Ruln

I'm attacking nobody. I'm defending myself. Go back and read carefully. I stated my opinion on the topic of MM and I was personally attacked. Thats where this started. I've done my best not to respond in kind, though I have rightfully pointed out that it is immature and counter productive to attack the messenger and not the message. I never said it was. Defending your opinions is not a problem. I'll say it one more time, its the methods you use that are an issue. Six year olds debate this way. Adults shouldn't. Yes I can, and I have. Its up to you to convince me I'm wrong. I didn't start out with MM. I got it because I figured I'd enjoy the game more with it. And I have. Thats the data I'm operating off of at this point. Good communities are inclusive and supportive. They do not ostracize new comers.

People who are sure of themselves debate the merits of their points of view. They do not simply contridict and personally attack others. Fundamentally it seems like there is discontent with the community and viability of EL now as compared to back in the good old days. I'll suggest to you that attacking somebody who has devoted hundreds of hours to learning and playing the game over the past two months for expressing an opinion counter to your own does not help this situation. In fact it is far more harmful then MM or any other aspect of the game could ever be. I've also put my money where my mouth is by making a donation and intended to do so regularly in the future. Being attacked in a very immature manner is starting to make me question continuing to do so in the future. So if you think you are helping to solve problems here you are very much mistaken. This sort of behaviour is part of the problem. And I'd like to thank Highwarlord for expressing an opinion counter to the one I expressed earlier and doing so in a mature, informative and CONSTRUCTIVE manner. EL is trying to grow up. It seems to me that some of its long time users and friends need to do the same.

Let me translate. "Agree with me and I will". So, are you prepared to stop arguing like a six year old yet? Yes, and yet again you haven't provided any. I've watched hundreds of people come and go in the past two months. Irony is my middle name. No need. That doesn't follow. Human beings build on their past experience. This is why for instance we don't have to learn to eat each new food we encounter. We do not start fresh with every new project. Well, not if we're smart. Suffice it to say I'm not pretending. Nor do I need to. From where I'm sitting you're the one doing most of the posturing BTW. That doesn't follow at all. Are you a programmer? Because if you are you should have a much better grasp on logic.

The fact that you continue to attack me rather then my points leads me to believe you are unsure of yourself... Please backup the first statement with hard data. I'd love to see it. As for the second statement, strictly speaking the game is in alpha. Beta software has feature freeze and is only going through testing and bug fixes. You might want to look up the word hypocrite in the dictionary... I started playing D&D in 1981. Were you even alive then? I've played well over a dozen different role playing games and hundreds of computer games on everything from S100 bus CPM systems through the Atari 2600, Vic-20's, Commodore 64's, Amiga's right on through to modern PC's. I've had a fulltime internet connection at home since 1989. I've worked fulltime in the computer industry for the better part of twenty years. I am not a clueless newby. I'm not here to insult anyone. I'm also not here to kiss anyones backside. I'll tell you exactly what I think and I'll do my best to do so in a mature and constructive fashion. I'm also interested in listening and learning. If you can't take that then it isn't my fault or problem. And no, I'm not planing on going away. How many people were on the server back in those days? Could it have been the sense of community that kept people coming back?

Its egg shaped and silvery in color.

Well, I have zero hours since the latest update since I can't play at work.

Well, compared to a serp stone yes. I went through 53 harvest levels before I got one of those and I've never gotten a second.

So the point of removing MM then would be what? Its fine in my opinion to say something along the lines of "In my experience this is what happened when that was the case". It is however basically very impolite and counter productive to say "you are wrong." I've been on both sides of that and either end up getting pissed off or pissing off somebody else. Neither of which is productive for either side. I've been playing EL for two months now. That makes me a newby by the standards of many of you. But you know what? I'm one of the most senior players on most of the time because the turnover is so freaking high. I'd guess that 90% of the characters created get played seldom or never after their first week or two of existence. There is a constant influx of new players, which is good. For some reason most of them don't seem to stick around though. The question is, why?

I harvested four hours straight and got ONE. Step back from the edge of the cliff please.

More or less common? I'd guess less. Not that it seemed very common before.

I don't have any idea. Seems totally pointless to me. To each their own I guess.

No, I was not incorrect. And thats the key problem here. You are expressing an opinion. I am expressing an opinion. We both need to be willing to support those opinions without resorting to "You are wrong, I know better", or our opinions are pretty much worthless. There are all sorts of really wierd little cliques and cults around. Within the confines of those societies all sorts of things work that would not do so in a more general context... You lie!

PK'ing holds less then zero interest for me. Particularly if the motivation is simply to aquire other peoples stuff. Personally I think it would be hilarous if I dressed up in my best armor, pretended to be clueless and then wandered onto a PK map while carrying one of these stones. In any case, lets wait a week or two to get more data before crying that the sky is falling.

I don't see how you can make judgements when your perceptions are clouded by some largely imagined ideal youth... (I suspect you didn't like me saying that. If so then good, you just got to experience what I did when I ready your response.) Debate the ideas on their merit or lack thereof and leave the messenger out of it. Its very easy (And short sighted) to simply dismiss or accept what somebody is saying because of who they are.

Kami, I really do understand the implications. I' was part of a team that designed a game very much like EL... in 1988. The hardware wasn't up to the task (And to some extent neither were we) at the time so it never went anywhere. Furthermore a big part of my professional life has been desigining and maintaining complex systems. EL has major problems. The economy being the key one. It needs far more controls in the form of NPC's that buy and sell everything that is available in the game and thus establish upper and lower boundaries for all items. These prices need to be fair to both the producers and the consumers. Meaning both sides complain equally. The combat system has issues as well. First of all the setting is western European fantasy. Earning more experience by way of hand to hand combat is just silly in that context. Also you should be able to click on any monster or animal visible on your screen and attack it so long as it is not already a comitted resource. EL is very inconsistent. Potions (At least the first couple) require no food, Ess do. Why? The primary problem though is heavy handed tweaking of things like success rates and durations on the production side to try to compensate for perceived issues. And often these tweaks to particular items make no sense in context. Why do HE's fail so much more frequently relative to recommended level then other ess for instance? Why do FE work every single time? Critiical failures should be very rare when you are at the recommended level for an item. If the EL world were 20 times as large as it is then your suggestions would make sense. As it is there is far to little to explore. Making people wait months to gain levels to explore all of the very small EL world isn't going to do anything for the games popularity. I'll make two disclaimers here at the end. One, these are one mans opinions. I'll claim they are informed and experienced opinions but that doesn't mean they are perfect or even correct. And two, all criticisms asside creating something like EL is very difficult and I'm impressed with anyone that gets this far. Especially in the context of something that is free. The game does however need a major rewrite at this point. More bags on the side aren't going to solve the issues. And finally, the community is EL's strongest point.

I've harvested thousands fo diamonds and titanium over the past few days and gotten exactly one. I don't see a problem.

Well, if this were the real world then sure. As it is you never starve to death in EL, and if you need some pocket money then just harvest a few flowers.

Lets see, the point of the strike ois to increase prices. So if prices increase then the strike has been a success, right? Think about it...

Speak for yourself. That certainly hasn't been the case for me. I am. The only thing more pathetic then stealing stuff in real life is stealing it in virtual life. First of all, MM is available to anyone. You can essentially get it for free in conjunction with "I can't dance". Second of all MM does have some downsides. Like having to chase monsters all over the place if you want to engage them in combat. I don't view this as a big deal, but some people do. And thirdly, I haven't had any trouble finding interesting and challenging things to do in EL since getting MM. It opens up much more of the world to exploration and explotation. And EL isn't exactly huge. Not being able to go many places without stripping nakid and dieing nine times out of ten just doesn't excite me. Thats a very arrogant statement. I'll play the game so long as I enjoy it. Pardon me for doing so in a way you find objectionable.

Its easy enough to establish a floor price on pretty much anything. All you need is an NPC that buys a particular item. Whatever price they pay will be the floor. Wether that is desirable or not I can't say.

OK, everyone who isn't primarily a fighter who is calling for the removal of this perk please raise your hand... Personally MM is about the only thing keeping me interested in EL. I have less then zero interest in PK'ing and there aren't nearly enough spawns to making fighting anything but frustrating most of the time. Especially in conjunction with the fact that you have to be right on top of an animal/monster to be able to enter combat with it. If its on the screen it should be clickable for combat dangit.

Anc create a bunch of new problems. If you want to be that radical then there is a much simpler solution. Simply don't have people drop stuff when they die.

The X-Server is the GUI you are in. Do you type "startx" when you first login, or does it automatically start up the windowing system?

The key thing needed here is what sort of graphics card you have...

I'm not trying to compete and the following site is likely temporary, but here is a link to as near as I can tell a complete mirror of the elrocks site I've created with minor changes. Most importantly it has all the maps. It would likely be a good idea for others to grab and mirror them. http://timebox.turbolift.com/elrocks/index.htm I put this together mostly for my own use.