Music

[Kurok]

the music is great every one is to be commended for their part in it. I usualy turn it off because of the repetive factor to it.Add more maybe keyed to wht your doing like mixing of fighting or whatever you like to do

. just my 2 cents

[Roja]

Ok, well to sum up this topic:

 

-Overall there are more people who don't listen to the music than who do.

-The people who do listen only listen sometimes, and would rather we have multiple songs on the same map so it doesn't get as repetitious and boring.

 

Since we don't have a regular musician on the dev team, all we can do to fix this is use the music we have and update the playlists to include more songs in a single map.

So, hopefully i'll get some time to do that

[Torg]

I still crash anyway always if change music on..NVOpenGlPBuffer...application error with xp..maybe my problem only though it says i have all future features in use

Eh??

 

If you have a problem like this then I *really* need to know about it because the same code for music is used for sound effects in the next version!

 

What do you mean you crash if you "change music on"... is that turn the music on, or change maps with the music on??

[Ratman]

I still crash anyway always if change music on..NVOpenGlPBuffer...application error with xp..maybe my problem only though it says i have all future features in use

Eh??

 

If you have a problem like this then I *really* need to know about it because the same code for music is used for sound effects in the next version!

 

What do you mean you crash if you "change music on"... is that turn the music on, or change maps with the music on??

nevermind..im anyway not allowed to train here by mods so why to listen only music..

 

well..it started after previous client update when there was also some other who bitched about it but as there can be so many reasons to that as just individual motherboardmalfunction or whatever...

 

anyway I tried it just on test server.When open settings music is not on..When mark it on..it gives right away error message of that NVOpenGLPBuffer...np except if someone else would tell about same..next logon and music is still off..

 

and yes..maybe sound device driver not up to date but because no other problems..I wont mess updating it cuz last time got problems after update..

 

 

System Manufacturer: ASUSTeK Computer INC.

System Model: A7N8X-E

BIOS: Phoenix - AwardBIOS v6.00PG

Processor: AMD Athlon XP 2500+, MMX, 3DNow, ~1.8GHz

Memory: 1024MB RAM

Page File: 654MB used, 2321MB available

Windows Dir: I:\WINDOWS

DirectX Version: DirectX 9.0c (4.09.0000.0904)

DX Setup Parameters: Not found

DxDiag Version: 5.03.2600.2180 32bit Unicode

 

-------------

Sound Devices

-------------

Description: NVIDIA® nForce Audio

Default Sound Playback: Yes

Default Voice Playback: Yes

Hardware ID: NFORCE_VAD

Manufacturer ID: 1

Product ID: 100

Type: WDM

Driver Name: nvapu.sys

Driver Version: 6.14.0460.0000 (English)

Driver Attributes: Final Retail

WHQL Logo'd: Yes

Date and Size: 1/26/2005 11:47:34, 414336 bytes

Other Files:

Driver Provider: NVIDIA Corporation

HW Accel Level: Full

[kailomonkey]

My thoughts.

 

 

Main Idea

Variations on a theme could work, one way you could think about doing this is by having various layers (of music) with interchangable sections. Hard to describe unless you know what on earth I'm talking about lol.

 

It would be, rather than creating 50 different tunes, you would create one tune with inter-changable sections. So the tune overall would fit the same chords, and different combinations could be taken out and put in for variation.

 

Detailed Proposal

Say an existing tune in the game could be seperated into layers A, B, C and D... and we called the layers currently in the tune A1, B1, C1 and D1 ... variations on each section could be written. Say A1-4, B1-4, C1-4 and D1-4.

 

When you enter the map a (random*) number between 1 and 4 is selected for each section, giving us for example:

 

A3 B2 C2 D4

which play together. At set points (every X number of cycles say), just one of the sections gets a new random number selected for play with the others. For example:

 

B chosen to be changed

A3 B4 C2 D4

The variations at each section needn't be subtle, they would simply need to fit into the same theme and chords, and probably use the same instruments/sounds.

 

Merit

This would create an ever variant background music; (4x4x4x4=) 256 combinations from just 16 parts, in this example. Anyone with experience in making music will know that making all the parts compatable is easy enough when they are based around a set of chords.

 

Four sections are sometimes defined as a drum section, bass section, melody section and harmony section... but these don't have to be stuck to, since I have heard little to no drum lines in the music to my memory (bearing in mind I turned it off long ago for the same reasons of this topic).

 

Conclusion

So, that's my idea. I'm sure there are pros and cons to it, one being that you would need a composer. In this, may I remind the readers that moonskimmer of Star has offered a dabble, and I could also have a go given access to the right software. And there are alot of music technicians out there looking for somewhere to showcase their abilities.

 

 

Secondary Idea

On the fading idea (which is debatebly ingame already), I had another thought whilst reading this topic thoroughly (pre-posting). It doesn't really relate completely to the theme-music topic... but some music could be made similar to the sound effects system, being directional and becoming louder as you approach certain buildings.

 

The example I am thinking of is one in which perhaps you are in whitestone city, and passing a tavern that has lively goings on inside. (a minstrels or optional crowd sounds)

This could even be extended into the background music idea (though it would take rather alot of thought in implementing) so that as you approach a flag or door that leads to a new music area... the music beyond can be heard softly coming from the appropriate direction, perhaps balanced by a decrease in current music volume. When the new map (or music area*) is entered, the them is default mono and surrounding as usual.

 

So in the tavern example, a minstrel can be heard as you walk through whitestone city. The noise get's louder and (thanks to the stereo positioning system) you notice it is coming from behind a tavern door. As you open the door the music surrounds you!

Even more fancifully, if some sounds were able to ocasionally be activated and placed in real-time by moderators, a music specifically chosen for the ocasion could be attached to the location of a big event Crowd sounds could go with this, though having a crowd sound attached to the actual number of players would be cooler. In combination with the map-change / music area idea, a player approaching a flag to a pk map might be alerted to the presence of a large ambush, perhaps. hehe.

 

 

Summary

Well there are alot of tangeants in this post, so I hope those who read and respond can do so wisely, and focus on the (I think) sensible ideas that started this post. I look forward to hearing your opinions.

 

 

Note on Edits

(ok, corrected some things and clarified others, headed sections for easier reading)

(responce to Torg's interest appended, to include some issues not yet mentioned)

 

Me

being directional and becoming louder

as you approach a flag or door

I forgot to mention that with flags, the point from which the sound is meant to come from would be made more complicated by the fact that players can walk past the flag itself. Also ship-flags would probably not give an audible glimpse of the next map, but I guess some ocean/sailing sounds, could be an added dimension to method of travel. In which case, do magical portals emit sound, if so, it might have a unique distortion to it. I'm sure there are other issues also to think about, but not before this update I gather

Edited September 15, 2007 by kailomonkey

[Torg]

well..it started after previous client update when there was also some other who bitched about it but as there can be so many reasons to that as just individual motherboardmalfunction or whatever...

Hmmmm, I didn't notice anything in the bugs forum. It is sometimes handy to post unusual stuff like this in the bugs forum because I don't really read anything other than the Development and Bots forums.

 

anyway I tried it just on test server.When open settings music is not on..When mark it on..it gives right away error message of that NVOpenGLPBuffer...np except if someone else would tell about same..next logon and music is still off..

 

and yes..maybe sound device driver not up to date but because no other problems..I wont mess updating it cuz last time got problems after update..

Hmmmm, ok that's really odd. I had (until 2 weeks ago) almost the exact same system (AMD Athlon XP 2400+, Asus A7N8X Deluxe mobo with Nvidia Soundstorm) and never had any problems. If you can get a few people who have seen this issue to post a thread with details of their systems in the bugs forum I'll check it out.

 

Main Idea

Variations on a theme could work, one way you could think about doing this is by having various layers (of music) with interchangable sections. Hard to describe unless you know what on earth I'm talking about lol.

I actually do know what you are talking about. They had a similar engine for the latest version of Sid Meier's Pirates! (remake of the original). This featured dynamic music which changed according to the surroundings.

 

I love the idea, but there are 2 main problems with us being able to implement something like this.

- The first is simply the amount of time to get this really right. It does take a long time to make everything blend correctly, especially if you consider some of the options such as changing the tone of the music when you start fighting, or a storm starts or other triggers.

- The second is that it is actually very complex to exactly sync playback of multiple streams of music. Therefore you need an alternative such as a preprocessor to load and dynamically mix the music so there is a single track of playback. Basically at this stage this level of coding is way beyond the resources we have.

 

Secondary Idea

On the fading idea (which is debatebly ingame already), I had another thought whilst reading this topic thoroughly (pre-posting). It doesn't really relate completely to the theme-music topic... but some music could be made similar to the sound effects system, being directional and becoming louder as yuo approach certain buildings.

I do really love this idea, and I would love to add something like this (similar to sounds for NPC's working and other specific map sounds). It wouldn't be hard to do because they are all ogg sounds and so additional map triggers could easily be coded. If the sounds were small enough they could just be played back on repeat (like footsteps and rain)... but they would be better tied into the streams playback engine. However, at this stage given the extra complexity and my rapidly depleting time to work on this (eek!) I would leave it for the next update.

 

 

/edit: Meh.

Edited September 15, 2007 by Torg