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Entropy

PVP instances

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Ok, so if I understand Korrode's idea, it will be like this:

You use a command to join a queue. Then the server waits until a certain number of players around your level also join the queue. While waiting in the queue you can do other things, like harvest, watch redtube, farm, train on monsters, etc. Once the server finds enough players your level, it will automatically make 2 teams, then teleport the teams to an instance map, and the PKing will begin.

So how will that work? What if you are AFK and you get teleported there? What if you have a full load of silver? What if you are already in a fight? And how does it make sense for EL? I can understand a system like this for a game with millions of players, but in a game where most PKers know each other, and can schedule fights on channels, forums, etc. how does it make sense?

And ultimately, why don't people want a more strategic and tactical minigame instead?

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I am giving a suggestion to make the access of the instance easier : First the instance will require the players to be approximately the same a/d, to join the same instance, they have to be 70a/d up to 80 a/d(for 1st instance), 80a/d up to 90a/d (for 2nd instance) etc, etc .

People need to join a channel like the normal instance, once they are 6 or 8 or 10 ( or any number) , the npc make randomly the team A and the team B, with half players in A team , and half players as well in B team. In that way both of the team are fairly balanced. Of course the ally guild don't apply in the instance so you can attack anyone if he isn't in the same team as yours.

Now might be hard to tell if we allow rangers, summoners, mage or if the players have to be enough prepared to fight any kind of people.

( Sorry for my bad english )

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i have 2 ideas

 

1: You are not auto teled to the PVP map. You are informed by a pop up box that your instance is ready, then you go and get ready then check in w/ the npc who teles everyone into the map once everyone checks in.

 

2: If you are auto teled into the instance, the PVP map starts in a room w/ a sto that you can get ready in. Once you leave that room you can't enter again.

Edited by Nova

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don't go afk if you are on queue to do PVP instance? Or maybe there can be a sound warning for when the instance is ready. Like the microwave :D

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Ok, so if I understand Korrode's idea, it will be like this:

You use a command to join a queue. Then the server waits until a certain number of players around your level also join the queue. While waiting in the queue you can do other things, like harvest, watch redtube, farm, train on monsters, etc. Once the server finds enough players your level, it will automatically make 2 teams, then teleport the teams to an instance map, and the PKing will begin.

So how will that work? What if you are AFK and you get teleported there? What if you have a full load of silver? What if you are already in a fight?

A 'ready check' and then a delay period.

For an example, lets use a 3vs3 PvP instance.

 

So, players of similar level are queuing for PvP instancing. Optimally, the second 6 players have queued a window appears on all their screens saying something like "instance ready, are you?". they have 30 seconds to click "yes" or "no".

 

Any person who does not click at all, or clicks no, is booted from the queue and the other players who clicked yes remain at the front of the queue, once 6 people are again queued the dialogue box pops up again.

 

Once 6 people at the front of the queue do click "yes", a message is then sent to them all saying "5 minutes until instance start", they have 5 mins to leave whatever they are doing, get to storage and gear up. Once the 5 minutes have passed, they are teleported into the instance.

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So what if some of the players are AFK?

Or, you set your afk message if you queued up and have to leave. If the server sees the afk setting or response (can it?), it either passes you over and you lose your place in line, or it sends a 5 minute warning or whatever. If you miss that, you lose your spot.

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So except for the automatic teleportation and instance map, why can't a bot do all those things? Why not have a map similar to a guild map and a bot to do all this?

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So except for the automatic teleportation and instance map, why can't a bot do all those things? Why not have a map similar to a guild map and a bot to do all this?

1. It needs to be stable and reliable and official.

2. A bot is only as good as the information fed it and the coder who writes it. A server automatically has all of our information and would be far more up-to-date and accurate.

3. Players would trust the server more than the average Joe's bot.

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A bot and a guild map i think would be too exploitable.

I assume there'd be 2 entries, one for each team, what's to stop people having friends scout out the 'other' entry and relay who the other team members are?

 

...and to be honest, I know you're a fan of people putting in effort, but personally I'd like it to be as easy and as effortless as possible to queue and join. I'd like there to be as little deterrent factors as possible. If there's a guild map, people have to travel to the entry.

 

I'm a bit tired and a little drunk can i plz be excused from debating implementation until tomorrow boss?, atm i'm not sure i can offer my best effort for debate and troubleshooting :hehe:

 

EDIT:

2. A bot is only as good as the information fed it and the coder who writes it. A server automatically has all of our information and would be far more up-to-date and accurate.

See i didn't even think of this. How can a bot confirm peoples levels to place them in the appropriate queue?

Edited by Korrode

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People can take their privacy off, so the bot will have all their details. People would PM the bot, telling the bot they want to join the queue. The bot has their stats, and matches them in two random teams (it will PM each player what team they are in). Then the bot PMs the players to come, and allows them to go in their designated areas. I can bestow some officialness into that bot. If people like it AND use it, I can implement the system server side.

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I can bestow some officialness into that bot.

Under the premise that you've pretty well decided that you won't implement it server-side until it's proven popular via a bot system, it would really be good if the bot could 'see through' privacy, rather than people having to turn it off.

 

Some people are very particular about their attribute amounts/setup becoming public knowledge.

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Who would code it that you would be willing to make it "official"?

And if you did, why not just go straight to the server and do the work once?

All it will take is for one screw up (go offline, get hacked, mess up the levels, etc etc etc) from the bot to make players not trust it or want to bother and that isn't really fair to the idea.

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I won't code it, obviously. And in the worst case scenario that the bot gets hacked, it's not like it will reveal people names, addresses, SSNs and credit card info. Most PKers already have an idea about other's stats and stuff.

So anyway, I am sure someone will be able to code such a bot, it's not too difficult. meanwhile, I want to make a thread about the pvp instance on the general chat forum, explaining people my idea and your idea, and see which one they like more. Will probably do that tonight.

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I think there are good ideas in both suggestions. I like the idea of being able to choose random but radu's planning it to be more strategic therefore a longer time. If you want quick pk just take someone to kf. But i still think we could do it just like entering an instance like from my earlier post.

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If players are afk when the queue is ready, make a ready check like Korrode said. A window pops up similar to the one that pops up when you finish a daily and you can click accept to go into the instance.

 

A bot would be an ok suggestion, however, it would be more widely used if you did not have to walk to a specific place and queue. It would be better also, whenever you enter an instance, you get teled to a random map. Say there are 3-4 maps just for pk instance. It chooses one at random that is not already in use.

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The only thing unclear to me is step 3. How do you plan to make the teams, tell the NPC which team you want to fight, have all the members in each team agree, etc, etc. This has to be done in a way that:

a. Will prevent cheating.

b. Will prevent congestions (if 4 teams go at the NPC at the same time)

c. Will prevent griefing (purposefully trying to join a team or get in the way, even though the other team members don't want that)

So tell me exactly how you would want that done.

 

Simplest way I can think of would be to use two guilds as the teams and have bots run the joining/leaving of teams.

It could go simply like this.

 

 

 

1) When a match wants to start, a player will PM the bot and request to start a match (/redbot start match) and that player will be the "leader" of that team and the bot will automatically except him into the guild (RED)

 

2) Other players can then join the round by asking the same bot (/redbot join me) untill the roster is full.

 

3) After both teams have done this, the bots will announce that teams are full. Players can then PM the bot and get a list of all the players on each team. (/redbot list team)

 

4) When everybody likes the way it is setup, all players tell the game they are ready (/redbot ready) and when players have all agreed round starts!

 

6) Round is over, the bots kick all the members.

 

 

You could have the "team leaders" have their vote count for an extra "ready" or set special privs etc. Simplest way I can think of.

 

 

FWIW A simple way to do a random queue would be

 

1) All players PM a single bot (/pkinstance joinme)

 

2) Once the bot has a full roster, it will randomly pm the different people and tell them whether to join RED or BLUE.

 

3) After players have joined, they can figure out how fair the teams look by again using the /redbot list team command.

 

4) When everybody likes the way it is setup, all players tell the game they are ready (/redbot ready) and when players have all agreed round starts!

 

6) Round is over, the bots kick all the members.

Edited by Krystal V

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Some ideas to add:

  1. Have it on a separate map like an instance
  2. Access to it will be via NPC which you pay entrance fee by buying token and then use item to go to map waiting area; after period of time you get warning so use another token or go to IP
  3. When you die you go to 'waiting area' - perhaps there are healers there who will pay for a fee - before you can reenter
  4. In waiting area have storage NPC available there and maybe a few no drop, cap limited areas near by some can do fighting while waiting and some can mix. You may consider other NPCs there too.
  5. Have visitor booths were you can watch matches (visitors need to pay too) - recommendation would be like PV school with catwalks above - those above would be in no summon/no magic area. Have bread spawns so visitors can have something to eat (ala Roman Bread and Circuses)
  6. Have different environments for fights - maybe one area has cold or heat or radiation. Part of randomness or levels
  7. Have medals as part of wins - achievements. Some parts of instances have requirements that you have so many points to be part of a team
  8. Part of award can be tokens which can be used to go back again

Not a PKer and have no chance against the pros way my character is built.

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So anyway, I am sure someone will be able to code such a bot, it's not too difficult. meanwhile, I want to make a thread about the pvp instance on the general chat forum, explaining people my idea and your idea, and see which one they like more. Will probably do that tonight.

*poke* *poke* *poke*

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So anyway, I am sure someone will be able to code such a bot, it's not too difficult. meanwhile, I want to make a thread about the pvp instance on the general chat forum, explaining people my idea and your idea, and see which one they like more. Will probably do that tonight.

*poke* *poke* *poke*

He was waiting on me to forum PM him something, but i have now :> some hours back, i'm guessing thread will appear soon.

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New to posting, but I have some experience with other games. A few suggestions/observations:

 

1) I have noticed in some games that allow choosing your team, that players have abused those special events by trading wins (the 2 teams will agree before they start that 1 will win the first match, then the other will win the 2nd match).

 

2) If 5-10 mins is too short to be fun and 30 mins is thought to be too lengthy, 15-20 mins. might be a reasonable middle ground to shoot for.

 

3)I don't recall seeing any mention of possible wait period between pvp instances.

 

4)If there are enough complaints against individuals (for being griefers, doing nothing in the instance, etc.), they could be banned from participating in the instance for a certain length of time (1 month? for 1st offense).

 

Just a few thoughts. I hope they help.

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3)I don't recall seeing any mention of possible wait period between pvp instances.

This is only needed for economic or progression balance if someone doing them non-stop receives more in an hour than say; someone on a monster spawn.

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1) I have noticed in some games that allow choosing your team, that players have abused those special events by trading wins (the 2 teams will agree before they start that 1 will win the first match, then the other will win the 2nd match).

 

Reminds me of the people who gave or sold pki points on purpose...made that whole system worthless. Excellent point here.

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I recall radu saying something about multiple rounds? in which case 30 minutes probably wouldn' t be too long, as long as there was a chance to restock in between rounds.

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