Magic Immune

[Tempest]

and why do people only PK on NDDs? i hear so many ppl cryin about PK beeing dead. if everyone who cries would just go into a pk map 1 time a day PK would be filled as much as never before. Actually all those people who are like "omg there is never anyone in PK except NDD" i never ever see in PK on normal days, including you. i've been actively Pking the whole year, if it wasn't with temp i used the char of my good friend. the only persons i saw are e.g. toomass, praswinia & ^@^, ambrosius/siarato, and very few people like vytukas, korrode/kadlub/tommyknocker. there were others too but not worth to mention them here since those are the people i "actively" saw pking. PK isn't even close to dead but with mixers continuing trying to fuck up PK skill it's soon gonna be dead. i wonder why mixers still bother to post only bad suggestions for pk. i should start suggesting toads poisoning 20% for the sake of reality.

 

and to ur question how many people actually go in when a high lvled char comes.. the answer is easy.. REAL pkers, those who enjoy PK and don't make suggestions or bitch about PK beeing unfair. i could call some names here but just go to NCA when theres action and take a look. and btw, the other part who doesn't go in are those who mostly (not all, just some) bitch on forums or ingame. PK isn't meant to be easy, you have to train to get your stats up. and IMHO it should be self-evident that with 60 a/d you first have to train your a/d to have some chance in PK, instead of wasting your time here trying to design the game the way it's easier for your levels.

Edited June 2, 2008 by Tempest

[LeoI]

and why do people only PK on NDDs? i hear so many ppl cryin about PK beeing dead. if everyone who cries would just go into a pk map 1 time a day PK would be filled as much as never before. Actually all those people who are like "omg there is never anyone in PK except NDD" i never ever see in PK on normal days, including you. i've been actively Pking the whole year, if it wasn't with temp i used the char of my good friend. the only persons i saw are e.g. toomass, praswinia & ^@^, ambrosius/siarato, and very few people like vytukas, korrode/kadlub/tommyknocker. there were others too but not worth to mention them here since those are the people i "actively" saw pking. PK isn't even close to dead but with mixers continuing trying to fuck up PK skill it's soon gonna be dead. i wonder why mixers still bother to post only bad suggestions for pk. i should start suggesting toads poisoning 20% for the sake of reality.

 

and to ur question how many people actually go in when a high lvled char comes.. the answer is easy.. REAL pkers, those who enjoy PK and don't make suggestions or bitch about PK beeing unfair. i could call some names here but just go to NCA when theres action and take a look. and btw, the other part who doesn't go in are those who mostly (not all, just some) bitch on forums or ingame. PK isn't meant to be easy, you have to train to get your stats up. and IMHO it should be self-evident that with 60 a/d you first have to train your a/d to have some chance in PK, instead of wasting your time here trying to design the game the way it's easier for your levels.

 

 

are you actually reading the posts? your just flaming the same crap over and over again when iv been agreeing with you about being able to remove mag immune.

i havent been bitching about pking being unfair but if theres only 10 people out of 10,000 people actively pking it doesnt take too much to realize that something needs to be done, and if you instantly shoot down suggestions from people who want to pk but arent at your level yet, its always going to just be you 10 by yourselfs "actively" pking eachother.

did you ever think that suggestions from people who dont actively pk but want to are just as good so we can see where the problems are?

 

ye you havent seen me in pk because i only started training this char up in a/d levels because i do want to actively pk. i had another char i pked with, with higher levels but other stats werent as good as on this char and i didnt like switching between the two so i left the other one.

 

people wont go into a pk map because they know theyre just going to get killed by higher levels like you and toomass and tk and the rest of your 10 people and whoever else they might occasionally see. if you look at my other suggestion it gets people into pk and gives them a reason to gradually grow in levels while you 10 and whoever else can still kill each other and not be harmed, or harm new pkers with lower levels than you

[Dushan]

are you actually reading the posts? your just flaming the same crap over and over again when iv been agreeing with you about being able to remove mag immune.

i havent been bitching about pking being unfair but if theres only 10 people out of 10,000 people actively pking it doesnt take too much to realize that something needs to be done, and if you instantly shoot down suggestions from people who want to pk but arent at your level yet, its always going to just be you 10 by yourselfs "actively" pking eachother.

 

There are not 10k people playing EL, and out of those who do, not all are PKers, plus, since you don't pk, there are more than 10 people who actively goes pking, so please stop saying things that are not true And yes, something needs to be done to increase pk, but this is not the solution

 

did you ever think that suggestions from people who dont actively pk but want to are just as good so we can see where the problems are?

 

They can be, but mostly aren't like this one

[LeoI]

There are not 10k people playing EL, and out of those who do, not all are PKers, plus, since you don't pk, there are more than 10 people who actively goes pking, so please stop saying things that are not true And yes, something needs to be done to increase pk, but this is not the solution

 

if you read it youd see he said he's only seen 10 people who regularly pk, and i used to regularly pk. 10k was just a number whether its 10k - 2k, 10 people out of all them is nothing to consider it active

[Tempest]

i was 1) talkin about people i saw regulary over the year, this means nearly everyday.

2) if some1 comes here, and posts a hypocrite suggestion just to benefit himself i flame. sorry. no you don't do this for personal benefit blabla, but first you were "actively pking for months" and then it turns out you are not, your "training your a/d up first", while you got like 500k exp in several months. IMHO, this sounds like a big joke.

 

people wont go into a pk map because they know theyre just going to get killed by higher levels like you and toomass and tk

 

1) TK and me are not even close to high levels.

2) see and thats exactly what i mean, because people are like "omg no i die when i go there" they make crap suggestions and try to design the game how they like it. what about training like we all did? oh no let's just suggest stuff it's easier.

[LeoI]

i was 1) talkin about people i saw regulary over the year, this means nearly everyday.

2) if some1 comes here, and posts a hypocrite suggestion just to benefit himself i flame. sorry. no you don't do this for personal benefit blabla, but first you were "actively pking for months" and then it turns out you are not, your "training your a/d up first", while you got like 500k exp in several months. IMHO, this sounds like a big joke.

 

i was pking with another char, im training a/d on this char NOW, a couple mil exp in several months because of real life issues, and only training alch while i was on... this is just going around in circles now because its about the tenth time iv said all this

 

if you think its a hypocrite suggestion then fine, but you could say the same thing about every other suggestion made, and it wasnt meant to selfish, i just thought having an option to be able to make a mage build would be nice for everyone

 

1) TK and me are not even close to high levels.

2) see and thats exactly what i mean, because people are like "omg no i die when i go there" they make crap suggestions and try to design the game how they like it. what about training like we all did? oh no let's just suggest stuff it's easier.

 

you and tk were just two random people i picked out of your list and still its impossible for me to tell if yous have high levels or not because yous both have private on your rankings

 

someone please lock this, its gotten too much off topic now

[Spidi]

if everyone who cries would just go into a pk map 1 time a day PK would be filled as much as never before.

[villekPL]

mages are fine as they are, just time your harms/mana drains, and help out smiting summons or heal your teams summons.

you dont have to kill everything in let's say 2-3 seconds because MI is altered to be a mage.

 

(and yes, 2-3 seconds is over-rated.. Jaclaw harmed me to about 35hp in 2-3 seconds alone, imagine someone else helping him harm)

 

i say leave MI as it is and find other solutions to make pk active, the pk points are nice, but are just something to brag with.

maybe add an npc that gives special items in exchange for your pk points?

special items that you don't NEED to have, but would be nice to have. that way you wont be forced to pk, but been given the option to pk and get nice items or not.

nice items for example: BoD / BroD / Axe of freezing / red cape, things crafters / alchers and whatever producing skill won't need, ofc you'd have to remove those items from the npc who sells them for gc.

pk points are hard to get (cause of ppl using rings of disengagement and a tele ring, or just flee) so the items could be moderatly expensive.

[XaRondas]

i say leave MI as it is and find other solutions to make pk active, the pk points are nice, but are just something to brag with.

maybe add an npc that gives special items in exchange for your pk points?

special items that you don't NEED to have, but would be nice to have. that way you wont be forced to pk, but been given the option to pk and get nice items or not.

nice items for example: BoD / BroD / Axe of freezing / red cape, things crafters / alchers and whatever producing skill won't need, ofc you'd have to remove those items from the npc who sells them for gc.

pk points are hard to get (cause of ppl using rings of disengagement and a tele ring, or just flee) so the items could be moderatly expensive.

 

it would be nice to pvp w/ a friend , die 100 times and get free st00f from npc

[conavar]

i say leave MI as it is and find other solutions to make pk active, the pk points are nice, but are just something to brag with.

maybe add an npc that gives special items in exchange for your pk points?

 

Has been suggested before but sadly rejected because of possible abuse, still a good idea though and one that is worth looking into, and trying to find a way to stop it being abused.

 

ie: you cant get PK points on guild maps, only maps such as NCa,WSa, KF and TD give pk points

 

 

If the points were turned into the PK version of invasion tokens (actually worth something) ,then imo it would increase PK

Edited June 2, 2008 by conavar

[Nahtepa]

Orly? What are "invasion tokens" worth?

 

p.s- i love it when ya'll call me big poppa...

[villekPL]

i say leave MI as it is and find other solutions to make pk active, the pk points are nice, but are just something to brag with.

maybe add an npc that gives special items in exchange for your pk points?

special items that you don't NEED to have, but would be nice to have. that way you wont be forced to pk, but been given the option to pk and get nice items or not.

nice items for example: BoD / BroD / Axe of freezing / red cape, things crafters / alchers and whatever producing skill won't need, ofc you'd have to remove those items from the npc who sells them for gc.

pk points are hard to get (cause of ppl using rings of disengagement and a tele ring, or just flee) so the items could be moderatly expensive.

 

it would be nice to pvp w/ a friend , die 100 times and get free st00f from npc

 

would suck for the friend who dies alot. someone dieing 100 times and walking back to pk map deserves the special items imo

 

anyway you can get in the minus with pk points right? if it's like that then that friend wont be able to get the special items for a loooong time.

 

or let's say you can kill the same person only 3-4 times an hour and get pk points for it, if you kill the same person more times you get 0

[Michic0_oL]

i say leave MI as it is and find other solutions to make pk active, the pk points are nice, but are just something to brag with.

maybe add an npc that gives special items in exchange for your pk points?

special items that you don't NEED to have, but would be nice to have. that way you wont be forced to pk, but been given the option to pk and get nice items or not.

nice items for example: BoD / BroD / Axe of freezing / red cape, things crafters / alchers and whatever producing skill won't need, ofc you'd have to remove those items from the npc who sells them for gc.

pk points are hard to get (cause of ppl using rings of disengagement and a tele ring, or just flee) so the items could be moderatly expensive.

 

it would be nice to pvp w/ a friend , die 100 times and get free st00f from npc

 

would suck for the friend who dies alot. someone dieing 100 times and walking back to pk map deserves the special items imo

 

anyway you can get in the minus with pk points right? if it's like that then that friend wont be able to get the special items for a loooong time.

 

or let's say you can kill the same person only 3-4 times an hour and get pk points for it, if you kill the same person more times you get 0

exchange the pk score for items ?

 

means the pk score would go out from the game... therefore there should be a way to bring some new score in...

 

(anyway total of pk sore of all players is different from 0, which fucks up everything already (yes, people who kill someone then get reroll means they go back to their previous score before reroll, means the pk score they got after they neg out to reroll is lost - poof - gone)

 

anyway to get back to the Immune topic, this is way too complex to be discussed imo we need some testing... but it would be interesting to see WHO wants the breaking immune implemented, and no wonder i bet it is weaker players who just wanna find an easy way in pk map and don't wanna train the hell out of them untill 110s +

 

to thoses players, just stay @ dp - kusa arenas !

[Chosen]

Let me say one thing..

 

If you introduce a way to break Magic Immune, you will have destroyed PK 100%.

 

Only people sat in Arena's will be naked Mages waiting for a PK'er to loose a 16-17k rosto, when they will loose 500-1k worth of ess/potions.

 

#Edit - If you do put in MI Break Spell, make it atleast req level 120.

Edited June 7, 2008 by Liquid

[Wizzy]

Let me say one thing..

 

If you introduce a way to break Magic Immune, you will have destroyed PK 100%.

 

Only people sat in Arena's will be naked Mages waiting for a PK'er to loose a 16-17k rosto, when they will loose 500-1k worth of ess/potions.

 

#Edit - If you do put in MI Break Spell, make it atleast req level 120.

 

Maybe level 85 is enough. 120 is a little high.

 

How is naked mages waiting to kill pkers any different then big pkers in lots of expensive gear waiting to kill low level newbies trying to get a little mercury?

Edited June 7, 2008 by Wizzy

[Chosen]

Let me say one thing..

 

If you introduce a way to break Magic Immune, you will have destroyed PK 100%.

 

Only people sat in Arena's will be naked Mages waiting for a PK'er to loose a 16-17k rosto, when they will loose 500-1k worth of ess/potions.

 

#Edit - If you do put in MI Break Spell, make it atleast req level 120.

 

Maybe level 85 is enough. 120 is a little high.

 

How is naked mages waiting to kill pkers any different then big pkers in lots of expensive gear waiting to kill low level newbies trying to get a little mercury?

I wasn't being serious on the level 120 thing, was more the point of IF this spell comes into game, you can say byby to the remaining bit of PK left in this game.

[TirunCollimdus]

If the spell is high level and it requires high rationality along with high etherality to have a chance of success then it should not kill PK. Having to get to level 80 magic at least and have a rationality and etherality both over 30 at least would mean the persons who could cast it successfully would be few and far between. Reduce the chance to successfullly cast it by part if the targets magic level too. It is still in game but it doesn't break PK.

 

Tirun

 

Fixed spelling of it as it was ot.

Edited June 9, 2008 by TirunCollimdus

[LeoI]

If the spell is high level and ot requires high rationality along with high etherality to have a chance of success then it should not kill PK. Having to get to level 80 magic at least and have a rationality and etherality both over 30 at least would mean the persons who could cast it successfully would be few and far between. Reduce the chance to successfullly cast it by part if the targets magic level too. It is still in game but it doesn't break PK.

 

Tirun[

 

then, like they've said in countless other posts in this thread, it makes the top a/d players stronger because they also have the top magic levels

[TirunCollimdus]

If the spell is high level and ot requires high rationality along with high etherality to have a chance of success then it should not kill PK. Having to get to level 80 magic at least and have a rationality and etherality both over 30 at least would mean the persons who could cast it successfully would be few and far between. Reduce the chance to successfullly cast it by part if the targets magic level too. It is still in game but it doesn't break PK.

 

Tirun[

 

then, like they've said in countless other posts in this thread, it makes the top a/d players stronger because they also have the top magic levels

 

 

If the most important part of the formula I am suggesting is a players rationality and ethereality both then how do the top a/d players get stronger? When do any top a/d players have both high rationality and high ethereality especially when you are talking at least in the 30s or higher? To get 30 in each of those cross attributes it takes 78 pick points. If you only have your OA that is over half your pick points already without including nexus. How the hell is any A/D player going to manage that unless they are LuciferX?

 

Maxing out p/c and human nexus for fighting takes 95 pick points. 95+78 is 173 pick points. Yes if you are 140 OA and negged out you can get that but hey what if 30 is as I suggested the minimum to have a chance and of course you are still going against your opponents magic level. That means to bust MI against a high level magic player you need at least around 37 or higher in rationality and ethereality. You just jumped up to 191 pick points. How many players have ever even seen that many pick points? This is with no nexus at all other than human btw. If you want to have a good chance to break MI against the top 25 in magic then you would need at least 42 in ethereality and rationality. You just moved to 215 pick points.

 

Those are just starting examples but as you can see it is easy enough to make it nearly impossible for a high p/c character to reach MI break point on top level players. As I have pointed out before you cannot base any develop decision based one what RL rich people can do with their money by buying equipment or pick points. You would never do anything. If you are paranoid about high a/d players being able to break MI then just put a really good chance to break MI only at max rationality and ethereality which is 227 pick points if you want to max out all 5 attributes and still have 7 human nexus.

 

Where does an OA 140 person get an extra 87 extra pick points? How many players are ever even going to see OA 140 anyway? The top players can be as tough as they want to be by buying whatever they feel like buying. Trying to compete with them whether or not they can break MI is the same. You loose. The only way they can get beat is to be ganged up on and breaking MI is not going to save them from being killed by groups of players. I say if players can get 227 freaking pick points then more power to them. They deserve to be uber powerful.

 

Tirun

Edited June 8, 2008 by TirunCollimdus

[Wizzy]

The only real issue I see with a remove MI spell/ward etc would be the magical effects produced by summons. The cooldown, mana burns would make fights un-bear-able for sure.

 

could a "repel beast" spell be implemented to protect agaist this? Not many would last long in a fight with out MI if a zoo was summoned on them.

[TirunCollimdus]

If is was uber hard but possible to get MI breaking spell to work and there was a summon repulsion spell both and it was not quite as hard to get to work then it would be balanced. Then the a/d players would only have to worry about the actual spell casters themselves for the most part. I would suggest that based on charm their would be a spell to break the summons repulsion spell too. It might be uber hard like MI breaking and say depend on rationality and charm both to be effective.

 

If the attributes are keeping the super spells separated then we can avoid having anyone except the uber rich, and willing to buy anything, players at pretty fair odds against each other in PK. Leaving it at wards means that anyone can buy them even with lupine harvesting. Then you can pay noobs to run around behind you with invis potions and antidote potions using the MI wards while you kill people. That is so massively abusable it is crazy. Making it a spell means that players have to earn it unless they are uber rich and willing to support the game with ridiculous amounts of money. I full support people being able to do that since it is good for the game and uncommon that with as many places as have to PK their shouldn't be any problem avoiding those players.

 

Ganging up on them can still kill them because of the cap too unless the bring summon armies all of the time and just keep spending massive amounts of RL dollars on the game. Better for everyone IMO since they can't be in more than one place at a time. My mage class by attributes suggestion shows the best way to do this.

 

Tirun

 

Just thought about asking if MI can be broken only for the person who did the breaking. That would work too.

Edited June 10, 2008 by TirunCollimdus

[conavar]

The only real issue I see with a remove MI spell/ward etc would be the magical effects produced by summons. The cooldown, mana burns would make fights un-bear-able for sure.

 

could a "repel beast" spell be implemented to protect agaist this? Not many would last long in a fight with out MI if a zoo was summoned on them.

 

Just remove the magic effects from summon stones but leave them on normal summons, shift the balance a bit back towards Summoners and there skill. Its only fair imo that summon build chars have a bonus like mage build chars are asking for .

 

and also the casting time of offensive spells would need to be increased, 1 second and 2 seconds without MI is to quick imo, it would need to be atleast 3 seconds (outside combat) and 4 seconds (while engaged) (and fits with the RPing aspect that it takes time to cast a spell).

 

Also the mana cost of Harm (25) and mana drain (16) should be increased.Under the proposed system that is to low. (100+ dmg for some players for 25 mana )

 

Maybe the mana used should be based on the damage/drain inflicted

ie:

If you harm for 100 then it costs 100 mana , if you only have 70 mana left then you only harm for 70 regardless that your standard harm is 100.

 

 

Note: Afaik a Ward in the magic sense is a protective spell not an item

Edited June 10, 2008 by conavar

[Wizzy]

The only real issue I see with a remove MI spell/ward etc would be the magical effects produced by summons. The cooldown, mana burns would make fights un-bear-able for sure.

 

could a "repel beast" spell be implemented to protect agaist this? Not many would last long in a fight with out MI if a zoo was summoned on them.

 

Just remove the magic effects from summon stones but leave them on normal summons, shift the balance a bit back towards Summoners and there skill. Its only fair imo that summon build chars have a bonus like mage build chars are asking for .

 

and also the casting time of offensive spells would need to be increased, 1 second and 2 seconds without MI is to quick imo, it would need to be atleast 3 seconds (outside combat) and 4 seconds (while engaged) (and fits with the RPing aspect that it takes time to cast a spell).

 

Also the mana cost of Harm (25) and mana drain (16) should be increased.Under the proposed system that is to low. (100+ dmg for some players for 25 mana )

 

Maybe the mana used should be based on the damage/drain inflicted

ie:

If you harm for 100 then it costs 100 mana , if you only have 70 mana left then you only harm for 70 regardless that your standard harm is 100.

 

 

Note: Afaik a Ward in the magic sense is a protective spell not an item

 

I would also tend to agree that the magic effects of summons are better suited to summoners as a skill, then as a click. 100 mana for a spell maybe a little too high, but I agree 25 mana for a harm is too low atm.

[Miiks]

Wouldn't it be better, if MI is made mag lvl and rationality based. So for example at lvl 30 mag and 4 rat it would give 50 % protection or so and percent would raise 1 % / rat or mag lvl.

 

MI breaking spell would ruin pk imo.

 

I already wrote to unofficial EL forums about it, so read from there if interested.

[Tempest]

I would also tend to agree that the magic effects of summons are better suited to summoners as a skill, then as a click. 100 mana for a spell maybe a little too high, but I agree 25 mana for a harm is too low atm.

there are 2 possible ways to explain your comment..

 

1) you have 200 mana, 20 def and totally no clue what you talk about ... or

2) you just wanna fuck up the whole skill for fun

 

i hope it's 1.

 

 

 

 

EDIT: found the explanation...wizzy = mage build... for sure.

Reasoning: 44/44

Will: 48/48

Edited June 10, 2008 by Tempest