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s2e for hydro

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Very much indeed. It's become pointless, especially as the margin even before it was PK'ed 24/7 was not a terribly decent one given such risk existed also back then.

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Very much indeed. It's become pointless, especially as the margin even before it was PK'ed 24/7 was not a terribly decent one given such risk existed also back then.

 

I don't think that it was that few before. I remember s2e sold for 1240gc. So 10 swords is 12400gc-15000gc (bar) which is a profit of 2600gc.

Consider this for the 50 bars one nexus needs. Running the swords would save you up to 130kgc. I don't think that 130kgc is few.

 

But yeah with that higher risk right now, ppl rather buy the hydro bars. With s2es sold for sometimes only 800gc the paradox situation is that for every two successfull run s2es one could afford losing one and be at same rate as if not losing any at cost of 1240gc. So with that lower price you only need to successfully run 2/3 of the swords. Yet less people run.

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1 run with 30 s2e right now would need about 5 invisible spells and 5 true sight spells, as well as other preparations to flee fast in cast stivy catches you. thats about 1kgc you need to add to the equation. you also need to take in account critic failures and the costs of making a bar, a few tele to range a few heals, srs. picaxes, so your are easy on 1.5kgc costs for each run, if nothing happens.

If you die you loose either 10-15 swords (on avarage) or a rosto (which would be a lot more gc) lets go with 10 swords thats 12400 loss on you so with say 2k profit on a bar and 3 bars per run, you need to make at least 2 successfull, undisturbed runs for 1 death to get yourself even. You can only make 1 run at a time before stivy gets alert on you, or he might be alert on you if someone else made a run just before you, or if you made a mistake and he saw it. and you are on the need to make even more runs. or have the losses.

 

If you consider the time needed to make s2e (even with bought steel and iron bars ) and the time running up there. i call it not profitable and the few times i might do such runs there i do it to get rid off some s2e i have. Buying hydro bar is prefered by me

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Same here, prefer to buy the bars rather than the hassle and the risk of running them. I have hundreds of s2e-s rotting away in storage.

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Alright, i can't hold this back anymore and it might come out a little jumbled but here goes:

 

I understand the reasoning for Radu to support the prevention of just anyone going to hydro. Maybe he even pays/supports the Stivy group to stand guard... (might as well just remove the map and make it easier for poor Stivy but that's beside the point)

 

In the past, maybe its been too easy for people to get hydro (although I think a case can be made for that too)

 

My point is I think its clear that this has affected the market economy to the point where people are leaving the game because of it. Is that the goal? Because if it is, its working.

 

Not only does the game need a new *alternative* use for s2e's, but steel bars, iron bars, Iron ore, coal, fe's ings etc all that stuff. As soon as people see that nobody buys it on the market, it cuts out a lot of economy. Harvesters, miners, alchemists, manuers ... which in turn also affects fighters, pkers etc. It just does.

 

I took a break from the game for a bit, came back to see and its obvious.

 

For the older more experienced players and pkers etc to argue that "its easy" to get past the stivy blockade, is obviously a weak argument. I used to sell lots of s2e's to high-level players and they have all disappeared. quit.. i don't know. I know they don't buy s2e's though. And why not? because as others have said in other threads, "its easier to just buy hydro bars"

 

Well that's great, but like i said, that has proven to be a big dent in the economy. Which has affected the entire game.

 

I don't know if Stivy and Radu are friends. Maybe. Maybe not. Either way, c'mon Radu please make another viable use for s2e's or in the very least make an NPC that will buy them for a fair price. It's hurting the game! :( :( :(

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Alright, i can't hold this back anymore and it might come out a little jumbled but here goes:

 

I understand the reasoning for Radu to support the prevention of just anyone going to hydro. Maybe he even pays/supports the Stivy group to stand guard... (might as well just remove the map and make it easier for poor Stivy but that's beside the point)

 

In the past, maybe its been too easy for people to get hydro (although I think a case can be made for that too)

 

My point is I think its clear that this has affected the market economy to the point where people are leaving the game because of it. Is that the goal? Because if it is, its working.

 

Not only does the game need a new *alternative* use for s2e's, but steel bars, iron bars, Iron ore, coal, fe's ings etc all that stuff. As soon as people see that nobody buys it on the market, it cuts out a lot of economy. Harvesters, miners, alchemists, manuers ... which in turn also affects fighters, pkers etc. It just does.

 

I took a break from the game for a bit, came back to see and its obvious.

 

For the older more experienced players and pkers etc to argue that "its easy" to get past the stivy blockade, is obviously a weak argument. I used to sell lots of s2e's to high-level players and they have all disappeared. quit.. i don't know. I know they don't buy s2e's though. And why not? because as others have said in other threads, "its easier to just buy hydro bars"

 

Well that's great, but like i said, that has proven to be a big dent in the economy. Which has affected the entire game.

 

I don't know if Stivy and Radu are friends. Maybe. Maybe not. Either way, c'mon Radu please make another viable use for s2e's or in the very least make an NPC that will buy them for a fair price. It's hurting the game! :( :( :(

Spot on,,,,why have s2e in the game now?...I used to sell them,,,,theres no market for them anymore|!

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This is just more proof that the only skill worth levelling is fighting.

Fight monsters buy stuff you need from npc, honestly it surprises me that people mix any thing at all, there's no profit in it.

Stop NPCs selling anything, give a point to mixers again!

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pls, remove hydro bar from NPC and ppl will trade s2e for hydro again :D

 

 

It would just cause more players to leave the game. I've seen enough leave already over this one issue. Elle and the alc tutorial require ore, not bars. Yes you can ask Stivy if you can pass. He will let you for the elle quest. Still many feel that they shouldn't have to. Nobody truly owns anything in this game but radu and they feel stivy shouldn't own the hydro run. I won't do the run anymore. I buy bars for nexus and that's few and far between. On the other side of it, if the npc stopped selling hydro bars, the price for bars/ore would shoot through the roof, the npc provides a cap. II would be a constant war zone. If Stivy wasn't controlling it, someone else would. Remember, all the run is, is a rosto farm for radu.

 

Littlebro, I wouldn't doubt for an instant that there is some sort of compensation going on for stivy blocking the run 24/7

 

To sum it up, nothing is going to change as long as stivy collects bricks for radu. Stop making runs, stop giving stivy a reason to be there and maybe things would change.

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I think we can all agree the hydro/rosto/stivy trap thing going on is intended and won't change.

 

I wanna make sure this post is more about s2e's and the economy slipping further down..and of course this comes in a long line of other reasons why the economy has dwindled.

 

As things like this continue to shape the game, the result is the same with each one and it is obvious: Less players. Pretty soon there won't be anyone going on hydro losing rostos because there won't be any players.

 

Want more rostos? Get more players. --- Make some updates that help boost the economy.

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The issue is more the mix lag, even on making thread. I talk about 3-5 seconds delay until the client updates. happnes regularly. bad network / bad client / server design.

 

And I play on USA / Kanana servers even first person shooter games where I hardly encounter so many lag spikes. el should reuse for example the network stack of quake3 enginge for example. much better as this el network stack regarding lag.

 

There is still market for some things but you have to search for it yourself. Market channel is dead.

 

It is not hardare related.

 

I have a load of 0.47 average, my box can handle a load of up to 12 fine.

RAM is not a concern 16GB of 32GB max installed

Client was built from git, so its newer as anything offically available. (though client has some issues, which are annoying and buggy)

GPU has 2GB now, Nvidia gpu tools claim below 500MB in usage. profile 2 used mostly. profile 3 is full power.

 

I sold all my fighting gear. too much lag, regardless on which time and date I tested.

 

Fix the lag and players may come and join

 

And we do not have many customizatioins. below 10 options when you create a character is not very much. any android game has over 30 options for hairstyles for example.

 

Gear is in general too expensive. Recipes should be adapted or npc totally removed as the playerbase is now big enough to supply anything anyway.

 

OLD Rule 5 removal killed the game more as this hydro guarding. As we do not need to interact anymore. we can do all by ourself with an army of characters.

 

edit:

 

5gc fe is nuts these days

 

it had a reason why fe was 3gc in the past. keeping and insinsting on overprized fe will not aid sales when you are a new player... Less demands should reduce price as in any market.

 

Just mix what you need, when you stockpile 60k of crap it is your problem when you do not have a use for 60k fe for example.

Edited by roman_gruber

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Generally I don't see the market of FE/ iron bars affected by this much. I agree that s2e price got affected. Steel bars lowered 5gc each but still thats not too much. Iron bars are still more or less 50gc/ea. Using the iron bars for other skills like engineering where they are heavily used still keeps the economy for making them. Regarding FEs I have known them for 5gc ever since i played (yeah im not one of those 10 years players ;) ).

 

 


5gc fe is nuts these days

 

it had a reason why fe was 3gc in the past. keeping and insinsting on overprized fe will not aid sales when you are a new player... Less demands should reduce price as in any market.

 

Why is 5gc nuts? If your a low level player u can sell FE for good money. If you need FE as low level player you can easily mix for yourself. If your a high level player and can't be bothered to mix FEs, then just buy them ;) Farming the money from mobs to afford the FEs shouldn't be a problem for higher level players.

 

@ vino yes my calculation didn't consider some costs. I agree that you would need some more items running hydro than u needed back when NH was campig hydro path. But 5 Invis spells is a bit too much i think. Also one would either let a high level mix the bars or /and wait for recycle to cover any potential crits. Nevertheless I agree that there is a situation now where players prefer not to run anymore but rather buy from npc.

 

I also strongly doubt that stivy "are" camping hydro path for radu. I rather think they do it because they can. They do it for the pure fact that they have some impact on the game.

 

Again I don't think that the economy got affected by it that much as some might point it out. 5gc less per bar isnt much, npc's buy for 35gc ;) so we still can sell them for better.

 

Will there be any chance soon? We don't know but I strongly assume that stivy will continue to block that path to the best they can. I also know that there are high level players that can kill stivy/uzb and are able to clear the path for the rest of the community but if they can't be bothered I guess the rest of the 90% of EL community has to go and buy from npc. (Isn't bad either, takes out money out of game).

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so what benfits do pro fighters get for removing hs to go red drag or hydro cave if the market will just rise for se2 and iron ore btw im not hs but dont see why i need to go there at the moment unless it helps the community and they dont seem to care ?

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In my opinion it isn't worth to go there at all if you have a good fihter character(s), find/kill rare items/monsters in the game or just able to farm something worthwhile at all. It hurts the people whose main activity in the game is harvesting/mixing (i mean the non $$$ stuff ofc), but the fighters are not hurt at all. An average high level fighter gets who bothers to run around with TS and is above, say 135 a/d, gets on average ~40-50k gc each time he successfully finds an invisible dragon. Sure, they might not get it every time, but it's a pretty simple process, and takes a hell of a lot less time than harvesting. Also it's pretty much common knowledge at this point, that a lot/most of the "pro" fighters have a bunch of alts, and guess what, they instance each and every one of them. The more wealthy $$$ players even have 3-4 wtf instance alts. That is a more fun, quicker way to get more gc than hydro running.

 

About the route I would add that stivy/pkers aside, it's a pretty long/annoying route for 3 hydro bars anyway.

 

"OLD Rule 5 removal killed the game more as this hydro guarding. As we do not need to interact anymore. we can do all by ourself with an army of characters."

 

I absolutely agree with that.

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:P You need 1 invisibility spell or potion at watermaze enterance, where rediska is sitting with tunic of the ninja, and camo cape. one inside it, at the end, where often uzb sits also almost invisible to see who is tele to range over the ice maze to shortcut it. You need 1 in the fluffy cave, because the spot has also dark place where someone with camo cape and tunic of ninja can hide so you will not see it. you need 2 after fulffy cave to get to the cave before fire maze and 2 in the fire maze. Just to be sure you went undetected. unless he has true sight on.

 

thats 6 pots of invisiblity or spells per run.

 

I did do hydro runs on no drop day, and with my limited pk skills fought stivy now and then. sometimes managing to flee often enough to get to save place for restock mana sometimes not. all in All i got amazing 300 hydro ores. out of s2e's i had long stocked up. but the cost of each run was far more then 5kgc, and i only count he srs emp ghp diss rings and needed essences.

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Littlebro, I wouldn't doubt for an instant that there is some sort of compensation going on for stivy blocking the run 24/7

 

To sum it up, nothing is going to change as long as stivy collects bricks for radu. Stop making runs, stop giving stivy a reason to be there and maybe things would change.

 

 

@.@

So, I am paying Stivy a percentage of the bricks, or what?

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Littlebro, I wouldn't doubt for an instant that there is some sort of compensation going on for stivy blocking the run 24/7

 

To sum it up, nothing is going to change as long as stivy collects bricks for radu. Stop making runs, stop giving stivy a reason to be there and maybe things would change.

 

 

@.@

So, I am paying Stivy a percentage of the bricks, or what?

 

 

 

I don't know, you tell me why someone would spend 24/7 month after month collecting bricks for you with 0 compensation? Then have Stivy brag on the forums how many bricks he's collected for you and if you don't carry a brick, you're a cheapass. Doesn't make sense to me. New Hope found plenty of ways to effect this game outside of blockading the hydro run. Maybe I'm just a cynic.

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with 0 compensation

It is highest cost for any EL player unselfish service to teh god! You as moderator have to know it ;)

 

Btw: fun and pk-experience have higher cost, too.

Edited by kapbepucm

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I have to add, if he extorted a fee to pass from people that would at least make some sense. He doesn't even do that much. It's your game, so you do what you want. I just say goodbye to all the people that have left.

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Yes, it's very strange a guy (or several guys making turns) spend the 24 hours, seven days every week for blockading a resource without an obvious gain. What he gains burning another players' rostos? :inquisitive:

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