DemonCowboy
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Posts posted by DemonCowboy
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personally i knew it was sarcasm that's y i decided to have fun w/ it - but i do think it would b funny if he implimented all that just because of my smartalic reply back....lmao
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this day is a bad idea - thats y i didn't even give it credit to bother replying in the dev suggestion forums. I understand that Pkers want it to balance out peace day where they don't have nething they WANT to do but if a day like this is implimented ppl that DON'T want to pk or are low lvls literally WON'T be able to do anything because if they step off IP theyre dead - at least on peace day the PKers can figure something else to do like maybe killing monsters or maybe doing something productive
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How about making the ship traveling time more realistic? Say, 2 days between one place to another?
that would b great ent!! you could go through all the work of making ship maps w/ ppl to talk to and things to do ang games to play to help pass the time - maybe a dice gambling system go through the programming of making ships come and go so ppl could miss thier boat and either have to find alternate routes to places or wait sounds like fun when r u going to get started on ALL that new programming?
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How about not goign AFK and/or looking at the console in dangerous places?
well that still isn't going to fix lag - server or otherwise - it honestly does get annoying when u lag FPS shoots up to around 200 or so but exept for client-side animation everything is still then all of a sudden underworld loads and u'r there w/ no clue what put u there
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well if u search for posts posted by me u'll see this is where i post most because i see alot of potential of this game and see a few things that need fixed (like my comments on economy/market threads) but i'd like to hear some of u'r ideas as well and maybe we could make them more viable - i also have ideas for the storyline but being a freelancer i'd like to have something to show for that so i don't post in that forum - instead i've helped make our guild GOLD so popular by creating quests called deeds w/ storylines w/in the main storyline that guildies love - maybe i'll pass some of these to the mods for ideas on special things in-game like mini invasions and the like that could make things funny though maybe a tad inconvenient...lol
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in this case aislinn i could see it some things aren't quite as easy to get results on but in this case the person didn't even bother looking at the top page - and that's just rediculous
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I have been plugging away at the texture masking task. If I finish it, this wil become a lot more feasible as a guild could probably pick from a collection of image layers to have a custom look (of course you would need the appropriate graphics hardware to run it well).
<rant>At any rate, even though I am not a developer (I just make patches to help the community), I strongly do believe that whatever implementation of this occurs be paid with real money to the devs. The developers have put a lot of time and effort into this game, and as such deserve a little more respect. It is prefectly reasonable that getting a special perk just for your guild should cost money, considering only your guild gets to benefit from it. Just because you can get the game client for free does not mean that the game costs nothing, especially to those who invest the time to make it better.
</rant>
as to u'r rant i for 1 never complained about paying in real cash for stuff like this i was just looking for details on what we could do and what was planned for the capes and what was planned for the ingame getting of the individual capes - if any of this is stil being planned i have a couple suggestions on that if i knew where things stood exactly i'd b glad to put forth suggestions - but as far as paying the devs i have no problem w/ paying the devs for perks and stuff like these - especially things guild speciffic - because guilds are able to show togetherness and pool their money (the adults neway) to keep the entire cost off of 1 person
but our guild wants these capes and we just want the information on them so we know where things stand and maybe some of us can offer help in some way or another
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Yup, just a message who hit the final slash, that would be nice
Piper
Or.. who did most damage ?
well i'd still want to know who got the final hit and who was the 1 who walked onto my DB but maybe we could add both like maybe we could add a message that said both that wasn't spammy like:
in case of multiple ppl attacking and 1 making final strike and 1 other doing most dammage:
You were killed by soNso greatly helped by WhatzIsFace, any other attackers weren't worth noting
in case of multiple attack where final blow was done by person doing most dammage:
You were killed byWatzmahoozit - any other attackers weren't worth mentioning
and a kill by a single attacker would be obvious ...lol no point in typing that
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For my own point of view economy can only work if we have to use the items we are manufacturing or other items, anb break these items. For exemple only the pickaxe does break but no other tool.
With armor and weapon we have a similar the problem, we can use them ,but do not have to use.
Most time its even better to fight without weapon and armor to gain more xp. Result is a overflow of armor and weapons.
For exemple in 4 month of playing this game i have only broken 3 steel shield, but i'm able to make 20 in less than a half an hour.
If we have to use these items, we will also have more chance to breake them and the demande will rise, and the price will rise too.
while i agree that this would help it's not a fix that would solve the entire problem - plus the way the game is set up on a hit based exp in combat im not sure weapons CAN be made more viable though i would love to hear suggestions other than the suggestion i've already made in another thread like this, that suggestion being changing to kill based combat, other than doing that, i only see 1 other way to make faster kills more viable and that's basing exp on dammage done - those are the only ways that quicker kills done by weapons will make weapons viable to use - but then to make defense balanced with attack it would have to be changed completely to a dammage based system (meaning dammage avoided through smaller hits from armor absorption to completely dodging) as well meaning armor rating would have to be taken into account as u'r def skill and i'm not sure how that would work out or how it could be balanced - if ne1 has any ideas on how to expand on this part alone - it WILL help the economy if more ppl are using and breaking more weapons and armor - it would definately slow down the falling prices because these items would become more in demand
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well as many ppl as they're managing to irritate already i don't see this guild of currently 5 members lasting long their stuff is already forefeit if GOLD members happen to find it seeing as i personally was even nice enough to offer a swap back for 1 of our members stuff and got a reply that showed their limited intelligence <shrug> i really don't see LCS lasting long
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ok i've got to agree w/ the mods here and tell u to not only SEARCH SEARCH SEARCH but hell READ THE TOP PAGE AT LEAST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! this is just a little farther down on the same page:
http://www.eternal-lands.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=23318
and search pets, slaves, taming etc etc etc etc
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The $200 is not only for the artwork-in fact the artwork would only be a small fraction of that price. It is also for the programming needed, and the fact that if everyone had one the client would be a much bigger download! And if the price is cheaper that can very well happen because i'm sure a TON of people would buyone if it's only $20!
we weren't complining about the price Roja - as a group guild effort we think that it's easily doable between the adults in the guild we were just more curious about the details of it and what does come w/ it and what about how we get the individual capes and the like it's just that we know hardly nething about it but if possible we would like to try to run a couple designs past u ourselves if u'd allow that - we just feel w/ us wanting this that it should be a group effort and when i saw this it looked like a good oppty so if u could PM me here in the forums or in game when u get a chance Roja so we could discuss all this and learn all the details about it i'd appreciate it - i just haven't PMed u about it (ingame or here) because knowng my luck i'd choose a time u had u'r hands full and were stressed out and would wind up w/ answers that would reflect that stress
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To implement that Roja will have to do a custom image, and for that I believe you will have to pay something like $100-200
acutally our guild has been talking about this and would like more information about it and i haven't been able to find anyting about it in the forums or on the online store or newhere and we'd like more information and we have some questions:
1) so far we were told that it was $200 for implimentation what about individual cloaks - newmembers, replacements etc.. they sold or given at WS cloak dealer or what?
2) some of us can and do play w/ the textiles in our clients what if we do the design and just submit it for implimentation?
3) if we do the design, for $200 and whatever it costs(if it does) in-game could we get a small perk like a raisedstat to go w/ it or someting? - basically what do we get for our money?
for the most part we're seriously thinking about it but we need to know current - but making this general knowledge would help generate more income for the game (all advertising does) but we really would like to know
on a side note: the suggestions of stuff like perks and the like and them being droppable/replaceable could b fun (like some1 steals a guild mdmber's cloak they get caught using it on a PK map or something it could b gotten back or it could get destroyed in use creating another dev buzzword - money sink to the highest earning factions (guilds have mini-economies now - at least ours does) and are able to amass large sums of money in groups when they put thier minds to it because lets face it if they have a raised stat or skill effect ppl will USE THEM and lose/break them making more need to be bought
oh and sorry for hijacking this thread w/ the questions for Roja but its info some of us would really like to know and i hope the suggestions make up for it
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i still think an easier way for that is to reduce the experience u get per item 1pt per lvl above the recommended lvl i guarantee ppl will stop grinding on the lower stuff if theyre not going to get any exp for it - seems simple enough and problem might not b solved on grinding but it sure cuts it shorter per person
And then? The market will be flooded with swords except with pants. Since ppl *MUST* make items to level up, market flooding will always happen.
Piper
thats only partly true - ppl at different lvls will be making different things taking exp away like that that way instead of 50 ppl making and selling pants maybe 5 ppl will b making pants 5 ppl will be making torsos 7 ppl making swords etc etc etc it would balance the market out a bit it's not a solution all to itself but it WILL help
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You still have the wrong idea about manufacturing...
People don't make expensive items to level manu, they make either leather helms or leather pants.
Most of this production is sold to Trik, so there's no oversupply here.
From my point of view, the real problem is the oversupply of EFE's for the following reasons:
- People buy them very cheap at the online store (with real money). Therefore, we have lots of EFE's in game, which means cheaper EFE's.
- Cheaper EFE's make high level armor also cheaper.
- High level armor cheaper makes people forget about low level stuff. Why would I buy item X for some gc if I can buy a better one with a little more?
I think a good solution would be increase the price for EFE's at the online store and to have a NPC buying stuff for a reasonable price. Lets say a Tit Serp for 15000 gc. Noone would sell them in market for less than that.
i still think an easier way for that is to reduce the experience u get per item 1pt per lvl above the recommended lvl i guarantee ppl will stop grinding on the lower stuff if theyre not going to get any exp for it - seems simple enough and problem might not b solved on grinding but it sure cuts it shorter per person
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well for my purposes i don't need WASD movement personally if it could be done i'd b happy w/ a "look" feature personally i think it would not only be good for screenshots but there could also be tiny subtle hints to secrets that could be seen w/ through a "look" feature which would make looking for secrets not only just a tiny bit easier (dont want it too easy though) but could make things more fun if u just looked at certain things maybe could even have quests in the future where u had to notice certain things - just a thought but i can see how WASD movement would b a pain if not extremely hard to impliment and would change game too much but a "look" feature i think could add to the game w/o taking much away
/edit: noticed a few more typos than usual and other than my chat slang...lol
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Yeah ok, that's fair. Apart from taking a cut, I don't see why we'd need to remove trade bots.that allows them to be equally accessable to all, and have a standard 'cut' of the cash, whether that be 10%, 20%, whatever
the reason is because though it is a way for the casual gamer to get their market time what happens when some1 who spends alot of time playing gets a bot (like i know somet that do) and then a guild or whatnot just spends all that collected time keeping that bot stocked w/ items to sell (case in point richery) he can sell for less undercutting the market because he ALWAYS has a surplus of items so he can afford to always undercut everybody else and it's partly that kind of abuse that's killing the economy - if richery wasn't always around and always beyond full of items to sell at prices that ppl have a hard time competing w/ - why buy something for higher when u can just get it from a bot - and where do the weekend gamers stand now? they're still at a disadvantage with or without the bots - as they should be they want to be more competitive in the game whether its fighting or the market they should be here - u want casual effort u should only have casual results
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wouldn't it b possible to just make an optional 1PoV? i mean i like the idea of 1PoV but i wouldn't want to use it ALL the time maybe jusr for some screenshots here and there or something i can still b somewhat close by tuning the perspective way up but i think it would b nice to b able to look at the sky 1ce in awhile w/o having to see it through the water think it could lead to even more interesting things
and no this comment was not given alot of thought it was just my opinion and a small suggestion after only alittle more than skimming the thread
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i like this idea - though i think the picture part is a bit much maybe just a text bio on u'r character or whatever u feel like putting think it would b a kewl thing to get to know players like that could also have some nice RP purposes like a better origin than that ship stuff....lol
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actually i'd vote for that too i'd like to know what got me sometimes as well because i'm doing something stupid like chatting in F1 in the wrong place - or in the case of my dialup - just lagging it would b a great help at times
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I don't know that it was great way back when, but it was a sellers market, things would change hands when people had them to sell, and sellers could charge high pricesYou are absolutely right ttlanhil, but what is the conclusions? Is our conclusion that the market was great back in the days and it's bad nowadays or is it that it's just different nowadays?now it's a buyers market, there's many sellers to chose from and the buyers now need to undercut each other, or outbid each other, in order to sell on the open market.
the prices that are charged for various items are not the problem, nor is the change, but it's indicitive of the problem
More and more people have higher and higher levels and therefor the supply situation changes. The only way to change that is by adjusting the game to the new situation. Not by changing the breaking rates, not by changing the rare item rates. That would be reaction - not action! What we need is new challenges for high level or midlevel players. Back in the days a Chimmy was a nearly invincible enemy - nowadays it's not anymore. So get new content, new challenges, etc for advanced players - let the game grow
by committing to adding more stuff at the top end over and over, you're still reacting, and you've committed to keep reacting to reballance the market
not that adding things at the top end is a bad idea, but not for the economy. in that sense it's a continual battle that can never be won
changing breakage rates and rare item creation, however, is not so much reaction as it is tuning. to tune you need to adjust as you see things change, sure, and you might need to retune it later, but you're adusting the existing system in a way that will have lasting changes
in order to fix the economy, though, I think large changes would be needed
1: do away with the grind for leveling that produces items. if you do it for experience, you don't do it for money. if you do it for money, you don't get experience. you can, of course, have it not so extreme, so a certain item might be 90% profit and 10% experience, but the point is the same
this path has already been started upon, I beleive, though it will take quite some time for all items to be adusted to this path, and for the system to be tuned
1.1: reduce the ability of players to 'grind'. possibly progressive decreases in XP gained if you keep at the same thing for too long (the more challenging it is, the longer it takes before your mind wanders). correspondingly, increased failures (and critical failures) for those who grind too long will break the routine
note that this has to be carefully tuned per item. things like FE and HE do still sell (though FE prices on open market are now down to 3gc, so there's not a lot of demand), so should suffer less from preventing people mass-producing them.
2: revise the stats on many items. I'll take damage rings as an example, the cooldown time of a damage ring means that it's not used much anymore (they're made mostly made in the hopes of getting a RoP, I beleive). yes, the fight is more fair as an a/d vs a/d comparison. higher level players are likely to beat lower level players (and know that it will happen beforehand). is that good? I don't think so. more variance is a good thing
that's just one stat of one item, you can also look at food cost, the effects of something, changes of enrichment, etc
3: take away manu'able items from monster drops. at first the fighters will likely object to this one a lot, but they really won't be much worse off. let them get rare stones, capes, and coins (a lot more coins, instead of items).
coins are the one thing that can come from anywhere, any skill
things like capes that come only from fighters mean they have exclusive market on those items. as the market reaches saturation of those items, as it generally has now for capes, the prices will stabilise at a relatively low level
things like rare stones are okay, if it's things that would otherwise come from harvesting events. they're a nice suprise for a harvester, but not their main source of income.
things that are made or mined by people should not be drops. if a fighter can get their gear as drops, why do they need to go to market? if, instead, they have more cash to buy stuff made by other people, they aren't out any more coin, just a bit of time, and the market is driven
4: adjust XP gained based on your level. and I don't mean about stuff that's above your level, that's not such a problem. does the level 80alch player learn as much from making FE as a level 1alch player? well, actually, because of rationality they probably learn more. should they? I don't think so
FE will always be needed (with the current item-making structure), and some high-level players will make what they need, but taking the XP from it away from them will make them just that bit more likely to buy from lower level players.
a tiered market is far better, if players buy ingredients from other players, rather than make all steps themselves. more interaction.
5: do away with trade bots. yes, people will hate this idea. but I think it will have to be done. having bots manage your trade instead of yourself causes several problems
it's becoming closer to the consumer market of today's world. there's always items available for sale, and places keep trying to undercut each other. the larger places have the money to sell for less, even a loss, in order to win future business
people will go to the bots because they're there, and have a decent size stock. it's faster than sorting out a trade, price, and place to meet than a player. so people will accept paying more for the conveniance
on the other hand, the people who operate the bot now don't have to worry about the trading, advertising, and all the other issues, so they can spend more time making, and their profit vs time ratio is higher
there are bots that advertise FE for 3gc on chan 3. players would be foolish to sell for less (some newbies don't know that yet, but that's another issue), and can't compete with the conveniance
possible option: allow people to dismantle some items (bars may go back to ore, potions go back to a vial, swords return to metal and serp stone if applicable, etc). this would be to about half of the ingredients that make sence (getting FE or coal back from a bar isn't logical). this may decrease demand for the ingredients a bit (since you can pull it apart when you're done and get part of it back), but not by that large an amount. and since people can pull stuff apart, there's less of a case of huge numbers of finished, unsellable items in storage
another possible option is to calculate chances of a rare drop/special item harv event/enrichment taking into account the number of said item already in the game. you need to be pretty flexible, but if there are millions of serp stones in peoples storages, then we don't need too many more of them (again, just an example, but it is true of serp stones)
if there are things that I've said that people disagree with, please argue the point, and explain why it may not be true (this is especially about taking away trade bots people have paid for, because I know people will object to that. yes, you paid real money for it. sorry, but I think it's part of the problem)
this i actually agree w/ all but a few points
i think the rare stones should still b rare even if drops maybe not AS rare as harvesters but still rare to keep the price up but i do agree that there should be no manuable or harvestable items in drops but i think books should b more rare than they are too maybe more non-manu items like raw leather - collecting and selling in bulk they could still make a profit undercutting the cheap leather NPC and maybe even ccharge the same or more because of larger quantities and them not having to make multiple trips for it
i agree w/ the tradebots but i do believe that some bots would be ok like bots that trade just inguild for donations to the newer players and the like GOLD does this not only supplying stuff for the lower lvl players but letting them give certain stuff back so they can feel like they make a difference too but i do agree that bots shouldn't b used for outside trade for that DOES cause an unfair advantage - but i know this is done to bring RL revenue to the game and it's creators - maybe keep the current system but make outside guild tradebots against the rules mute them from channel 3 and the like we bought a cheap bot but will probably play the higher price later for the software because it would help if it had a tradelog to make it easier to see who takes what and gives what
as far as losing exp for items below u'r level i totally agree - a suggestion might be for every lvl over recomended lvl it loses 1 pt exp (just like when u gain an a/d lvl fighting something u lose a point in the skill gained in exp) adding reason/will will shore this a bit but u can't spend every 2 lvls u get into will so low lvl items will still eventually make u nothing for exp (or maybe let it just drop to 1 so it becomes like crushing bones into bones powders) but it will spur the economy making higher lvl players prefer to buy low lvl items from low lvl players
actually to dismantle certain items it should take MORE stuff like coal and FEs for metal items because i'll hand u a sword i have in real life and i'd like to see u take apart the blade and make bars out of it w/o re-melting it
the only suggestion i would add is either fixing the NPC economy w/ appropriate floors/ceilings (with an in stock feature so they can't b abused to make all kinds of money off of) or getting rid of them completely because the way the system is now if u pay enough attention it's EASY to exploit for example i have never made a feasting potion and never will under this system because i can MAKE money BUYING THEM!!!! yes i can sell PoRs for more than what it costs to buy a higher lvl potion they cost me hardly anything to make and i make 4gc on every 1 i make to buy a PoF w/ and i have an unlimited supply of vials that way so i don't have to worry about that either!!! and i've found other such discrepencies but i figure if i at least point out 1 that enough ppl will start using it to ruin the economy further so it WILL get the attention it deserves i make what i want and i only go on the market channel to buy - it's too easy to make money to bother selling anything on the market channel and since it's a buyers market it's not worth my time when i can make only a few select items and make all the money i need when i need it
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I would also like to see something like extra exp when you produce something like an EFE for a positive event, maybe 10x the exp you would get from one efe same for ele etc. Would make it a little more entertaining and offset the negative events if their added.
an EFE or an ELE are positive events in themselves and more exp for them would b like pouring sugar on candy i would never ask for double positive events - what i was asking for was to let the positive events have a little better chance - like maybe double the values are now to offset the negative random events because they would still be rare for u that way even w/ the artificer perk just not as rare considering the new dangers it could still come out balanced because the negative events will slow most lvling players down a bit to help (not fix, help) slow down the mass production that's a good part of the problems w/ the economy
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well i was thinking they could b kept small (especially on lower lvl items w/o FEs and the like) so new players won't get killed by them right out but i was thinking that these could replace the critical failures - and in some cases some of the failures because u'r going to stop working (failure) if u poke u'rself w/ a needle or hit u'r hand w/ a hammer and in some cases u could bleed on the item and ruin it for sale (critical failure) and on higher items lets face it if theres an explosion u lost u'r materials (some of them in u)
Hmmmm, that's starting to sound more like these are a role playing explainations for the existing events (which is also cool). I was personally thinking of events that have more of an impact (like the chance to send you to the underworld). I don't think they should kill you straight away (like the harvesting events unless you are quite new), but should be enough to require you to keep an eye on your health (for example).
well 1 we need more of the role playing aspect in the game imho but the lower lvl items we have to consider new ppl too and the new ppl is who the low lvls will really hurt and ppl trying to lvl usually make the stuff that gives the best exp and the more exp something gets the way i thought it showed that i had in mind the bigger the danger - like if u'r making a tit serp and an EFE explodes if it dont kill u it will come close but hitting u'r hand w/ a hammer might take say maybe 10-15MP away because that would smart if u were trying to shape iron for a boot and smashed u'r finger and for a person around that lvl they will pry want to heal b4 they resume and a finger prick taking 5-7 or (numbers need balance i know) on fur items will make a new player think for a min because that's 1/4 of a new new player's MP that are doing the old lady quest but the numbers could be played w/ still my suggestions there aren't in stone but i was thinking that different skill level items do different ammounts of dammage so u don't flat out kill new new players right off the bat making them hate the manu window or the game in general but for a pinprick i think it should do the same dammage that a bee does while harvesting a hammer more than that hot metal more than that or an EFE exploding even more than that progressively and the more of these items u use the more chances u have of something hurting u when there's a failure critical or non (as in don't change the failure rates just put those in place of some of them)
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We use here hammer and needle. When Your manu lvl and dexterity are low You can accidently hit in Your finger while making leather boots and losethen hmm 5-10 hp.
The same with needle - You can prick in Your finger losing hmm 1-5 hp.
I think these events should be very rare, and therefore very large. We already get loads of small problems (failures and crit failures), I think some very rare, large events could make things a bit more interesting.
well i was thinking they could b kept small (especially on lower lvl items w/o FEs and the like) so new players won't get killed by them right out but i was thinking that these could replace the critical failures - and in some cases some of the failures because u'r going to stop working (failure) if u poke u'rself w/ a needle or hit u'r hand w/ a hammer and in some cases u could bleed on the item and ruin it for sale (critical failure) and on higher items lets face it if theres an explosion u lost u'r materials (some of them in u)
The Market is Broken, How Can it Be fixed?
in Suggestions - General, Misc.
Posted · Report reply
i think that not only books but all manuable items should b eliminated from monster drops - or at least made EXTREMELY RARE and maybe replaced w/ stuff thats not harvestable manuable or permenant - like maybe mercury, leather, picks, needles, empty vials, etc and a good few more gc - this would give fighters more money to spend on equipment so they can afford to risk it more and the other stuff fighters could use to participate in the active market and make even more money for equipment or equipment in direct trade and imo the sooner the better