules aiming to do the same thing as the origional rule was in place for

 

 

That cat is out of the bag. Far too late for that.



#18 vinoveritas

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Posted 29 June 2017 - 05:55 PM

2. PKing them so that they spam channel 6 with PKing messages.

 

Am against this rule.

 

Sometimes such a kill is a relive. besides some people take alts to break clothes and so on when they do not find a fighting partner and a death is unavoidable, how do you difference

[19:48:05] mother__nature is now "Sleeping in light".

 

it makes one feel good to see that message now and then (not so often) and because of the name it made people want to get a hit in too, so many people in game that mother nature hates.


Edited by vinoveritas, 29 June 2017 - 06:23 PM.


#19 Entropy

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Posted 30 June 2017 - 08:06 PM

If it happens once or twice it's ok. If it happens +2 times in an hour, it gets annoying.



#20 Raz

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Posted 01 July 2017 - 07:22 PM

Definitely in agreement with all the above..

 

OK - so no one has mentioned the elephant(s) in the room....

 

1) Having an alt in a strategic spot to see someone passing to / from a specific location simply to watch for passers by and then call in the main - Am thinking specifically of placing alts in spots on the hydro route 

2 ) placing alts by spawn so that you can then serp / call main - again thinking of NRM RD

3 ) having alt by your training location with the sole purpose of collecting your DB - enabling you to train without a brick






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