The Chim Project

[conavar]

hey , after speaking to someone in game this idea came up :

 

would it be possible to use these tokens gathered to do something that REALLY would benefit a large group of players ?

 

Using the tokens to create an NCP that will redeem the tokens for special days ? NDD's , Sun Tzu , Joules Day and so on ?

 

This way, we will know that the tokens used will not go to waste, as there is every chance that even after all this debate the forest chimerans stats are changed somebody else will use tokens to change them back, such as the case with the cocks.

 

I just think its time we got past the negative stuff and instead of jumping other people because you dont like the idea, bringing to the table alternatives that can be discussed and decided upon, whilst still keeping the sentiment of a group of EL players using these invasion tokens to bring about changes into the game that are worthwhile.

 

Hows that sound ?

 

*edit* changed my underwear after the post to suit the moment better

 

Would be more of a "good for the community" project.

 

and to save having 20 NDD's or sun tzu in a row, all the days could have to be used before one can be repeated..

[Cruella]

So far we know that Radu accepts tokens for:

 

- moving creatures around

- changing chims stats / spawn time

 

unless we learn that it is possible to change other game aspects with tokens, this is not realistic proposal.

 

That's why I suggest to get Radu's clearence first, before proposing anything. When this is successfully accomplished, let's discuss it.

[LochnessLobster]

I voted no. This would likely be used by just one who would take all the chim spawns from a large map to themselves. i would however like to see some maps change to single combat (ie. bethel) just my oppinion.

[Gohan]

<Aislinn>

I just don't think you have the right to speak for the community as to what it wants or what is right for it.

Fine. Do you see anyone else doing this, Aislinn? I don't. Also, who the FUCK has the right, then? Not *no one*..........*everyone* does because we are ALL part of the EL community.

 

Just my opinion, but unless I tell you you can post for me because I am part of this community, if you ever dare post something for the community, I will pm you stating that you will need to edit to:

 

The whole community, except for the following person/people: Gohan

 

I think it wouldn't be very right to just come up and say:

 

Oh hi, I r some random person you don't know but I have a good idea and assume you'll all agree so here's for the community .. <your idea>

 

Here is the challenge, in my view, and as I have spoken at length with Asgnny, I think he will echo it for the a/d trainers higher than my level as well.

 

As you increase in a/d, the amount of experience to gain levels increases, but at a certain point in your progression, your ability to increase your hourly training experience begins to decrease. For instance, my next a/d level are far less total experience to achieve than are Asgnny's; however, I can make more experience per hour than can Asgnny. This leads to demotivation for higher level a/d trainers to continue their training--maybe this is Radu's intent, I'm not sure.

 

Pain on your road to power, sounds fair enough to me, noone is forcing you to hog spawns for endless hours anyway, you can always just say "No" and stop training whenever you want.

Why would we want everyone to keep leveling anyway.. at some point, it has to stop and other aspects of the game should get some of the attention they deserve.

 

-Gohan

[Ozmondius]

Edit: No response necessary

Edited September 11, 2008 by Ozmondius

[Ateh]

Just my opinion, but unless I tell you you can post for me because I am part of this community, if you ever dare post something for the community, I will pm you stating that you will need to edit to:

 

The whole community, except for the following person/people: Gohan

 

Ok so next time something gets changed we dont want to see you , or the chip on your shoulder post anything then Gohan, because your not a part of the so called community so we have every right to tell you to stfu in the future ?

 

Thanks

 

And by the way, I think if you can look past your own enjoyment of being Mr Nasty doesnt give a shit, you will realise that Aislar was simply meaning everyones got the right to consider themselves part of EL ''community'' , whatever the hell the community means. She wasnt trying to speak for you, other than to give you the right to speak for yourself.

 

Were actually getting somewhere here, people are being given the chance to use invasion tokens for a common purpose, even if it means the stats on chims dont get changed im sure something else will be agreed upon. But your not part of the community gohan, so no point posting in here again is there ?

 

*edit* ive really tried to keep out of the crap in these invasion tokens topics, but here I couldnt help myself. Sorry

Edited September 11, 2008 by Ateh

[popeye]

Im still in support of this idea, if it was such a bad idea then teh god would not have given a specific number of tokens needed and neither would the stats of the chims have been put on the table in the first place, by teh god himself.

 

Its a shame once again that somebody attempts to help in these forums and instead of discussing possibilities in a decent way , people begin proclaiming themselves community haters, call names and accuse the person trying to help of not knowing what the community wants.

 

I will tell you what the community wants It wants a big stick to beat itself over the head with, it wants flame wars, it wants you to know its been playing longer than you, it wants you to bow down and lick the boots of non existent consensus.

 

The community wants a good , long , hard and sweaty session of complaining because thier skill is the hardest. The community is made up of all of us obviously, but you wouldnt bloody know it from reading these forums.

 

So the change will benefit some chim trainers ? Good , it will also benefit the triccle down market on HE SRS and armors, as more and more items are consumed.

 

If it doesnt affect your game , then why the hell do you automatically want to vote no ? Or is this another community rule that so far i have been unaware of?

 

This almost looks like a post from Timmay!!!! *edit: I'm sorry Timmay's posts are wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy longer then this.

 

I vote no.

Edited September 12, 2008 by popeye

[asgnny]

Voted no, twice.

 

I don't feel like making a 27 page post, so feel free to PM me with any questions on my reasoning, if the others posted in this thread are unsatisfactory.

[Atlantis]

Basically, its pointless. At the end of the day, there will be a tradeoff. Either

a. Everyone will level easier, therefore there will be no benefit to making them more trainable.

b. Something else will be changed that compensates for the easier leveling.

[Ateh]

well at least people are expressing thier opinions on it, you cant fault anyone for that. thats the purpose of the poll i suppose and it looks like no more people have been pointed in this direction , the No votes are winning.

 

personally i really dont mind either way, its just refreshing to see someone even attempt to co-ordinate a group of EL players towards a common goal.

 

Question still remains : would it be possible to exchange a certain number of invasion tokens to put an NCP in game who would give special days in return for tokens ?

 

*edit* realised the no votes are winning

Edited September 12, 2008 by Ateh

[robotbob]

I voted no twice. I also have the same opinions in regards to the mythical community.

[i agree with BadFlip,LochnessLobster and both are long experienced chim fighters]

 

[random thoughts, non contigous forgive me]

I like my monsters tough to fight, everything ingame doesn't have to be like fluffies.

I can't see softening the chims, so I can bitch slap 'em for hours, a very exciting prospect.

(From a game enjoyment POV)

 

Truly, we talking about changing them so 4-7 people can get multi'd in RoT and get uber

experience? I'm an experienced PvE so I can see the obvious bullshit under the benevolence for the

mythical community. Dumbing down 2 monsters so a small minority can 'own' pk faster, what about

bored PvEs? If the MC\FCs get weakened, then my community of one, wants more ACs in doze-able

non pk areas, pl0x.

 

As much as I would like a system that would let me get massive [ATTACK] exp, I can't image playing

a game, where ALL the PvE was boxing for hours. I would vote to use the tokens for Boss type

monsters(Really Giant pissed off Spider ), or a nasty Hellhound style chim (woof ) 'tween MC and AC.

 

I personally just like to play the game and not:

(exp * my spreadsheet skillz / my over-analyzing a game) + my-notions-of-trainable = needs an intervention

 

Don't get me wrong, I totally empathize with wanting more attack experience.

 

But really, if its not about fun anymore, vote for an EXP NPC we can trade tokens too. 1 token = 500k exp

in a skill of your choosing. Personally I rather see across the board, the experience gaining system altered to

promote fighting monsters with weapons more appealing. The games great swords and such

should not be only limited to PK and posing.

[Siarato]

Voted no for both

 

Don't have time to write epic post with all my reasons so if your really interested to know why then pm me ingame

[SweetThang]

Voted NO on both thats all im saying

[Gohan]

[PM from Gossip: xxx asked me to give you a message:]

[PM from Gossip: xxx said: *bows to his forum post* \o/ nice ]

 

State as you wish Ateh, but here you go, I'm not alone in my opinion, I guess all of us are just a bunch of nasty people who are complete assholes and not willing to help the community.

 

 

But to try and avoid flames, here's to your project. (+ new suggestion, but I don't have time to properly think something out.)

 

 

I don't think I would mind to help the community if it looks good. In a wide guess, this project would take a LOT of tokens and for who.. or for what.. as some people said maybe 4-7 people who will afterwards be able to multi train in RoT for uber exp per hour, sorry doesn't sound like something I wanna help out with, despite I could fall into those 4-7 people who could make use of it.

 

(Not to mention, your waste in tokens when someone with a LOT of gc simply reverts your changes.)

 

Why don't you think out a project where we really help out the community, like start something for the newbies, damn, I'll help you with that, no problem. Because they are our "future" anyway. In fact, that's where you really help the community, because that's the base of it.

We all started as newbies and if we were welcomed properly and got in a good guild, blabla, we all grow out to be good players.

 

So why don't you think out something there and I'm sure you'll get even more help than you would on this project.

(Why more help? Because we all luv newbies, even me, ask Elveron. )

 

-Gohan

[Sayre]

Voted no to both. Far better uses to put a few tokens than to help a handful of people train better on chims. Aren't I an anti-community minded bastard?

 

And Cruella, I think we all know this thread is a direct result of the perceived "anti-community" move that someone with tokens was well within their rights to do, without heed to the feckless cries of a pack of ease-seeking harvesters and mixers. As such, I see this thread as a continuation of the thread Ateh started, in which you and others labeled people as anti-community for choosing to spend their tokens in a way they saw fit. I don't see how the fact that you haven't labeled anyone as such (overtly) in this thread as relevant.

 

*Goes back to mining in his cave where dragons that ignore MM spawn occasionally, surrounded by a map with Cockatrices and a hungry AI cat* <--maybe I should start a thread :/

 

S.

[Cruella]

If so many players are disagreeing with the chim changes...what other changes do you feel would help the 'community'? (If, of course, you have the 'right' to speak for the community). What changes could we make for the better of the community regarding creature changes? More fluffs? Stat changes for other creatures that more players train on?

 

Good question !

 

With limitations set by Radu in mind, what do you all suggest then (please try to be as specific as possible though and come up with a clear and measureable goal rather than general statement)?

[Dilly]

nevermind

*goes off to a corner and shuts her gob*

Edited September 12, 2008 by dilloesional

[conavar]

. i would however like to see some maps change to single combat (ie. bethel) just my oppinion.

 

*On a chim thread so will comment on chims*

 

I agree that for pure training purposes of both players today and players in the future, making some maps non-multi would help to ease alot of spawn congestion.

Personally I would leave bethel multi, it is small enough so that those that want to multi can (dont want to totally bugger them up), and change Melinis to single combat and Melinis is also large enough that other DC spawns could then be added.

Adding more mchim and a few fchim to GP would also help alot (as the average a/d of players is growing all the time)

 

Maybe just maybe reducing spawn time a bit would really help ,but not down to fluff/feros level thats stupid

 

@ Robotbob

 

I 100% agree, myself personally I would love to see more monster to fight rather than just train, Leo was a great step forward in this respect and more creatures like that would be a major boost to the game (and no not all have to be aggressive,try hunting a shy version of leo )

 

But any changes such as this should be made by the boss not by us players.

 

 

Tokens: not sure what the best use for them are past a "special day npc" but if anyone has any idea's that would benifit the whole community then count me in

 

Can the people that are SOOOOO opposed to this idea, and that obviously know BETTER what is best for 'the community' then please speak up and come up with a constructive proposal that they do seem fit for a larger part of the community?

 

Dilly <3 <3

 

Sorry to say that kinda implies that those who are for the idea know whats best for the community, and those of us who voted no havent a clue what we are on about.

 

And yes I commend cruella for trying to do something, right idea wrong project thats all

Edited September 12, 2008 by conavar

[Cruella]

Can the people that are SOOOOO /snap/

 

I appreeciate your support very much but please ... stay on topic. I don't give a shit about what people say here about me, all I care is what they say about the substance of the project.

 

As long as changing me with a use of invasion tokens is not possible, discussing my outlook and personality here leads to nowhere.

 

So again, if you have any ideas better than changing chims - please share them !

[Aislinn]

If so many players are disagreeing with the chim changes...what other changes do you feel would help the 'community'? (If, of course, you have the 'right' to speak for the community). What changes could we make for the better of the community regarding creature changes? More fluffs? Stat changes for other creatures that more players train on?

 

Good question !

 

With limitations set by Radu in mind, what do you all suggest then (please try to be as specific as possible though and come up with a clear and measureable goal rather than general statement)?

No, it's not a good question. You both are acting like something NEEDS to be done at all. Why does anybody have to suggest anything? You are not Radu who is making a game change and needs input.

[Cruella]

Does "please" equals "have to" ?

 

If this is not a good question for you, you are not forced to reply

 

I'm definitely not Radu and never wanted to be one, what about you?

 

I'm trying to put a tool Radu has given us all into good use. It doesn't NEED to be done, but some people WANT to do something, because we believe we can achieve more with combined effort rather than spending tokens individually.

 

Back to topic please.

[Aislinn]

Does "please" equals "have to" ?

 

If this is not a good question for you, you are not forced to reply

 

I'm definitely not Radu and never wanted to be one, what about you?

 

I'm trying to put a tool Radu has given us all into good use. It doesn't NEED to be done, but some people WANT to do something, because we believe we can achieve more with combined effort rather than spending tokens individually.

 

Back to topic please.

Thank you moderator Cruella.

You are insisting that if people vote no, they come up with something better. Nobody needs to come up with something "better". Some may like it just fine as it is.

Please read what I say, you are more than welcome to get a group together to use tokens to change something but you really need to stop insulting people who don't and you really need to stop acting like the sky is falling. Nobody is obligated to vote no AND provide an alternative.

And stop using the word force, you are the only one who has said that. I never said forced, I said bullied and guilted. That is not force, that is more like emotional blackmail.

[Cruella]

Does "please" equals "have to" ?

 

If this is not a good question for you, you are not forced to reply

 

I'm definitely not Radu and never wanted to be one, what about you?

 

I'm trying to put a tool Radu has given us all into good use. It doesn't NEED to be done, but some people WANT to do something, because we believe we can achieve more with combined effort rather than spending tokens individually.

 

Back to topic please.

Thank you moderator Cruella.

You are insisting that if people vote no, they come up with something better. Nobody needs to come up with something "better". Some may like it just fine as it is.

Please read what I say, you are more than welcome to get a group together to use tokens to change something but you really need to stop insulting people who don't and you really need to stop acting like the sky is falling. Nobody is obligated to vote no AND provide an alternative.

And stop using the word force, you are the only one who has said that. I never said forced, I said bullied and guilted. That is not force, that is more like emotional blackmail.

 

Thank you moderator Aislinn

 

I'm not insisting, I'm asking for better proposals.

 

Nobody needs to come up with something "better". Some may like it just fine as it is.

 

Agreed.

 

Nobody is obligated to vote no AND provide an alternative.

 

Agreed.

 

How many times shall I repeat that for you to be understood?

 

Now, back to the topic, we don't want to violate rule 8, don't we?

[Gohan]

Good question !

 

With limitations set by Radu in mind, what do you all suggest then (please try to be as specific as possible though and come up with a clear and measureable goal rather than general statement)?

 

Sorry for you, but I really don't have time to spend to make a big idea just for you and your so dearly wanted changes. I am personally fine with the game and I don't think we need any creatures changed, or anything else for that matter. And I am not willing to agree with any plans on spending tokens/time in making the game better for some people who have to cry about not being able to train properly because they are going to need a sto run every second hour rather than being able to stay there for 20k hours.

 

As I said, make an idea to support newbies, that sounds, to me, way better, as they make the base of the game and will be making our warm fur gloves when we're all 178 a/d and freezing our ass off in Hulda. Or in other words, we need em as a future, for EL in general, no game remains if only pr0s are around and no newbies.

 

But think up something of your own, I do not have time to spend right now to think out a very detailed idea on this. I am looking for a job, take evening classes, get a lot of chores around the house fired at me, other activities, blabla.

But I'm sure you can make up a good, or an even better idea than I would anyhow.

 

Last note: Good game, you're asking a detailed new proposal while you're making a topic on chims that you don't know shit about or have no idea what's going on and refer to "this other guy will tell us what's needed". Yay, that looks so fantastic.

 

-Gohan

 

Sorry for the post ending halfway, I somehow pressed tab+enter halfway typing. :s

Edited September 12, 2008 by Gohan

[Cruella]

Gohan, the reasons the chim thing has been chosen were:

 

- it has been suggested a number of times

- it has already been backed up with calculations and nice essay explaining details

- it was following Radu's suggestion to spend tokens on chim stats change

- it was not written by me, to avoid accusations that I'm starting that for my own benefit

- it seemed a lot of a/d players were interested in this idea and were begging for it to be done for months

 

Now, I can come up with another project easily, however under current circumstances it doesn't make sense since as we can all see some people do not want this to succeed only because it was me, not other person who started this thread. An essence of a project means nothing to them, all they want is for me to fail. I appreciate that and I feel honoured lol but admit that submitting own proposal having Aislinn's cavalry against me, prolly no matter I suggest, is pointless, and I'm pragmatic and similarly to you, do not waste time for nothing.

 

Just to make it clear - I respect each and every person who said no to this project because they like the game to stay unchanged, or chims to stay unchanged, and especilly to those who explained why we should not change chims stats. Thanks for constructive feedback.

Edited September 12, 2008 by Cruella