Wizzy Report post Posted April 9, 2012 Good day EL, and fellow pkers. This thread is targeted to the few remaining pkers in game and I would just like to have a flame retardant discussion on bringing some balance back to PK. I have had a few ideas over the years, and I suppose few people agree with me, but I would like to re-cap them here, and have others discuss them. I would like nothing more to see a vibrant pk community return to el. 1) Summoning. This is a powerful, expensive skill. There are very few that can withstand 8 arctic chims at once. So granted a summoner can win nearly every fight. However, 8 acw maybe a little over powered. And it is nice to see that a high level mage can quickly smite them away. Though it makes little sense for a summoner to summon anything else in battle. Dragons are way too expensive, and fighters eat yetie's for breakfast. So the summoner becomes a one trick pony, and a cost of nearly 30k. It is pretty expensive if this is your primary skill for such a short fight. 2) Magic and mages, There is no way a mage should be able to deal out 200 points in one spell. Harm is way overpowered, especialy with no cooldown when not in combat. More group fighting support spells are needed, and magic immunity needs to be tweaked. Also, we have loads of warlock capes in game that provide no use at the moment. 3) Engineering, No one wants to fight against a mad bomber. The ability to stand on a bomb yourself and blow it up and survive why taking 150 points off the guy 1 tile next to you is madness. 4) Rangers, some tweaks have been made and this seems to be much better. However they are slippery bastards, I would like to suggest a balance here. Since a ranger does not need to flee or dis to stay out of a fighters range,perhaps mages or engineers could have a counter to disable rangers for a short time. Eternal Lands, since it first came on-line boasted a classless game. However, as time marched forward, it is obvious that some classes do exist. IE ranger, mage, summoner, fighter, etc. I think it is time to tweak the weapons, armor, capes in game so that (for example) a ranger is better in "ranger armor" then he would be in titanium plate mail. Or a mage would be better off in mage clothes then he would be in ice dragon armor. We have loads of clothes, capes swords and meds in game that are rarely used. So when one does decide to go into battle, one dresses accordingly to ones streaths, Not the rdholm, mage skirt, ice plate combo that Every single other person is wearing. Varitey is the spice of life. There is no reason why a pro summoning, ranger or mage outfit could or should not cost the same as blue dragon armor and thermal serp, with the same break rates. I think, with some tweaks, we would see pk revitilized and more team work. Let the Fighters fight, the rangers range, the summoners summon and the mages cast offensive and defensive spells for their guild. Take a hard look at the over-powered weapons, spells, summons and bring some balance. I think personally every item should have a use, and a counter defense. I think by bringing some balance back to pk, more people would like to play, PK is great for the game because it consumes resources. And it is very unpredictable. And a game needs to be fun for people to play. It is never fun to be bombed 300hp in a second and lose items or rostogol. It is never fun to be 2X harmed and have the same result. It is fun though to fight and stratigize with your inventory of weapons and armors to find a combo that works to win against an impossible foe. Thanks for reading my wall of text. Ideas and suggestions welcome Wiz Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DuBro Report post Posted April 9, 2012 agree with all except ranger Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Piggy Report post Posted April 9, 2012 Don't forget, there's always the PK Server! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wizzy Report post Posted April 9, 2012 Don't forget, there's always the PK Server! This thread also applies to the pk server Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Caliphear Report post Posted April 9, 2012 (edited) I agree we need to do something to bring pk back. A lot of the ppl who were fighters left because nothing was done for pk. It gets old that the same ppl go into kf to clear out lower level players, same spells cast, same routines, same outcomes most of the time. And thats when you can be annoying enough to get someone to come into kf. Over the last few weeks we have had some short lived pk fun and even with no flames, excuses and bs but it would be nice to get more of the community involved. I agree with your ideas except the price of armors being like the blue dragon armor. It's expensive as it is for the armors and supplies to pk, making more way too expensive armor will just make it even more so a "rich farmer" activity. We want more new players participating not chase them away. As for harm.... mages are virtualy useless aslong as you keep MI up. So i have to disagree here. Edited April 9, 2012 by Caliphear Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DrtyDevil Report post Posted April 9, 2012 remember how many people quit pking when caps came around...tbh i belive its more of the cost of gear than anything people spend time rebuilding sto after pking all day its expensive.breakages/degrades alone are enough to make you go harvest or alch to try to make gc to replace thier items and rostos cost way to much to just go toss around in nca etc.hell iirc last time a major change meaning caps lots of people quit....not trying to be rude on this but i think may be bad idea...... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wizzy Report post Posted April 9, 2012 I agree we need to do something to bring pk back. A lot of the ppl who were fighters left because nothing was done for pk. It gets old that the same ppl go into kf to clear out lower level players, same spells cast, same routines, same outcomes most of the time. And thats when you can be annoying enough to get someone to come into kf. Over the last few weeks we have had some short lived pk fun and even with no flames, excuses and bs but it would be nice to get more of the community involved. I agree with your ideas except the price of armors being like the blue dragon armor. It's expensive as it is for the armors and supplies to pk, making more way too expensive armor will just make it even more so a "rich farmer" activity. We want more new players participating not chase them away. Let me clear up my thoughts on that. When I say full mage gear should cost the same as full fighter gear, I meant it in a way that it is choice for a person to invest. Not the I need both. Of course the mage gear would need to be tweaked so that it is good for mages, Not having every fighter wearing it too (IE mage skirt) I think equipment choices need to make some sense, and be comparable to the fighters, rangers, or whatever "out-fit" Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rutuliukas Report post Posted April 9, 2012 (edited) Don't forget, there's always the PK Server! PK server have like 1% of pk what we have in normal server... in PK server is 5-20 ppls at all and the never pk... And about threads, yes wizzy i agree with all what you said, as i wrote in my thread about bombing, i would suggest to make cd on rc mines and detonators, that would still keep them usefull for pk but would remove the overpower from them...we could make a pool about that (or how that thingie when we all vote is called) Dont realy see problems against mages they are easy to avoid, like MI, the other thing is that getting hight harms cost you realy "nothing"... formula for harming should take more from lvl than from rationality imo... but its just imo... its a lil disturbing that a guy can get max rationality take augs and pwn any fighter who forget mi + he dont need to buy costly gear etc etc etc... mage is easy'est way to pwn pk, like in a few weeks you can build harmer and verry few gc need to be invested... What about rangers... you cant solo with range, so i think its preaty ok... In real i see just one real totaly overpowered is only enginering (which can be solved with cooldowns... (and yes i used ir before and will still use it, and i got benefits before from it, but now i changed my minds about pking with enginering) Edited April 9, 2012 by rutuliukas Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DrtyDevil Report post Posted April 9, 2012 wouldnt it just confuse everyone who has been playing thats like trying to change how our pps work ...btw i've been meaning to ask books have been around long time why arn't the enchanted ti long/serps makable yet? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wizzy Report post Posted April 9, 2012 (edited) remember how many people quit pking when caps came around...tbh i belive its more of the cost of gear than anything people spend time rebuilding sto after pking all day its expensive.breakages/degrades alone are enough to make you go harvest or alch to try to make gc to replace thier items and rostos cost way to much to just go toss around in nca etc.hell iirc last time a major change meaning caps lots of people quit....not trying to be rude on this but i think may be bad idea...... Most that quit came back It was a good move really, would you really like to see players buy 178 p/c and go fight them? or for that matter, and mage with 178 Reasoning and Will? Edited April 9, 2012 by Wizzy Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DrtyDevil Report post Posted April 9, 2012 im just saying change too much and old players will quit.... besides i like changing my mind on what i like to do on a daily basis rang/pk/alch manu etc why be specific on what you want to do i see least 60 death messages a day if people wanted to pk they would.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wizzy Report post Posted April 9, 2012 im just saying change too much and old players will quit.... besides i like changing my mind on what i like to do on a daily basis rang/pk/alch manu etc why be specific on what you want to do i see least 60 death messages a day if people wanted to pk they would.. I really do not think you read my first post and understand it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DrtyDevil Report post Posted April 9, 2012 Most that quit came back like to point out "most not all" Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wizzy Report post Posted April 9, 2012 Most that quit came back like to point out "most not all" The game does require new players too eh. But please lets not derail this thread from topic, go start your own thread on player satisfaction if you like Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DrtyDevil Report post Posted April 9, 2012 i also know that you're opinion means more as to you're title. people who like the game as it is why change it, should be talking about how a 115+mob you have to be 20 lvls over it for it not to crit you to death... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wizzy Report post Posted April 9, 2012 i also know that you're opinion means more as to you're title. people who like the game as it is why change it, should be talking about how a 115+mob you have to be 20 lvls over it for it not to crit you to death... My opinion means shit to be honest, But please, post to topic Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Caliphear Report post Posted April 9, 2012 im just saying change too much and old players will quit.... besides i like changing my mind on what i like to do on a daily basis rang/pk/alch manu etc why be specific on what you want to do i see least 60 death messages a day if people wanted to pk they would.. Players quit and come back all the time.It goes in waves. Some of my friends who quit say remove the caps. I can see both ides of this. Fully capped players are bored. No one will go into kf if they are there so they cant even pk. But i have to agree with wizzy on the point i wouldnt want to go into kf with uber char's either with no caps. One idea i have to add is you should be able to summon while fighting. It would make summoners more than a "one trick pony" and most of the higher summoners do have some a/d which if its lower and somene attacks thm, it gives them more of a defense in kf. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wizzy Report post Posted April 9, 2012 (edited) im just saying change too much and old players will quit.... besides i like changing my mind on what i like to do on a daily basis rang/pk/alch manu etc why be specific on what you want to do i see least 60 death messages a day if people wanted to pk they would.. Players quit and come back all the time.It goes in waves. Some of my friends who quit say remove the caps. I can see both ides of this. Fully capped players are bored. No one will go into kf if they are there so they cant even pk. But i have to agree with wizzy on the point i wouldnt want to go into kf with uber char's either with no caps. One idea i have to add is you should be able to summon while fighting. It would make summoners more than a "one trick pony" and most of the higher summoners do have some a/d which if its lower and somene attacks thm, it gives them more of a defense in kf. I fully agree Summoning needs some tweaking. To be able to summon while fighting would make perfect sense. Though the current summoning uses the manufature window, and I think a new summoning function would be very nice. Would make summoning much more useful as a skill. Though, even if it never happens, I think tweaking the summons avaible with the cost, and skill level, and even some boasting equipment might make sense also. Edited April 9, 2012 by Wizzy Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DrtyDevil Report post Posted April 9, 2012 i agree cali, was just saying well to be blunt its a bad idea it would be changing the base structure of game to add clases no such thing as summoners or just a 1 sided skill if you look closly most other skills are lvled in the process of lvling summoning ranging etc basically its all about oas in game you mainly lvl for oas not just for that one skill if was split up then id hate to see when they got bored in that specific skill and not have gc to get new gear we all know if done the gear would be sky high and would fail cause very few ppl would buy it... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
groomsh Report post Posted April 9, 2012 I think a big problem (and not easily solvable) is character sales ... somebody trains a char, sells it and somebody else trains it again without all that grind needed to get to the point he bought the char. These people (not all but most of them) get bored very fast and start to have attitude/ego problems and must kill everything that moves around. This in my opinion ruins PK. I've never been a PKer, but i used to watch fights in KF. Strong people did not attack weak and unarmed players, but now PK is just full of ego boosters. So why would anybody want to start PKing when he/she gets slayed by sold chars in no time ? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wizzy Report post Posted April 9, 2012 i agree cali, was just saying well to be blunt its a bad idea it would be changing the base structure of game to add clases no such thing as summoners or just a 1 sided skill if you look closly most other skills are lvled in the process of lvling summoning ranging etc basically its all about oas in game you mainly lvl for oas not just for that one skill if was split up then id hate to see when they got bored in that specific skill and not have gc to get new gear we all know if done the gear would be sky high and would fail cause very few ppl would buy it... Personally I think it is a bad idea to have a number of completely useless items in game. The warlock cape, Tit serp of magic and sun med spring to mind. I also think it is a bad idea to have 100% magic immunity, and 200 point harms. I am not trying to say we need to change the whole game and make Classes. I am saying, if you choose to be a powerful mage, ranger, or whatever then your choice of armor and weapons should be balanced and comparable with those of a fighter, or whichever.. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rutuliukas Report post Posted April 9, 2012 I think a big problem (and not easily solvable) is character sales ... somebody trains a char, sells it and somebody else trains it again without all that grind needed to get to the point he bought the char. These people (not all but most of them) get bored very fast and start to have attitude/ego problems and must kill everything that moves around. This in my opinion ruins PK. I've never been a PKer, but i used to watch fights in KF. Strong people did not attack weak and unarmed players, but now PK is just full of ego boosters. So why would anybody want to start PKing when he/she gets slayed by sold chars in no time ? I dont see diference who use char real owner or someone who bought it, as far as i understand this thread is about unbalanced and overpowered skills in pk like eng etc... not about that you should grind to get some pk etc... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Wizzy Report post Posted April 9, 2012 I think a big problem (and not easily solvable) is character sales ... somebody trains a char, sells it and somebody else trains it again without all that grind needed to get to the point he bought the char. These people (not all but most of them) get bored very fast and start to have attitude/ego problems and must kill everything that moves around. This in my opinion ruins PK. I've never been a PKer, but i used to watch fights in KF. Strong people did not attack weak and unarmed players, but now PK is just full of ego boosters. So why would anybody want to start PKing when he/she gets slayed by sold chars in no time ? I agree this is a big problem. First it forces other players to think they need to buy and upgrade, And players that do not "play the game the way it was intended" do get bored quickly. But I think that is a discussion for another topic. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rutuliukas Report post Posted April 9, 2012 I think a big problem (and not easily solvable) is character sales ... somebody trains a char, sells it and somebody else trains it again without all that grind needed to get to the point he bought the char. These people (not all but most of them) get bored very fast and start to have attitude/ego problems and must kill everything that moves around. This in my opinion ruins PK. I've never been a PKer, but i used to watch fights in KF. Strong people did not attack weak and unarmed players, but now PK is just full of ego boosters. So why would anybody want to start PKing when he/she gets slayed by sold chars in no time ? I agree this is a big problem. First it forces other players to think they need to buy and upgrade, And players that do not "play the game the way it was intended" do get bored quickly. But I think that is a discussion for another topic. why someone should care is he slyed by sold or not sold char? the fact hes slyed is the thing what he should care imo... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
groomsh Report post Posted April 9, 2012 I dont see diference who use char real owner or someone who bought it, as far as i understand this thread is about unbalanced and overpowered skills in pk like eng etc... not about that you should grind to get some pk etc... Well if you want to revive PK, you need new people start PKing. Oh and i don't say you should grind to be able to PK, quite the opposite - but atm it's not possible because of people with ego problems. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
