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Brutus

Repairing Dragon Armor

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The last post I can find about this is dated back in 2009. Dragon Armor has been around a long time now. Was wondering about maybe an NPC Like Blackbeard being able to repair dragon armor.

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Given what is asked by bots for dragon armours these days, I think I'll follow Angler's suggestion to switch to bronze armour from NPC.

So no need to have dragon armour repairable.

 

(off topic but: if those owners claim that the price is justified by ingredients, then that is because they use their sell prices as a basis)

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The thing about repairing it is any subsequent damage is an out right break. That could = brick loss, good for the boss. Second, it might removed some damaged armor sitting in people's sto. I personally don't think that it will change the market on drag armor at all.

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Of course, a damaged armour breaking is not nice, and having a chance to repair it could be nice.
Otoh, dragon armors have been in game a long time now (red dragon armour became manufacturable in 2007)

If in all that time they haven't become repairable, and no one asked for it to made repairable in 7 years, then

perhaps it's not the most urgent change to make.

 

In addition, bronze armour can't be repaired either, and there at least NPC's know how to make it (since they sell it).

So, if you want more armours repairable, include bronze ;)

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Thank you for moving to suggestions for me :). I have several pieces of damaged in storage and except for breaking quest there is no market for it. As a tank I really need undamaged armor when fighting because to flee with team attached to a mob it can often cause their death. The other option is to carry an extra piece of back-up armor for each piece of damaged. Often I don't have the open slots available, especially when in mule form going into a wtf or other instance. I use the damaged for training purposes only. I know that many people use Heavybeard for repairing the other armors and thought this might be another option for those with limited gold coin to still wear good armor in invasions/ Thank you all for your input :)

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hi:)

What about making them repairable by high level manuers? Perhaps with the help of enriched energy essis giving back power to damaged armor pieces?

 

you will need artificial 6 and manu level 100 to try it - which will make it a bit harder for those who just level manu by books and will give the Mixers a chance

Edited by BruSu

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I like brusus idea of Player repairing stuff, I would suggest each item has different levels where you can try to repair it, you will need ressources like dragon scales, leather metals and so on. to repair a damagaged armor, and there is no reason why a blacksmith (thats basicly the manu skill) should not be able to repair things

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I agree that there's in principle no reason why players couldn't be able to repair armours.

 

What I do see as a disadvantage for the game is that armours won't be bought more than once per player

(twice if they are used for a break quest), unless there is another sink for them in game.

That means that there is very little reason to mix top level armours, or getting the capability to make them

(those books do cost 20k each). That has the advantage that you save a PP (no need to get arti 6 anymore,

unless you want to do the tutorial to the end, but there are nexus transfer stones)

 

That is assuming the chance to break the armour while trying to repair would be the same as for other mixes

(i.e. 50% fail rate at recommended level, and 1/3 of fails are critical). So at recommended level, you have a

better than 50% chance to repair the item, and about 17% chance to break it for one try (the remainder is a

'normal' fail, which leaves you with the broken item). If you allow two tries, repair rate goes up to ~67%,

and crit fail to ~23%. This is a much lower fail rate than Tankel and Heavybeard show (lowest fail rate for them is 30%).

 

If the repairer has much higher levels, fail rates will of course drop.

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Hmmmmm, my original thought was that like Tankel and Heavybeard the armor would either be repaired or destroyed like with a COL. That would take about 30% out of game that would have to be reproduced by manufacturers. But I agree that if a piece of armor could 'always' be repaired then it would hurt the manufacturing market. And if repaired by a high level manufacturer a saving stone is much cheaper than a new ice dragon mail. Much 'food for thought'- ty

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hi:)

What about making them repairable by high level manuers? Perhaps with the help of enriched energy essis giving back power to damaged armor pieces?

 

you will need artificial 6 and manu level 100 to try it - which will make it a bit harder for those who just level manu by books and will give the Mixers a chance

 

This is a very good idea especially with use of Enriched Energy Essences which were added but hardly utilized and a number of Point Defense equal to manufacturing level; make difficulty a factor (say 20) to armor manufacturing level and require to do it be with aid of priest; it would cost fixer action points. So Red Dragon armor would be easier to repair than Blue Dragon armor. You of course would need knowledge other than on no books day.

 

Priest: (choose repair dragon armor) I will give my aid.

 

Red Dragon Torso:

Recommended Manufacturing level: 73

Recommended Repair level: 93

Base Manufacturing experience given: 4600

Action Points subtracted: 100

 

Ingredients

 

Required tools:

Knowledge required:

Required nexus:

 

On Recycle day there is a chance you will not lose extra ingredients but you will never keep damaged armor piece.

Edited by saxum

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How about this:

Manufacturers can break down damaged armors to the components, and reassemble them, with a chance to lose random components (ie the damaged ones)

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I agree that there's in principle no reason why players couldn't be able to repair armours.

 

What I do see as a disadvantage for the game is that armours won't be bought more than once per player

(twice if they are used for a break quest), unless there is another sink for them in game.

That means that there is very little reason to mix top level armours, or getting the capability to make them

(those books do cost 20k each). That has the advantage that you save a PP (no need to get arti 6 anymore,

unless you want to do the tutorial to the end, but there are nexus transfer stones)

 

That is assuming the chance to break the armour while trying to repair would be the same as for other mixes

(i.e. 50% fail rate at recommended level, and 1/3 of fails are critical). So at recommended level, you have a

better than 50% chance to repair the item, and about 17% chance to break it for one try (the remainder is a

'normal' fail, which leaves you with the broken item). If you allow two tries, repair rate goes up to ~67%,

and crit fail to ~23%. This is a much lower fail rate than Tankel and Heavybeard show (lowest fail rate for them is 30%).

 

If the repairer has much higher levels, fail rates will of course drop.

A few points with that. Most armor i bought. I did because i died and lost it, and someone else took it. or the bag poofed. Dragon armor almost never break, even for bronze its rare. at least for me.

As a "high level manu of 93" i think i can say that leveling manu is one of the hardest skill in game to level. Especially since the s2e market is down, not just because of stivy. its down because the inflation of the prices raised to a point where running for hydro is compared with the time and effort you spend into it. far to less profitable compared with the effort of farming certain animals, or making money in invasions and instances. I made most of the money in instances.

Armor is more often bought, because someone died and lost stuff, then from breakage i am very sure about that. that has to do with the price of rosto so high, compared with the risk of an alt close by and so on.

 

Making items that degrade repairable by players, just helps to eaven out odds, that are out of sync for a long time. Tankel and heavybeard where introduced when the market in el was something complete different as it is now. and the prices where completly different. Almost nobody back then bought at npc armor. as it was cheaper to make. today you can count armor that you buy at players, on the fact that no npc is selling them.

I have read each book in game that is not about fighting creatures. and i did not use the knowledge of half of it in game. as there is no market for it.

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If manuers where given the ability to repair arms and armour I think the nexus required should be double that which was required to build it in the first place.

And why stop at dragon armours if the toon has paid in extra nexus for repairs any manu item could be repaired with the same principal.

Edited by starscreamer

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Nice, a use for Arti 12 nexus... Not sure how many would be willing to spend that much in one skill

Edited by revi

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Nexus cost would indeed be unimportant now we can have about as many alts as we want, if that was all that counted for mixing.

Those pesky levels, though...

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The high nexus needed I think would allow the more dedicated mixers to feel they have a use again, remove tankel and heavybeard completely and allow players to repair damaged stuff themselves, obviously the same level would be needed to repair as to create plus whatever dastardly formula that calculates the completly destroyees the item instead plus a fee be it gold or items required to actually complete the task.

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The high nexus needed I think would allow the more dedicated mixers to feel they have a use again, remove tankel and heavybeard completely and allow players to repair damaged stuff themselves, obviously the same level would be needed to repair as to create plus whatever dastardly formula that calculates the completly destroyees the item instead plus a fee be it gold or items required to actually complete the task.

Sorry, but I can't make head nor tail from the bolded part. What exactly are you suggesting here?

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Lol, my bad I seem to have posted gibberish, guess I should wait till I've had my morning coffee in future.

That was supposed to say; plus the additional break rate & extra fee to complete the repair, example; damaged RD mail requires manu 73 but at that level chance of failure is quite high in addition to this there would be the heavybeard/tankel repair ratio whatever that may be (im told its 50/50 but I have no idea) on top.

I guess a saving stone could be used to prevent catastrophic loss.

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Lol, my bad I seem to have posted gibberish, guess I should wait till I've had my morning coffee in future.

That was supposed to say; plus the additional break rate & extra fee to complete the repair, example; damaged RD mail requires manu 73 but at that level chance of failure is quite high in addition to this there would be the heavybeard/tankel repair ratio whatever that may be (im told its 50/50 but I have no idea) on top.

I guess a saving stone could be used to prevent catastrophic loss.

 

The quack Tankel's highest loss percentage is 50% for titanium serpent sword, rest are at 40%, 30% and 20%.

Heavybeard success rate goes from 40%-70% making failure from 30%-60%.

 

Having 50% failure rate AND extra ingredients AND as you suggested double the nexus makes no sense; drink getting your coffee via IV.

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If you read it properly my obnoxious friend I said to apply the current success rates from tankel and heavybeard, not a blanket 50% fail rate.

 

Extra ingredients are needed to repair anything, tankel and heavybeards services arent free.

 

The 12 arti needed; if instead of 6 extra pp in nexus what about a perk? 6 pp and gives the ability to repair stuff with the aforementioned limitations.

 

6pp with current success rates makes perfect sense.

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First, if you want to see this implemented, perhaps stick as close as possible to the existing system for mixing. That means no special fail chances for specific items, and no exceptions to what can be recycled (on the day). Any special rule will make it that much harder to implement correctly.

 

Now, for those fail rates...

Both of you seem to forget something: the fail rate you need to compare with Tankel/Heavybeard is the critical fail rate, not the base fail rate for mixing. Unfortunately, due to the non-critical fails, the effective chance of success is not that easy to calculate.

 

Even the (non-critical) 50% fail rate is only valid for a mixer with effective level equal to the recommended level. In that precise case, the success rate will be 50%, the critical fail rate will be 16.67% for a single try. If you allow up to two tries, success rate goes up to ~65%, crit fail rate will go up to ~ 19%. (just ignoring non-critical fails, the cost for wasted food is negligable wrt item cost) If you keep on trying until you either repair or lose the item, you'll have a fail rate of about 25% and a success rate of 75%. This is actually better than Heavybeard's success rates, and for a rather low mixing level (for the item under consideration, I wouldn't try mix an expensive item at recommended level ...).

 

Higher levels, good astro and use of potions would improve these rates. (e.g. if your base fail rate decreases to 25%; your chances to repair the item after several tries go up to 90%, with a 10% chance to lose the item).

 

---

 

I still don't think 6PP is justified to enable player repair (however you dice it, either as nexus or as a perk, you'd pay 6PP to get the possibility to repair items). 1PP would cost 750 000 gc, so those 6PP represent 4.5M gc. That's a lot of repairs... (e.g. I see on bots damaged ice mail bought for 40k, and intact ice mail bought for 180k. That means you'd have to repair over 30 ice dragon mails to get your investment back. That's a best case approximation, ignoring: costs of extra ingredients, crit fails, and perhaps a book to read).

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How about for repairing Items a failure is always critical. You can prevent it with a saving stone, (or manu power up) to get a second chance. To repair an item you will need a recommented level 20 levels abrove the recommented level for that item. So if a piece of armor has recoomented 75 you need 95. Extra Nexus requirement is bullshit. Leveling Manu up to a level that comes close to a 100 is a Pain. I am manu 92. and i consider mysellf as someone who invested lots of time and energy into manu leveling. spending many many days in schools to poof leather helms. made tousands of s2e (where there is no market anymore thanks to hydro block) and so on. Repairing Armor is a field for manu, where you could at least get regular work to be done. And the prices for repairing an armor should be ings worth up to 50kgc otherwise its not worth it-

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