Burn

The random enriched is more interesting. Enrichment stone was only brought up because the randomization would require rewriting code to allow for random, not just a mix addition which just requires adding the mix parameters. And I'm not sure the time and effort would be put into rewriting the code for one mix at this point given the current status of updates.

And no care was given. If you want to shut down discussion just because you disagree, that's your problem, and yours alone. * YOU have taken it upon yourself to add safe areas. No. I have posted a suggestion for designating places that are already treated by players as safe areas to be marked as such. * YOU have taken it upon yourself to determine what these safe areas are to be. No. I have taken it upon myself to list the areas PLAYERS have been treating as safe areas for years now. Players made the list not me, with the exception of Zirakinbar which is new. * Have YOU asked any of the mods who run invasions for a list of where they would not normally put hostile mobs? It doesn't matter. If you have a tiny list of safe areas, then none of the other locations matter. * Have YOU asked for player discussion as to what safe areas should be? That would be the purpose of putting this on the forum instead of just sending a Facebook PM to radu. So far, you've been completely unhelpful, doing nothing but whining that it might slightly limit you in some way. * No? Then why on earth are you surprised when people have a pop at you? What I'm not surprised about is the biggest complaint being that moderators might be even remotely limited in any way... over places that are already not invaded because there's almost always people in them. Even coming from someone who claims they never "willingly go after AFKers". Now, Aislinn and I seem to have come to an agreement that inside storages and a safe house near outside storages is acceptable. That's literally all that's being discussed at this point. We managed to get that far. What part of that are you complaining about?

What part of "suggestions" are you not understanding? This isn't a change... yet. It's a suggestion. NAME OF THE FORUM. We don't block talk just because you don't like it. Instead of talking about it, you're complaining that you can't do what you want. Every suggestion is a possible change. Your post is "change is bad, so don't discuss suggestions". I gave a starting point. Not from "places of my choosing", but places people already have been using for years. You can't go in Nk house by storage and not see AFKers. Or the houses north of VotD storage. Or the EVTR tavern. Not my choices, but what the players use. You actually know this. The only one I actually "picked" is Zirakinbar, and that's because it's the newest storage. And I have a place opening for it in the next update. But overall, it's the players who chose these places. Over a course of many years. It's already been whittled down, and now for some reason you're saying it can't be discusssed at all because it takes away an incredibly tiny portion of the overall maps and that for some reason pisses you off to no end. I see nothing of value coming from you other than that you fear change, especially if it makes even the tiniest dent into what mods might be able to do. Every single update has added more places for you to invade than this tiny list of places. And as such, I can't care. If no one gets to discuss things, start with you.

Interesting use, falls in line with similar things already in-game like perk stones + token to get a RIG or whatever that does. Sounds good, and balanced. The random part might require extra coding, as mixes don't normally work with random results. If so, I'd suggest an alternative that the mix produces an Enrichment Stone.

"All the official safety system in the world will never completely cover a simple typo. " That's the argument to never allow invasions, period. Mods make mistakes and put the wrong (or no) cap on critters that are supposed to be capped on a regular basis, we don't stop capped invasions over it. This is officializing the status quo, not changing anything. Many years of these places being used as AFK spots with no memorable "mistake" issues is more than enough testing to assume that any mistake would be that, a rare mistake, not the norm. Nobody's suggested "disciplining" anyone over a mistake. They should, of course, fix their mistake if they make one, but your response is just extremist reaction for the sake of being extremist. We don't stop suggestions solely because "something might go wrong" that would be the exception rather than the norm. This literally "puts some words" on places without actually changing anything because it is already the norm. I don't get why that's so hard of a concept to grasp.

That's literally what I just said. Your DP Reading Room suggestion is actually MORE than what I said. "1) What is "not a small number"? I gave one per storage, 2 in rare cases like VotD where the safe one could be confused. And Isla Prima. There aren't that many storages for this to be more than a small number. " That is literally just inside storages and one nearby safe house (or a rare 2 where the safe one could be confused like VotD or Ida) for outside storages. I've chopped the suggestion down to the previous post just above yours, so anything else is already not being discussed. But you're starting to grasp the whole point... the overwhelming majority of places being suggested are ones that common sense has dictated not be invaded in the first place, there's even more than I suggested (like your DP reading room addition). The only real additions are like Zirak's storage wagon which I'll be opening in the next client update so it can't be a norm yet. (and yes, the sole purpose of that wagon getting an insides is for players at that storage to have a safe place to AFK, I took the time to make it for no other purpose.) This is literally just adding a "designated safe zone" tag to those places that are already treated like such by players.

I also don't have the mod chat to play gang up games like is happening here, so I'm not responding to you Raz. "Oh, no, he just said invasions instead of dangerous invaders which he obviously was meaning so gang up and attack him over that instead of using a little sense and understand he's talking about safety for players". 1) What is "not a small number"? I gave one per storage, 2 in rare cases like VotD where the safe one could be confused. And Isla Prima. There aren't that many storages for this to be more than a small number. I just wrote to forget the rest, so I won't repeat it. 2) The areas would be marked "designated safe zone" or similar, getting the actual intent across. Assume from this point my wording was "invasions that are DANGEROUS" as that was the whole intent, you can drop safe critters wherever you want. Assume literally everything about this is player safety, and not "invisible rats" or any other safe drop that comes to mind. Assume this would literally not change much of anything from how things have been assumed by players to be for many years now (otherwise no one would bother taking the time to go into the house at Naralik to AFK instead of just sit at outdoor storage for example), it's just making the status quo official.

So your true complaint is there will be a small number of places you can't toss numbers after #invasion at? Yes, I wasn't thinking about "invisible rats". Nor was I thinking of Targets, or Nenos, or Badas, or Invdrags, or Shy Rats. Or Unicorns. Or anything "capped at 1". My whole point was safety. All I got in return was complaints that you couldn't throw invaders in where people have for years now expected to be safe. So yes, I question the motives of these responses.

This must be a gossipy banter in mod chat, since you're all coming here on the warpath with the exact same commentary. Invisible rats, dragons capped at 1.... What part of the word "safe" is not being understood? Drop an entire damn bucket of invisible rats on the latest newbie on IP, I don't care. We're talking safety here, and it keeps going off into rewording things that I did NOT say, and things like this that don't qualify as dangerous to an AFKer. But let's simplify this, since that was actually just a side comment anyway, not the initial purpose of the post. I should have known the "oh no it's limiting a moderator" comment would raise hell. So take that damn comment off. Let's stick to solely having the safe locations. At or near storages. And let's pretend the word "safe" is actually a common word that's easily understood. Let's pretend I'm talking about the places that are already being used as AFK spots by people, and have been for years, like the Naralik storage house, and moderators use common sense and don't invade those. And by invade those, I mean in a dangerous manner. This would LITERALLY not change a single damn thing on the part of moderators unless they're assholes invading rooms that are regularly AFKed in, but would show good will towards players by having them marked instead of having to guess. (And the whole point of suggestions is change, so not sure what your point was there.)

"For all other small buildings in general like random houses" Those are my exact words. All the random small houses like in Melinis or Ida city or such that are only possibly invaded via hidden invasion. Nobody said anything about huge damn caves that are regularly invaded and as such no one should feel safe in. I'm not going to respond to people rewording what I wrote. I didn't take the time to make the damn mod invasions map just to restrict it. These are common sense suggestions based on how the overwhelming majority of things are already done, just "making it official" so players won't have to question it. What is so difficult to grasp? This will change almost nothing, just making the current norm official.

One location per storage, be it the inside storage or a location near the outside storage. And Isla Prima. And the building in the Ida cemetary that was moved there for this specific purpose in the first place. I'm not understanding what the "restrictive" part is. The added comment about checking before doing a hidden invasion? (Like peeking in the tree house next to Redeemer to ensure Aisy's not AFK there before dropping a bricker in there?) I'll need the restrictive part explained, since hidden invasions are rare, and checking first aids in ensuring you're dropping critters in the right place.

Well... thanks for the perfect example of the reason this is needed? I couldn't have given a better reason myself. Radu got pissed years ago when Acelon did indoor storage invasions. They've been deemed safe ever since. P.S. Invis rats are safe by default, not sure why you brought them up. If you check houses and such before you invade them, you also completely eliminate accidental invading the wrong place. "Wait, the invaders didn't appear here, I fucked up... I can #tp to where I just invaded and kill off my mistake." I do question the motives of those who can't deem a handful of places in the game as safe for people. Forcing your final sentence is by default saying mods have questionable motives. If you're not setting out to attack AFK players, then having some designated safe zones is hardly something to complain about, right? Let's answer the real question here: How exactly is it harming you to have a handful of officially-designated safe places to AFK that people have already been using for that purpose for years, without you actually trying to attack AFKers?

Playlist for the tutorials: https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PL4LMY-0urQYVeDlGRPFcBh1_tfbVT2tuO Tutorial #5, covering Particles. (bonus: at 13:50 and 19:23 in the video, you can see previews of two new places coming in 1.9.6. Idaloran chapel and... a new mini-city of some sort)

One is planned, but that includes things such as my map updates, bluap getting all the work and testing done for other actually-more-major changes, coordinating with radu on any changes that need to be done on the server, and so on... and that takes more planning than just building the latest git client. "Soonish"

Playlist for the tutorials: https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PL4LMY-0urQYVeDlGRPFcBh1_tfbVT2tuO Fourth tutorial completed, delving into more detailed handling of 3D objects and a more in-depth look at proper height tiling.

Get rid of the info about the time/special day? Seems like that was what was constantly making the site take forever to load at times (since going to pages without it loaded with no problem). It's useless, really, just stick to what's necessary for the bots.

Playlist for the tutorials: https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PL4LMY-0urQYVeDlGRPFcBh1_tfbVT2tuO Third tutorial completed, Part 1 delving into 3D Objects as well as the basics of height tiling.

Or at the least, upping it to like 1/1000 or so. Maybe more. Any form of random is going to be a problem for macroing, but higher chances are only annoying to normal players. That 1/64 is with clicking each object in a list, which can be 5-7 clicks per restock while mixing. That alone makes the 1/64 feel like more often. But that's a second option, anything that essentially annoys/punishes players just to hurt the rare macroer is never a good thing.

Thanks. Playlist for the tutorials: https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PL4LMY-0urQYVeDlGRPFcBh1_tfbVT2tuO Second tutorial completed, getting in-depth with ground tiles and 2D objects.

We don't have a date for the client release yet, probably not until sometime in the first half of 2021. Depends on bluap's client work and anything else I'm doing on maps. This is just a "head's up" that there's going to be a change. When we're ready to release the next official client update (1.9.6, not bluap's pX releases), there'll be a change to MM. The bot situation in MM is currently a mess with so many in one odd place. There will be a change which will require you to move (slightly) your bots into a new "marketplace" next to the battle hall, in the same place that most of the bots currently reside. [images removed, they were there for information purposes, not a f**king critique and whining about other maps] There are 20 stalls, chosen on a first-come-first-serve basis. There are not 20 bots in MM so space isn't an issue. ALL BOTS that are placed to be convenient to storage or the battle hall will need to move into the stalls once the update happens. Exceptions: Bots that are not placed to be near storage/battle hall, but are near resources (outside of cave entrances being the common ones). Those can move to the new marketplace if desired but it's not required. The purpose is only to clean up the bot situation around storage and the battle hall, not disallow resource locations. I don't think we have any indoor bots there anymore but those are excepted as well.

First-come first serve for the stalls when the update occurs. Will probably be messy there the first few days until the owners get on or last resort mods tptm bots with inactive owners.

Why I'm done: "ZOMG ROOFS" "There's no roofs." "I can't see from the top because of roofs!" "There's no roofs. You can see no roofs in the pictures. You can even see the top of the bot's head in the second picture." "But roofs block my view because I'm playing a 3D game solely from one angle!" "There's no gods-damned roofs!" "Okay, I just don't want them to be like this completely irrelevant map that shows something that looks nothing like what you showed in the pictures." *ulcer intensifies because a facepalm just isn't enough and I didn't f*****g ask for any of this, I had a subject and only one subject* "I'm playing as if the game is 2D from one view only and I don't want anything that makes the game 3D!" *ulcer intensifies even more because this is not some level of ridiculous that any map editor would cater to* "What I think he means is roofs." "There's no damn roofs." "But here in Portland there's roofs." "I'm not posting about Portland I have a very specific subject and location here." "Hey but what about roofs?" "Hey but what about the subject I actually posted this for?" "But trapping! Hey, here's a fruit in Portland you've never been told about that does something you still don't know about." "Here's the actual height tiling for the new MM location. Show me trapping." *no showing* *ulcer intensifies* "I also play like it's a 2D game and expect nothing 3D" "No. This is a 3D game, and just as I explained repeatedly there's no f******g roofs so it's moot anyway!" "Here's more irrelevant stuff you didn't create the subject about." "...You people have done your best to ensure I can't care about any of it, and regret ever showing anything beforehand. I'll never do that again. I should have known better." *yup, my ulcer is back for good* *wakes up from what little sleep I could get because of it to read this in my e-mail* "clearly I did not realize that maps are the sole department of EL that is exempt from discussion and critique." 1- At last check, the sole part of EL exempt from discussion or critique is moderator actions by actual rule, because you can't handle that. Not this. 2- A moderator should understand the concept of TOPIC. I did not post this to end up having to deal with this bull***t, people made an intentional choice to turn this into a nitpick-every-damn-detail attack on my work and go ranting about other maps when all I wanted to do was notify bot owners of a coming change. My only fault was not expecting this after 12+ years of it being the norm rather than the exception. I should never have posted images. I won't make that mistake again. 3- In any normal scenario, you would never see any map changes, by me or by Acelon or by any other before me, until the map was in the game because they only needed go through Acelon, or possibly roja before that. So no, you don't normally get a say on that. But you actually know it's possible to get something changed, without compounding on s**t like this, because you have a perfect example of that kind of change in a flower shop in PV that no longer looks like it used to. The reality is this: 1- Dare I say, there's no damn roofs? There is absolutely nothing here that will be any damn horror to players, people are just desperately looking for things to complain about. 2- The walls are necessary to keep mapwalking from sto to battle hall from ending up in the middle of the market and all those bots. Any "bottleneck" cannot be completely avoided anywhere in the game, but I guarantee this is better than no wall. 3- There's no damn roofs. 4- This topic is not about any other map. In every scenario in every other map, the bot owners selected their location, you can bitch at them. It's nothing I'm going to do anything about, nor can I in situations like Portland. I can't change the 3D objects themselves that you're complaining about there, nor am I going to completely redesign the city just because poor bot placement choices were made. (And I really don't even want to for anyone that can't move their camera in a 3D game.) 5- There's no damn roofs. 6- The only possible way of anyone getting trapped would require at least two other players/alts intentionally setting themselves up to block someone. That's intentional behavior that harassment and blocking rules are already in place for them to be dealt with. And it's hardly the only location that can occur. 7- There's no damn roofs. I'm not just some random person who never plays. I actually do play, and I know how the mechanics work, whether it's trading or mapwalking or the requirements that would lead to getting blocked or teleport nexus behavior. Even more so since outside of just playing I've actually studied all these things as they relate to all the map fixes I've been doing for years now. I don't add or change anything that I wouldn't want to deal with while playing myself. I test these things in more ways than you can possibly imagine, in fact that was why my own bot on Test was there, to test to make sure there were no issues. Hell, I even have scripts that I wrote that grab the map data and test distancing and dozens of other issues. So yes, I'm done being accused of not being smart enough to actually think of these things. The area went through multiple changes, worked on and tested off and on over a period of months already that led to my results with the walls being not only necessary, but having openings at very specific places that prevented mapwalking inside them going to/from storage from other places, and the distancing between where bots would be. The height tiling (where people can walk) was studied and determined any blocking would have to be intentional and an issue for moderators, not something that would just regularly happen. I'm the one who FIXED a chunk of places where I knew or was told there were such issues, not added to them. (Remember people getting teleported onto a bush while harving VotD toads? Getting teleported and stuck on the platform the bookseller in Naralik is on because there were no stairs up to it?) I didn't spend years making changes to literally every official map in the game without knowing these things. I made a specific post for a specific topic. The topic got completely lost over the barrage of unfounded off-topic complaints and insults to my intelligence. And for that, and for the stress ulcer I was given, I'm completely done. I have nothing else to say on this matter.

The purpose of this post was solely to pre-announce that bots would have to be adjusted so owners would have a head's up. It was not for a critique and an extensive amount of whining and moaning about stuff on *other maps*. The images are now removed, absolutely nothing will be shown in advance again at any time to anyone publicly. That was MY mistake, and I've now paid for it by getting back a stress ulcer I just got rid of. It'll be weeks before I can even look at the maps again. I don't need this. I'm done.

Posting this was a mistake. I'm done. I don't need this ulcer.

1) Define roof as is seen in the image. There are NO roofs in the image, so what the flying... cheesus christ. 2) Several years of asking people to report map bugs and now I'm being told there's "magic fruit" something in PL that does what exactly? Show me the bug report. There's no possible way to get trapped in anything I designed here. [image of layout with height tiling removed] There is no height tiling indication of any place a person could get "stuck". 3) The idle bots were placed in HORSE STALLS, not vendor stalls. The bot owners are responsible for that, not the map. They should not have been permitted to be placed there.