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Orick

pulled out of an invance

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so, he is unable to kill something without a weapon? he is unable to contribute AT ALL, without a weapon? that is your logic?

 

actually...lets not say "HE"...lets say, "someone" Someone cannot contribute without a weapon?

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Invances were not made to train. Just like instances weren't. Radu had to make chances to instances that effected everyone because a few wanted to abuse them to train. He broke the rules...period.

 

*They broke the rules...period.

Edited by Zenphon

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I'll answer my own question, since you lack the courage to follow your statement, or the humility to recant it. Yes, someone can contribute. In fact, they could probably contribute to a win more than someone with a weapon depending on their stats, etc. But, oh, you don't want them breaking the rules.....as I am sure you never break the rules...or overlook someone who does break the rules...

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lol, many other people go to invances wearing armor/weaps for break quest (maybe a third or so in 120+), and i'm sure orick was being more helpful than most of the people in the invance...

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And as far as Orick goes, I am not for sure if he broke any rule. I have not seen any rule that he has broke. Aislinn put it so eloquently, "Personally I could care less what people wear. It's not my decision"

 

That must mean its someone else's decision....and that possibly aislinn misinterpreted the rules...

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I did not flame you, so do not flame me. All I am saying is this: they broke the rules. The rules are there for a reason. I know you may not like it, but Radu does not have to explain the reason for every rule. There are some I do not like either, but as an adult, I follow them.

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First of all....you DID 'flame' me....second, where is the rule that says, "you must have an equipped weapon?" The rules for the invance are vague......probably for a reason.....i don't know Radu for sh!+ , but my logical guess is that he made the rules to keep people from taking advantage of the situation...sitting around, hiding, etc.....I think tanking 8 mobs at a time isn't exactly taking advantage of the invance.....and, i have seen orick tanking a flock of chickens for hours...so, please clarify the rules for me, and describe how he isn't contributing to a win? i would love to have him in an invance with me...

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people care what other people wear for armor because it effects the team. someone in augs or other low lvl armor can't take a beating for as long as someone in full dragon armor. in low lvl armor you can't help to your full potential.

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Viperwitch, that is the smartest post i have read all night. And, i agree with you. Also, ty for not throwing a childish remark at me like some others ;)

Ofc, look at my profile and see age :)

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The point is not to fight a flock of chickens for hours, but to kill them asap. That way you can help others instead of get your defense exp.

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Nova, you have a good point. I could not possibly tank a giant without dragon armor, etc. But, can someone like orick? Also, something that has always bothered me is: Why must someone achieve what another achieves in the invance? Or, to put it plainly: Why does someone have to contribute as much as 'everyone else?' I watch malemeo tank everything that comes his way...probably uses craploads of HE's....hardly ever runs away...does everyone do that? i watch zephlix shoot hundreds, maybe thousands of arrows....do all the archers have to do that? Why does everyone feel the need to make others match them? (just for clarification, I am not saying that either malemeo or zephlix expect more from people...I am only using their contribution as an example)

 

Zenphon, your points are becoming difficult to.....bonify...im gonna have to stay away from a response to them....sorry....

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You answered yourself calif. Why should malemo tank everything, and zephlix use all those arrows, while someone is on the same 8 chickens the entire invance?

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Allright...i cant help myself...ill respond to it....lol......Yo, dude, like, i don't tink he would be taanking dem chickens for d whole invance....but, maybe, like, i dunno, he would kill a few a dem...like, ya know whut i mean, dude?

 

If he's a 70 something in att, i think his primary role IS to tank...i dont' think an eagle wing would help the fight SO MUCH MORE....just sayin...

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Ok, now I will refrain from a response. I do not want to make this a flame session. Anyway, I said what I wanted to say.

Edited by Zenphon

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Orick choose to build his toon around a specific skill (def) and did a good job at it. It is in fact so good, that the best possible armor he could wear from our invanceteam point of view is indeed without a plate. In fact, if he was in full dragon, I would think twice of attacking the monster and helping him. Let me clarify this with an example of a nasp:

 

Situation: Orick in full dragon, Faxie in full dragon (110/111/36/48/20/4/16/20 a/d/p/c/r/w/i/v)

 

If Orick starts the fight and I come in , Nasp will switch to me and I tank. I would have to switch to a low damage weapon (SOP) to stay alive. Orick only crits most the time so we would have a long fight. During this time we cannot help any other people.

 

Situation Orick without plate, Faxie in full dragon:

 

Orick starts fight, cause it won't switch to me, I would switch to highest dam I can do (r2 + fa). Nasp dies fast and we are ready to help other people.

 

So if he was indeed pulled out because of his armor choice, I have to disagree with the mod decision.

 

Looking at the first part of the post however, I can imagine Orick being pulled out because of that. Tanking 8 FCW without a fighter present to kill them is not helping the team. Even if you comply to the rules and carry a weapon. I think you know you won't hit a lot with a -2 accuracy weapon and no accu, coord, reason pots.

 

So if I was a mod, I would make the following deal with you:

 

Yes, you are allowed to not wear plate in invances because it helps the team more than you wearing plate. As a consequence, if you are soloing, you'd have to use a high accu weapon (JS/Cutty) and use pots to be able to hit and kill the monsters.

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Orick choose to build his toon around a specific skill (def) and did a good job at it. It is in fact so good, that the best possible armor he could wear from our invanceteam point of view is indeed without a plate. In fact, if he was in full dragon, I would think twice of attacking the monster and helping him. Let me clarify this with an example of a nasp:

 

Situation: Orick in full dragon, Faxie in full dragon (110/111/36/48/20/4/16/20 a/d/p/c/r/w/i/v)

 

If Orick starts the fight and I come in , Nasp will switch to me and I tank. I would have to switch to a low damage weapon (SOP) to stay alive. Orick only crits most the time so we would have a long fight. During this time we cannot help any other people.

 

Situation Orick without plate, Faxie in full dragon:

 

Orick starts fight, cause it won't switch to me, I would switch to highest dam I can do (r2 + fa). Nasp dies fast and we are ready to help other people.

 

So if he was indeed pulled out because of his armor choice, I have to disagree with the mod decision.

 

Looking at the first part of the post however, I can imagine Orick being pulled out because of that. Tanking 8 FCW without a fighter present to kill them is not helping the team. Even if you comply to the rules and carry a weapon. I think you know you won't hit a lot with a -2 accuracy weapon and no accu, coord, reason pots.

 

So if I was a mod, I would make the following deal with you:

 

Yes, you are allowed to not wear plate in invances because it helps the team more than you wearing plate. As a consequence, if you are soloing, you'd have to use a high accu weapon (JS/Cutty) and use pots to be able to hit and kill the monsters.

 

Finally a sensible post in this thread...

 

You are correct - when tanking around others - plate off is a great benefit. But all alone - there is no benefit to the invance in taking it off.

 

If you are the pro tank - you take the heat from the mobs - and the others fighting the same mob do the damage.

 

VW - you state that you go alone in the invance - no worries - you kill the mobs... 60-70 mobs in 10 minutes is a contribution, 7 in 7 minutes is not.

 

The spirit of this rule is that you need to contribute to the invance - it was introduced as some players were entering the invance - going out and returning for the last minute or so and getting the exp for no contribution..... It is because of people abusing the invance concept that the rules were introduced. Admittedly they are not a perfect set of rules - that is because some people will always try and turn this to their advantage and not that of the team.

 

The way to look at this is - if you were in an instance with this person fighting as they do - would you be happy that that person was contributing fairly to it and therefore get a share of the rewards?

I think any sane person here would know that without people around him - Orick was not contributing. If others were around him and killing whilst he tanked then he most definately was helping.

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so, if he isn't helping...then, you are saying that he IS hurting? i mean....basic logic is: if you aren't helping, you are hurting? is that what you are saying? or, are you saying that he isn't helping enough to satisfy you?

 

If you are trying to quote rules to me..or...moderation?? (WTF) then you are missing MY point. If you are saying, that he is not helping enough to satisfy you (which is what it sounds like), then you have that right to complain.....but, you should refer to my post about 'wtf is wrong with you?"

 

and, one more thing....i thought this was a public forum?

 

What kind of crap is this???

The rules are VERY SPECIFIC: "YOU MUST BE HELPING". Did you ever read the rules? If you did, why do you post crap like this here?

Going without a weapon by yourself is not helping. Invances are not to train on monsters, they are to kill them fast.

 

BTW, if I find out that this "lots of people breaking a rule but I am not reporting it" is true, I give you my word I am going to waste my time and implement a command that will give you (and others abusing it) a few K years of invance cooldown.

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so, if he isn't helping...then, you are saying that he IS hurting? i mean....basic logic is: if you aren't helping, you are hurting? is that what you are saying? or, are you saying that he isn't helping enough to satisfy you?

Invance rules clearly say, you MUST be helping - so if he is not helping, he IS breaking the rules.

 

and, one more thing....i thought this was a public forum?

If you had read the rules, you'd know that moderation is NOT a public topic. If you have a problem with a mod, you need to contact a mod or Radu in pm/forum pm.

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OK so far I have sat back and not worried myself about responding since other than the first post, none of you were actually at the spot I was at, or saw what I saw, or read the report I received.....but there are a few points that are being brushed under the carpet IMHO.

 

I was pmed directly for a clarification of the rules, no one sent an abuse report but were at least honourable enough to check the rules, I posted said PM so the other mods could read it and since, at the time, it was thought that no one else was of level to go, I popped in to check the situation. When I got there, I indeed saw Orick, camped at the Forest Chim spawn point (no big deal in itself, you go where the mobs are right?) with no weapon. I asked where his weapon was, he did not have one and off he went to get one. Invance had not started, no bid deal, However, he then came back with a weapon to be fair, but no torso armour whatsoever. And a discussion about that was carried out with the other mods, and I am sure Orick can verify that he was not immediately removed from the invance, this would be while that discussion took place, contrary to what you seem to think, we actually speak to each other, sometimes a consensus decision is preferred, especially in situations like these.

 

Now I accept the point that to tank he may have required less armour, and that that could, have been a greater help to the team. But...and I could be wrong here....I always thought a tank was someone who kept the attention of the mobs, took the damage and allowed the rest of the team to take them down more easily. HOW are you tanking if you are on your own, surrounded by mobs, with no other member of the team even visible and certainly no other member of the team attacking the mobs you are tanking? That is not tanking. Now...had he been on a few mobs, with everyone else around him taking the creatures down, I would have asked him why no Torso, because THAT looks like tanking.

 

After the discussion on mod, I pmed him, told him I was taking him to MM store so he could kit up and head back in, I answered his questions about why I thought his armour was not within the rules and in no way prevented him from returning to the invance. If he needs to remove his plate for effective tanking, then fair enough, but remove it when you are tanking - not when you are soloing loads of mobs ...seems fairly simple to me to be honest.

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Having read this whole thread, all i can say is WOW....some people do NOT read! the denfinition of tanking is that you are taking damage while the DD take the mob or mobs down........how can you be tanking by your onesies?

 

IF you were indeed, tanking with an invisible squad....why would you be fleeing?

 

These 2 things alone say training.....to be HELPING a team you kinda need to have team......if there is no team you are breaking the rule (as i understand it)

 

If you need to break armour so bad there are plenty of ways without popping into an invance and ummm playing half nakkie ^^

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I couldt read everything , too much spamm. Anyways giving my part of 2 cents here about what was that Evening. All i know is that Orrick came dressed in some red dragon stuff and what seem to be steal armour as well. He was wearing atm went he entered a weapon,cant recall which one as i am a very bad one about knowing which is which. I know he went to tank the first few Yetis that came near gate. As everyone else he was into killing,dont care if he tried to break-that is his personal thing like everyone else in this game. Whoever came with reports i cannot know and dont wanna know but i can asure on ch none even said a word or around us. He just went and did his job as tank. And us as attackers. A good tank was pulled out and we were outnumbered. At one point we all though "Thats it we lost it" cos too many Naspa, Yetis and Giants, thou we were about 20 in total. What was ranger became fighter , what was fighter became ranger not to say even Tankers had to became something else but their normal job.

 

What am i trying to say is by taking a good tank for 100-120 in the middle of the fight inst rly an option for the others on that map, is it? We almost didnt managed to finish it and this is unacceptable. And that is cos we dont have many remained in 100-120 range to tank fight range etc. By taking some more out cos he came in dmg red dragon armour is rly stupid. That is still a damn good armour , and i am sure he had a back up if need it. We had to restock many times, 2 of the rangers used over 500 pk arrows and in the end didnt made the gold or the exp for it. That isnt fair game, is it?

 

Please before considering to do such things in the future as mods reconsider maybe that isnt the answer to everyone else , yes we are a team even if we go around alone and kill mobs. That is called cleaning the map of any mobs anyone of us can take alone. I have done it that evening as well trying to bring the number of mobs down cos we had less and less time , am i to be pulled as well from the special inva next time cos i go and kill some mobs all by myself ? :dry:

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I couldt read everything , too much spamm.

What am i trying to say is by taking a good tank for 100-120 in the middle of the fight inst rly an option for the others on that map, is it? We almost didnt managed to finish it and this is unacceptable. And that is cos we dont have many remained in 100-120 range to tank fight range etc. By taking some more out cos he came in dmg red dragon armour is rly stupid. That is still a damn good armour , and i am sure he had a back up if need it. We had to restock many times, 2 of the rangers used over 500 pk arrows and in the end didnt made the gold or the exp for it. That isnt fair game, is it?

After the discussion on mod, I pmed him, told him I was taking him to MM store so he could kit up and head back in, I answered his questions about why I thought his armour was not within the rules and in no way prevented him from returning to the invance.

Edited by Raz

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[11:41:14] WolfWitch: hi - where is your weapon?

[11:41:25] Orick: i dont have one... do i need one?

 

Stopped reading there. Laughed. Carried on reading some of the posts. Facepalmed so much i have a headache. A decision to not take a weapon inside an invance ( team event) by a known multi-trainer is the definition of a "me me me" attitude. Compounded by not taking in a torso armor (WW's post) strikes at multiple rule violations(and lolx and the people trying to justify that by explaining the 'who the mob attacks in multi situation' method - because he was at FCW's *alone*.). While trying to break items for quests is completely normal(and regularly done without any rule-breaking), you still have to do it in a fashion that is permitted by the rules.

 

Rule broken: 2( B ) --> 3 day ban justified. Whats the problem here? :X

 

EDIT: Brackets turned something into an emote accidently :P

Edited by Sonic

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I agree with Sonic. Having no weapon is the problem here. Breaking armor, or taking it off to tank, is irrelevant. He had no weapon so he would get no attack exp.. Taking forever to kill mobs while everyone else is killing everything else is not team work. It is being selfish.

Edited by Zenphon

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Entropy, you are the boss...so, ill just be quick...but, if someone kills a few mobs, they ARE HELPING, by definition. They might not be helping as far as you, or some others see it....but, I would appreciate someone's help, no matter how great, or how small....and, im sure other people feel the same....as far as 'reporting a break in the rules'...i agree with you....there are so many people doing it, and so many people over looking it, that you should take a look at it..but, there is no need to put all the blame on me...all i have been doing is watching the channels...

 

Everyone else: He was only in the invance for 7 minutes....u heard Immortelle's report....who knows how much he would have helped...he wasnt given a chance....im not putting this on Wolfwitch....im just sayin that many of you are not being sensible, and quite honestly, you are selfish...

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