Jump to content
Eternal Lands Official Forums
Entropy

Disclosure of the rate changes

Let us know what you think about it  

304 members have voted

  1. 1. Should the rare stuff ratio changes be made public?

    • Yes
      119
    • No
      181


Recommended Posts

Why people aren't using their rostos is beyond me...

 

That... I don't understand, do people think Rosto are going out of style?

 

5k... is that on one person? Or throughout the whole game? I know a couple people who have 15 rostos, that aint all too much... I only have 2 (that's very little).

 

Does the rosto count ever go down? or does more come in the game than go out? I understand that stockpiling them would be a good idea in the case that you have a chance of never running out.

 

Hey, if I had the gc, I would definaetly buy a few more. But I hardly die... so indeed, I would be "hoarding" them, although, not for later on selling (unless I desprately need gc). But... I don't see rostos going UP in price, rather going DOWN. Then there comes in rarity though... if they are more rare, the price will go up. That could be why some of too many rostos :unsure:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

People use rostos, but there are many people that have mules to harvest stuff, and transfer the rostos and binding and stuff to their main char. This problem will be taken care of very soon, and those who do that will lose all their items or worse (this will happen in August, I want to get a nice, big list). So if you do that, I would strongly suggest you stop doing it.

 

The top 100 rostogol hoarders has from 20 to 80 rostos on them.

 

It's probably just my personality, but I've always referred to have the information so I can make an informed decision rather than have to guess without knowing. Just my personal preference. I voted yes.

 

Making informed decisions is a luxury, not a right.

IRL, people pay millions or even more to know that kind of info, there are big companies that make big mulah out of it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

People use rostos, but there are many people that have mules to harvest stuff, and transfer the rostos and binding and stuff to their main char. This problem will be taken care of very soon, and those who do that will lose all their items or worse (this will happen in August, I want to get a nice, big list). So if you do that, I would strongly suggest you stop doing it.

 

People still try to cheat, even when they should know you know all... how totally lame. Well... personally.. I wont mind that happening... will certainly drop cheating... (A BIT) there will always be cheaters.

 

80 rosts... wow 0.o I don't think someone needs that many :unsure:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There is nothing inherently wrong with speculation, but in this case it hurts the game, because of the following scenario:

People hoard on items, then the items are scarce, then they accumulate to large quantities, and the item is not even rare anymore, but quite expensive.

Then I end up seeing that we have too many rare items in the game, and reduce the rate even more, which again, starts this process again.

 

If people sold those items for reasonable prices, then there would be more money circulating in the game, which is good for mostly everyone.

If not, we have a semi-recession.

 

 

The problem is that people hoard because they are afraid of future changes in rarity and because items are scarce in circulation because of it. When no one knows where there next EFE is coming from they hoard even more. The announcements for changes in scarcity motivate people to start using the EFEs they have and then try to get as many more as they can as well when higher and try to get more while using less when they become more rare.

 

There is just a certain level of rare items each person is comfortable having before they start using new ones. Some of the players make uber amounts of gear that uses EFEs. There are no ways to account for those EFEs as part of the general community's EFEs. Increasing the rarity of them makes some of the hoarders use the ones they have but then they just try harder to get more to replace the ones they are using.

 

Telling everyone that you are not going to announce changes in rarity just means everyone is going to act like everything is more rare no matter how many appear in market. This means a permanent recession. Let's keep the announcements but give advanced warnings. If the price stays too high too long then double the price on the EL shop again. If the players who are hoarding the EFEs make that happen they will become very unpopular. Everyone will say you cannot force people to play a certain way because of the NMT experiment. I think rare items are different because it effects the whole community.

 

If everyone knows rare items are not going to get more rare again as long as they keep moving into market or out of the game then we should see a response. Knowing when items are going to be more rare or less rare also is a great help to character development because it allows for better planning of character leveling. :unsure:

 

TirunCollimdus

CoGM of PATH

Perseverance And Tolerance Honored

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I voted no, as I think it should be private like the majority of people up to this point. However, I think knowing the amount of items in the game could possibly put a different twist to this topic. Of course it's only relavent for active accounts in the past 60 days or so, but if you're comparing to rl; surplusses and shortages are usually known (and reflected in prices), where the rate of production is possibly unknown.

 

What ever happened to the stats posting idea?

http://www.eternal-lands.com/forum/index.p...=stats&st=0

 

Is it dead?

Edited by captdeadhead

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

People did not want their name in those tops, so the idea is dead.

However, I make very good use of the database, being able to see the amount of items in the game is very helpful.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I voted no, as I think it should be private like the majority of people up to this point. However, I think knowing the amount of items in the game could possibly put a different twist to this topic. Of course it's only relavent for active accounts in the past 60 days or so, but if you're comparing to rl; surplusses and shortages are usually known (and reflected in prices), where the rate of production is possibly unknown.

 

What ever happened to the stats posting idea?

http://www.eternal-lands.com/forum/index.p...=stats&st=0

 

Is it dead?

 

 

That is a very good point. If we don't get the rarity of an item the total amount in game of that item instead would be an acceptable substitute. Having both could work even better as we would understand the whole picture and be able to control pricing. It would give us the power to ignore the rare item hoarders and get a reasonable price since we would know that something might be hard to find even when there is a lot of it in game. Then we could tell someone who wants to raise the price that just because one person is not selling does not mean we are willing to pay unreasonable prices. :closedeyes: If we get option 3 in the poll where it is having rarity and quantity known then I vote for that.

 

TirunCollimdus

CoGM of PATH

Perseverance And Tolerance Honored

Edited by TirunCollimdus

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

On one hand, the hoarders are doing damage to the economy. Something has to be done. On the other hand, people would go nuts trying to figure out the changes to everything each update.

Note that I don't have that big a problem with the people who use stuff having a bunch. I don't see a problem with the top 50 manu'ers having a few dozen EFEs in storage at all times in order to handle a sudden spurt in demand. The same would apply for people who do a lot of fighting having a dozen rostos (but probably not that many more than that).

The problem is the people who are hoarding to sell later; as I've stated before, others have covered before, and Ent has said in this thread.

 

So I think a good experiment would be to announce how many things have changed each update (or if nothing changed), but not which items or how much, so people at least know when to look, and how many things to look for. On the other hand, I also like the idea of more gradual changes, that can fix the issues without being a sudden spike.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, the problem is that a lot of people have lots of rostos and they are not even fighters. That kind of pisses me off, but oh well, I can't do anything about it.

 

And yes, I will announce when there are changes, just not tell what the changes are.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

voted no, there is no benefit for the economy by releasing that kind of info imo.

 

 

 

 

well i dont know about the others, but i am one of the top "hoarders", and i have never sold a rost (traded a couple, and gave maybe 10 or so away as presents for very special occasions/ppl).

 

I am not hoping for a better price later, i am simply hoping i will find the time to train again and some remote day be able to even do a little PKing in contests or such again, and will be happy to have them then.

 

Those stones are NEVER gonna hit the market, no matter what price is out there, and they will be used sooner or later.

 

I would be using them already now, but for a non yeti fighter with as little time to actually play like me it takes years to prepare for a reset, i dont have the money to just buy 300 hydro bars like the top fighters do it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I voted yes because i think that if changes are not public conspiracy theories may start.

Anyway i don't have any problem if the ratio changes are public or not.

 

I do not agree that the number of items that a player has in his inventory should be private.

Privacy has to do with real life and personal messages inside game. Not with items.

 

Its annoying to see people posting chat logs with pm's in the forums and at the same time those people to disagree if their items are public.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

well i dont know about the others, but i am one of the top "hoarders", and i have never sold a rost (traded a couple, and gave maybe 10 or so away as presents for very special occasions/ppl).

 

I am not hoping for a better price later, i am simply hoping i will find the time to train again and some remote day be able to even do a little PKing in contests or such again, and will be happy to have them then.

 

Those stones are NEVER gonna hit the market, no matter what price is out there, and they will be used sooner or later.

 

Same here, could'nt say it better.

I just have them is storage for later use,not to be traded.

Did not vote, I don't care.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Im one of the rosto hoarders , ~35 rosto in storage, at least half of them entered the game from el shop.

I need a lot of essences/armors/rostos/potions in storage so i can train and pk without worring i will run out of things i need.

With current market channel its not so easy to buy them at reasonable price so i moslty buy from friends, mostly in big quantities (:

I didnt vote in poll since im not market speculant/trader, i dont make money on buying cheap and selling expensive, so i really dont care if rarity of things will be public or not.

 

mp

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've already expressed my point of view on hoarders when some of the top stats have been released. I strongly encourage solutions that is counter people who keep "rare" items in storage and that have no use of them where other players have a really bad time searching these items. So as I think that not telling the rates of these items can help, I voted no here.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Voted no

 

no reason at all i need to know the drop/make ratio of any rare items. if i make an efe or find a rosto then so be it,if i dont then fine.

 

im not a market anylist or economic whizz but IMO in a game such as EL the rarity of an item doesnt affect the price of an item to much, the biggest problem is how much people are willing to pay.If everyone stuck together and said "no wether there is 20k or 10k EFE's in the game will we only pay 3k for them" then the price would remain stable, but people dont , there always one person who is willing to pay 1k more etc for an item thus forcing the price up.(virtualy the same as people who undercut prices but in reverse )

 

Edit: and i also understand that greed takes apart in price increases as well. Take EFE's for example. Cost to make ? what 1-2 gold, astounds me that people are not happy selling them for 3k still, that is a HUGE profit margin by anyones standards .

Edited by conavar

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

ahm... WHY is it bad for economy that people hoard rosto or EFE exactly? I hate using statistics this way. If 10k out of 15k EFE are not going anywhere, they are essentially 'dead weight'. The number of unused items should not influence drop rate in any way, IMO.

 

It is like saying that hoarding a pallet of freeze dried food in your cellar causes starvation.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

ahm... WHY is it bad for economy that people hoard rosto or EFE exactly? I hate using statistics this way. If 10k out of 15k EFE are not going anywhere, they are essentially 'dead weight'. The number of unused items should not influence drop rate in any way, IMO.

 

True, hoarding even raises the prices artificially. It's like the oil stocks in America. When the price goes lower America (and other countries, but mainly America) starts to stock gigantic amounts of oil => Price raises again. When the price goes too high the stocks are thrown on the market and the price lowers again.

 

Stocks are a thing that keeps prices balanced in the economy so prices are less dependent on natural resources, wars, machinery fails, etc etc

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As someone else has pointed out, the EL economy and RL economy can not be 100% equivalent, because you don't really NEED EFEs in EL, but you pretty much need oil or food IRL.

 

And those hoarded EFEs are not dead weight, they are a bomb waiting to happen (sooner or later they will go in the market, and if everyone will decide to sell them at once, their price will go down bad).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

On 2nd thought I vote no.

I think if people know that rate for EFEs is high, will people make more FE.

Like when the new removal stones came in game, people were harvesting a lot to get one.

 

Don't know if it's possible to see ?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think it's impossible to stop efe and other rare item hoarding. I don't know if keeping rates secret will help too much - every time you announce the rate was changed some people may act as if it was lowered, at least until they realise they make much more EFEs than before.

I think the main reason people are stacking EFEs it that gaining one is based on luck only - you can't predict when (and if) you get another EFE, rosto, enrichment stone. If I knew that after making e.g. 10k fe I'll get an EFE for sure or there was some kind of formula using common ingredients I'd have no problems with selling the ones I have. Now, with so many items requiring EFE (I think it's one of the reasons the price is so high) and no guarantee that I'll be able to get another I'm going to keep rares I have now in case I'll need them in the future.

 

I'm not asking for EFEs or other rares to become more common - well, they're rare for a reason. I just think that many people don't hoard rares for speculation, but just because you can't predict how many of them you'll be able to get and what uses will they have in the future.

 

Keeping rates secret may or may not help, depending on how many hoarders are speculants and how many just keep rares for their own use.

 

I've decided not to vote yet.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×