Newbies and The Cooldown

[Beorn]

I have a few suggestions about things that were brought to my attention by a good friend:

 

First of all there needs to be something more at The Wraith most newbies don't get past the Tutorial NPC. We need to get some NHs there again to help them. I have been sitting there helping them and they seem to need it even with the NPC. If you are short on NHs I see plenty of people in channel one that would be good for the job. They need better grammar...but they would be good. There used to be mods at The Wraith and Beam always helping. Maybe we could even bring back the newbie island and have NPCs set up to have them do less complex little quests to get to know the game a little better.

 

Ok next subject is the usually untouchable one, the cooldown. A lot of people that loved this game dearly quit over it. I never complained because I love the game so much that I was scared to speak out because I thought I might get banned or suspended. I suggest that we keep the cooldown but tweak it a bit more so we can use fruits and vegetables again. Maybe have fruits and vegetables set up so that we can click them two or three times then they cooldown. That would be a great thing to do, because the feasting potions are a hassle. I spoke with one of the programmers and he said that it is possible. Don't get me wrong I am not complaining about the cooldown I am just making a suggestion about it.

 

Please take these sugggestions into mind.

 

Thank you.

-Beorn

[MagpieLee]

For the most part Beorn I agree with your ideas. Especially on the cooldown for fruits/vegs.

[KibblesAndBits]

I also agree

[AmberGal]

I agree on both, completely, especially cooldown! I wish cooldown was modified or taken out of the game completely... It is too bad that people quit over it.

 

It's very rewarding running around IP and/or beam, and helping on Ch 1, too! I agree about having the complex quests to help players get to know the game, too. I learned most of the things that I know from very helpful players, not the Tutorial NPC.

[Zaer]

lol, surely it is a very sad community where people are scared to voice their opinions.

 

I agree with both ideas, newbie island was pwnage, even though i was stuck there for like half a day

Maybe just take down the cooldown of veg or fruit, not both. They need to be useful in making things again, instead of useful for nothing -_-

[Earl]

I tried and tried to help but it's no good, my answers were intentionally ambiguous and quite often I'd give a second best answer just because it's not the same as all the first best answers that three or four people would say immediately. Anyway, nobody liked that.

 

The final straw was when someone asked about an obscure NPC, and I answered. I got an annoyed PM telling me now to give quest help. How was I to know it was a quest? If anything I'm the one who it's spoilt for by being told it's a quest.

 

 

On cooldown, there is a way that fruits are very useful in alchemy and that's in bars. For example if I go to the mines to make 30 steel bars I take a mere 4 feasting potions and a pile of fruit, by careful timing on harvesting and cooldown counter you can get away with this, the aim is to always have the countdown going at all times.

 

Unfortunately the tactic doesn't work very well for essences as they are resource light in the mines, never more than 2 silver, one emerald etc... It would be nice to see this turned around so essences were easier to supplement with fruits or veg but still needing a few feasting pots. Feasting pots could be the extra cot for mixing at the storage (where resources aren't on a timer).

[trollson]

The final straw was when someone asked about an obscure NPC, and I answered. I got an annoyed PM telling me now to give quest help. How was I to know it was a quest? If anything I'm the one who it's spoilt for by being told it's a quest.

Thats counter productive. You did the right thing.

[Hazor]

lol, surely it is a very sad community where people are scared to voice their opinions.

 

I agree with both ideas, newbie island was pwnage, even though i was stuck there for like half a day

A lot of people were getting stuck there simply because they couldn't figure out how to use the cave entrance, or the boat, even though Raven explained it. If the newbie area is brought back, it needs to be a bit larger(more open but still impossible to get lost in), and make use of more NPCs, maybe even one or two to look pretty and talk a bit about useless things; for ambience.

At the very least, Tutorial NPC needs to be made simpler..

[LordGordon]

One of the big bugs with the newbies is the quest log; most of them are coming in and having to talk to the tutorial npc severla times before they understand everything, they don't realise the quest log tracks the most recent entries, unfortunately, by doing so the quest log gets screwed up and you can't make heads or tails of it, mine right now looks like giberish because I've had 3 different people play on this computer and my quest log didn't seem to differentiate between the accounts.

 

I never experienced newbie island but it sounds like a good idea, the people I have talked to about it said they had fun there, maybe if it was brought back it might make all the difference.

[Vanyel]

Plenty of people in both channel 1 and 2 and so few at Wraith, Tutorian NPC and beam. Why?

More quests that are to explain the game most common problems are coming, including Tutorials, like ones that already are in game. I agree completely, that Tutorial NPC and quest given by it are a bit... ummm... boring? Also quest log is a mess. I think all these things will be worked out at some point, we just have to give our developers some time. What I find a bit difficult with the quest logs kept in way they're atm is the fact that majority of players have English as a second/third language, so reading through mass of text is really difficult for them (including myself).

Can't comment Newbie Island, never seen it working.

I'm all ok with cooldown for fruits (don't use vegetables at all). Can do pretty well on them while doing fire essences or water essences. Don't mind tweaking it a bit, though

The Quest NPC in channel 1. It's decided to keep quest help off the channel 1. There are some NPC that has NO other usage (at the moment) than quests, mrs. Lorpack, Adnama (or w/e her name is), Tobias, mayor of Coren, mayor of Portland, some others. All questions about their locations shall not be answered in channel, but if you really want to give answer in PM so other people in channel do not get unwanted hint. NPC like Victor, Ilitli (again, w/e her name is) have other functions than just quest NPC, their locations can be freely given in channel 1. If you're not sure if certain NPC should be talked in channel 1, take it to PMs. Easy way to avoid being yelled at.

Regards,

Gil

Edited August 16, 2006 by Gilean

[kat]

i agree with the tweaking of vegies or fruits. They don't have much of a use in-game anymore, except to some fighters who do not make their SR's while training, in which i have a feeling not many fighters do anymore

 

as for newbie island, i think it would be kinda nice to bring it back again. Make the quests involve going inside places, talking with other npc's, them having to go buy something and give whatever it is to an npc, just to give them the idea of the game.

But, as from what Gilean is saying, i guess we'll just have to wait a little while

something a bit better and easier will be coming

[Aki]

Thank you for opening this thread Beorn. I agree with all of your points.

We need the Newbie Helpers back because that was the greatest thing the game used to have. We need them back also because the first moments for a player should be fun and not this very unpersonal reading of an NPC's message, like it is now. If i join a game I want anything other than reading a lot of text.

There should be an easier way to show newbies basic information about the game. Less text and less information that you won't need in your first hours, more fun and entertaining learning. It would be also usefull to highlight objects, not everybody knows that you can click on rocks, flowers, etc. So if a quest requires harvesting flowers it should point to the flowers in a visual way.

Newbie Island needs to be brought back but in a different easier way. Although it was supposed to help newbies it didn't really..people had trouble finishing it, finding the archway, and things like that. If you're still having trouble finding newbie helpers, there areplenty of people who are willing to help although they haven't experienced the newbie helping thing on themselves. It should be enough to give them the ability to see messages from god to see the names of the new people joining the game. A channel for them to chat, if it's a NH guild or #NH channel would be helpfull too.

This team of newbie helpers could also help with new ideas to help newbies find things in the game since newbie helpers are the first who notice what newbies have trouble with.

Thanks for reading.

 

~Aki

Edited August 17, 2006 by Aki

[Aislinn]

About the newbie helper/newbie island comments:

 

1. This has already been discussed in depth and Radu has already decided that he does not want Newbie Island back. So unless something drastic happens to change his mind, I wouldn't keep hoping for that.

 

2. There also were plans for a new special NH group, very close to the idea Aki layed out. They were going to have a channel to talk and their entire reason for being would have been to be at beam and wraith and wherever else newbies needed help. However, this also was ultimately decided against by Radu. I'm sorry but again, unless something drastic happens to change his mind, this will not happen either.

[Placid]

I'd like to point out that there is nearly ALWAYS a Moderator/NH at beam, and similarly at The Wraith. I spend quite a bit of time in both places myself - sometimes, it's just bad timing that a newbie is not greeted or in the vicinity of a moderator or NH.

[MagpieLee]

When cooldown was implemented, there was talk that some cooldown times would be adjusted for the wider community but I don't think that happened...

[The_Knight]

Ill volunteer as newbie helper.

we all used to be newbs and I loved it when people went out of thier way to help me. I want to do that to newbs. I like helping other when I can

 

,Knight

 

Ohhh... I like the idea of the cooldown thing too, maybe not that we need a shorter cool down, but like beorn said you could be able to click a veg or fruit a couple of time before it goes into cooldown.

[Beorn]

I'd like to point out that there is nearly ALWAYS a Moderator/NH at beam, and similarly at The Wraith. I spend quite a bit of time in both places myself - sometimes, it's just bad timing that a newbie is not greeted or in the vicinity of a moderator or NH.

 

I have sat at the wraith for the past two and the only mod I seen was Tanyia and I asked her to come while I went afk to get stuff to eat. So, I don't think there is always a mod at the wraith. There is usually an afk one sitting around the fire at beam though.

 

*edit*

When I logged on today I seen anti at the wraith.

Edited August 17, 2006 by Beorn

[sirdan]

lol, surely it is a very sad community where people are scared to voice their opinions.

 

its better to be feared then loved... i think like one of those people who wanted to rule the world said that...

 

There is usually an afk one sitting around the fire at beam though.

note the word AFK

 

yeah ur ideas are really good we would have more players if they knew how to play

[Placid]

I'd like to point out that there is nearly ALWAYS a Moderator/NH at beam, and similarly at The Wraith. I spend quite a bit of time in both places myself - sometimes, it's just bad timing that a newbie is not greeted or in the vicinity of a moderator or NH.

 

I have sat at the wraith for the past two and the only mod I seen was Tanyia and I asked her to come while I went afk to get stuff to eat. So, I don't think there is always a mod at the wraith. There is usually an afk one sitting around the fire at beam though.

 

*edit*

When I logged on today I seen anti at the wraith.

Intriguing, I walked past you sitting by the Snapdragons at beam coming from Wraith only last night...perhaps you're not looking hard enough

 

The other suggestions though, are worth kudos, but Aislinn has pointed out the reasons why they haven't been (re)implemented.

[kl4Uz]

I completely agree with Beorn on the Newbie Helper issue. From time to time I visit the Wraith to give the newbies some help.

 

One of the real problems is that the first quests are too complex. I always need 15 minutes to explain them the very basic game mechanics before they can do the quests on their own.

 

A good first steps and basic game mechanics guide (e.g. on EL.com) would be very usefull to get started and we could at least give newbies the link. Additionally there should be some very easy, less boring and short tutorial quests. Why do they have to find 5 plants for example? Make find two plants that are next to an interesting place (beam for example). That way a newbie has both an early and easy success and gets to know a usefull place.

 

To Entropy: Are there any special reasons why you want neither a NH group nor some sort of newbie Island? In my very humble opinion both (or something similar) would help to get EL new and more players way more then all the spam about voting for EL on some internet site.

Edited August 17, 2006 by kl4Uz

[ttlanhil]

IMO opinion, tut NPC is part of the problem... most players will know that it's someone to talk to, though not all... and it shouldn't take that long to figure out how to talk to him... more importantly, the intro to moving around and doing stuff is tied up with interface, etc

an 'offline' tutorial (like how char creation is done) that covers the interface, talking to NPCs, fighting (no XP, of course, but show them how to chase and click a rabbit), use the map, open help, etc may work better

an advantage to doing it offline is that it'd be able to be set up to know when someone opens the encyc... or better yet, 'next, player, open your encyclopedia to the entry on X. do you want more detail on how?' then when page X is open, they progress

teach interface, then interaction, then go online for tutnpc to do some stuff in the larger world (at this stage, they can be ready to be sent all over IP and into WS)