lvl up

[Izzy]

ok forget thin ice, this is basically walking on frigid water here.

 

I can understand the exp req for about lvl 1-30 but once you get to 40's and 50's its just insane. The ammount of time required is far too much, infact say max level was 99 it would take almost 5-8 months to get there in combat, forget harvesting.

 

If that's what was aimed for then ok whatever. But its real annoying when you need almost one hundred thousand exp to level and your average enemy gives only 700 or less depending on how you fight them. I dont care what ppl say when I wear armor I get less def exp.

 

All I'm asking for is to balance the exp out so it can take about a month of non 24hr playing to reach lvl 70 atleast. (In attributes with no caps)

[ShadowKnight]

would people stop complaining about making the game easier? It's done that way on purpose. As you learn more, there is less to learn. Whenever you play a sport or a video game or whatever, you'll notice that it's easier to go from sucking to average than it is to go from average to expert. People don't exactly get into the olympics in a week you know.

[Izzy]

Point noted, however no matter how much you want eternal lands to last, or how hard you want it to be it is still a video game, and all video games are meant to have a point of succes. If that point is near impossible to reach in a video gamers life span. (1 year- 2 (If dedicated) after 2 years they are on and off) then the game itself is pointless and fruitless.

 

To have no sense of complete accomplishment is the key to boredom.

 

The game isn't hard if you play almost 24 7. And only a few people have been able to do that that I know of, in some cases I was one of them, well atleast I tried. After it while it drives you insane or close to it, the games difficulty needs to be toned down. Thats all there is to it, I'm a bit more composed now that I've been in weeks so I can debate you on the topic if you'd like.

 

Fact is the game needs to have atleast one attribute that can be maxed out in 1 month or slightly more. Right now if it were possible to begin with. A player grows the character on combat alone it would take almost a month to reach level 50 on constant play. Basically 17 hours a day.

 

 

Maybe you dont understand because you dont actually see the numbers in hours. Or because you have nothing better to do (Didn't mean it as an insult just and inquiery), so let me show you the numbers.

 

lets say this month; december has 31 days right ok lets begin.

 

I'm not exactly sure the numbers ent used as the exp stuff but they look pretty random, I'm sure theres some sense to them but I dont care to find it.

 

ok so basically you will spend 119 hours a week playing EL inorder to get to level 40 or around there. Now to get to level 60 or maybe a little higher would take 357 hours after that your month is over at 476 hours of game play.

 

Ok lets view the average gamer in one year. this is about 2-4 hours of game play so lets just go with 3 hours. Each have their own reasons for game time so it may be allot shorter or 4 hours longer.

 

ok so there are 8064 hours in a year and the average gamer in one year will play for about 1239 hours In one year. Ok remember it takes almost 476 hours of gameplaye to get to level 65 or around there in 1 field (AND ONLY 1 FIELD) this is also supposing the field doesn't have a exp cap on it.

 

Now lets look at the contrast in development. It would take almost 727.25 hours for a person to reach max level if max level is 99 or slightly less. Thats just in one field. that is basically 2 months of constant game play. And little over 6 months to max out one specific field. (Thats if the exp from the source can keep up at the current rate that it increases)

 

I'm all for the set exp max. Like say the exp needed to level was 1000 then the higher level you are the less exp you can get from 1 certain enemy. The lowest exp you could get would be 1 and it would take 1000 of that creature to level you up so lets say your level 50 it would take 49,000 fights with that one creature to get you to level.

[Killerlamb]

There could be magical faeries that lvl you up to level 99 and give you the best swords/armor evereywhere!

Come on, its EQUALLY hard for everyone, so its fair. Who really has gotten to level 120 (I thinl thats max) on runescape. thats been out for frikin' years.

[Izzy]

your comparing only to rune scape. I'm comparing to:

 

Get's list ready;

 

Lets start off with the more widley known games and break them down into easier to harder.

 

Diablo 2 - 3 weeks for the average player to reach 99

Midevil - 5 weeks for the average player to reach 99

Phantasy Star Online - 11 weeks for the average player to reach 200

Never Winter Nights - Not sure with new patchs I hear max level has risen. But before it would only take about 5 weeks.

 

(Note these are all extreamly successful games and like it or not some of them are called legends)

 

In the less know games:

 

Legends of Taimiur: 7 weeks for the average player to reach level 99

Dransik: 9 weeks for the average player to max out all stats

Graal: Nothing much to max but to get all stats up to max about 4-5 days

Ragnarok Online: 6 weeks for a player to reach lvl 70+ I never had to get past that. LVl 70 is godly basically.

 

 

And man theres so many others that I cant remember the names of them, none of them well a few that I've played in my past had the same insane rate of exp req to level up.

 

---------------

Also a good point by killer about D2, people on it complained about how fast it was to level up. Everyone who I know since 1.07 D2 no exp. All know the newbs and hacks of 1.09 is what screwed the system up. D2 has always had that type of level up system. and 1.10 balances it even more. Even if you got a character to level 99 the character can still be as garbage as it was at lvl 40. There are many different things in Diablo 2 aside from levels.

 

It takes almost months to get the proper items for your character(s). Either through TRADING or MFING both ways can be fun and sponsor socialism with other players. The concepts supports each other as well as the rate of growth.

 

Now back to Noobs and hacks of 1.09: Noobs who got to level 99 and traded or got lucky (Remember hacks came in early 1.09) and got their hands on these items became more powerful THROUGH their ITEMS even if they raised their characters to be trash. When hacks were on the rise again thats when they started complaining cause new noobs were gonna do the same thing. =D thats what happened.

 

My point is its not the level up system that messed it up, the fact everything was hacked out messed up the entire game.

[Killerlamb]

I know. Those games ARE great ( I've played like 3/4 of them)

However, once maxed it like. Erm...Okay...what now... and it gets boring. Entropy wants to get players hooked and playing for years, not weeks or months.

[Izzy]

Entropy wants to get players hooked and playing for years, not weeks or months.

 

If entropy wants players hooked for a longer period of time and this is his way of doing it then obviously something is wrong. If you want some one to stay it comes down to two things, use force or convince them. In this case force shouldn't be an option. (Unless ent is actually bill gates) But in retrospect I can see why he would do that...

 

The real way to go about it is adding diversity to the game, then sublimely use force, not shove it in during game play.

 

It's like the US to a immigrant.

 

They come in and hear all the promises about freedom and chance to make it big. They become a citizen have a job and at the end of the year IRS wants to take some back.

 

You don’t expect exp to get to level 1 to be 190exp then level 2 100exp or whatever it is then by level 20 10000exp (makes sense) level 30 70000exp (ookay) lvl 40 300000exp (hmmm.) lvl 50 1000000 (WTF)

[Killerlamb]

True, but an easy game is boring. And a too chanllenging game is unfun. You should make a game thats impossible to get to lvl 99 but like 89 or something is possible but EXTREMELY hard 90+ should have the huge break instead of 40-50

[Izzy]

some games like ro had levels that were just good enough, even in D2 some of my pvp chars were only lvl 89 cause thats all my sorc needed for her occy a valor snowclash and all her other equipments. It's up to the player if they want to get to level 99, I say it should be harder yea than getting from 48-49 but it shouldn't be that hard. Put it like this.

 

If your lvl err... 12,12,12 fighting rabbits your not going to get any where, but fighting a deer gets you to 13's faster and fighting foxes gets you to 13 even faster. Now lets say for instance that fox is what (which isn't all true) your supposed to be fighting at level 12's now the equivilant to that is a ogre really at 50's. Your not going to level as fast but it shouldnt take an entire day to get to level 51. (24 hours of running back and forth for potions and fighting ogres).

 

Now put it like this if Ent wanted replay value to the game, the ((awards system)):[CHECK MY POST ON "AWARDS" in suggestion] is a nice way to go about it, as well as guilds; which in the old forums I did say a series of guilds run by a npc, and each guild is located in different locations :::::

 

::::::OFF topic::::::::

It would be nice if you needed guild member recognition or otherwize do a quest to join a specific guild.::::::::

:::::::::::::::

 

:::::::BAck to topic:::::::::

or simply just more quests.

[Killerlamb]

Your awards idea sucks ass. when a n00b joins the game a buncha assholes would be like "Join christianity"*blah blah* THEN I BROKE IT ON THE DAMNED JENOVA CONVENTION LADY

[Izzy]

que, it's worked better, the idea is just that. Either way when a noob enters the game someone usually pms them saying "bla".

 

The awards ideas I was suggesting isn't reffering to religion is was just the awards themselves. Just like how ents level up system (Which you support) also has its down half and its good half (which is what you support) the RELIGOUS award system is just the same, a player will envite others for a quest they havent done yet, or try to enroll them in the religion. Fact is (I'm talking about religion) only certain level of faith would allow some one to recruit another player. Meaning the player your trying to recruit has to be a certain level as well as the person recruiting.

 

The idea is very valid.

[Killerlamb]

First of call it FaYth its soo much cooler. Secondly this game shouldn't be a 100% religion oriented game! All anyone is suggesting is religion stuff. It seems impossible to program all this shizznat

[Izzy]

err. 100%... it was a side quest. I thought I said that O.o like 20 times... ok my mistake... its just a side quest. Something the player can do apart from just playing.

[crus]

i disagree with Izzy. i think that current leveling system is very good..

I like to know that i won't get bored with game once after 1-2 monts cuz i'm all leveled up..

and i REALLY LIKE the fact that it takes u like a year to come close to 99 it if does.. soo ..

leveling should stay as it is...

[Killerlamb]

It takes you a year to get to like lvl 58 or something...

[Forve]

Hmmm lol year? :lol: 2 months or 1 will be enough

[Entropy]

As others pointed out, if you get to the max level in a few weeks, then you get bored. It's not fun to be level 100 in something if a newbie (someone who started to play 2 weeks ago) is as 1337 as you are.

Jevrik is level 55 in manufacturing, for example, and he started a few months ago. The thing is, if you are dedicated, you can succede. I don't play the game myself, but there are a few players that are level 50+ in combat, and the game has combat for only 3-4 months. So, in a year, I estimate people can get over level 70.

Don't compare D2 with EL, because D2 is not a MMORPG. Neither is NWN.

 

Anyway, there will be new things soon, like, for example, a religion system, to make the game more varied.

[Killerlamb]

Superior Inferior Magical And other items are coming too...right

You should make a really good sword worth like 500 plats for a hard Difficult Long However Fun quest

 

'Elvish" Magical Sheaths seem like a cool idea too *cough*

[Guest]

i was talking about this earlier, but the target of this game isn't just reaching max lvl. that would mean the end. i think that since entropy and others are going to continue working on the game, there can be new quests, areas, monsters, items etc. the game will be evolving. diablo and other games are set. there is a fixed set of items, quests etc. you get to max lvl and that's it. good bye. this game doesn't really have to have an end, as long as there are people who are willing to develop it and play it. maxing out in this case would mean you'll miss all the upcoming fun. unless you love to just walk around. i know that i don't. what i think, that all the rpgs are best at the beginning, with a weak character. working to get better is the fun part. being the best is the end.

[Izzy]

Don't compare D2 with EL, because D2 is not a MMORPG. Neither is NWN.

 

You forgot Legend's which I also compared to, that is a mmorpg that has about 300 players at a time (All at one), they have a system that people become powerful in 1 month. That game isn't based off power, the main concept of a mmorpg isn't to become powerful, if I wanted to play a game to become strong I'd play a rpg, if I wanted a game to become strong and talk to people sometimes I'd play D2; or any other hack n' slash for that matter. (I was comparing level up systems, I never specified a genre just in successful games, I broke it down into 2 groups ones that are heard about allot and ones that are underground; sorta.)

 

But a mmorpg is massivly multiplayer online for a reason. A mmofps is something I dont clearly understand, I know what it is but to explain why is another thing. However a rpg is sort of a story, a team work, role play, and so on. Not just become powerful, I'm just saying when you have the resources to add more ... accesoiries to the game, quests, side quests, mini games... then lower the exp req, As long as there are allot of different things to do it will filter out the people who only want to become powerful, the rest can become the best in what they want to become the best in. That is the true purpose of a mmorpg, to mimic the real world, but make it fantasy. That is the one true goal no matter what road you take.

[Entropy]

Then if becoming teh 1337357 is not the purpose, why do you complain of it being hard?

[Izzy]

Then if becoming teh 1337357 is not the purpose, why do you complain of it being hard?

 

 

Eternal Lands is a game, but unlike allot of other games it is a game in development, meaning the game has to be explored before it goes commercial, Explored fully and as naturally as possible. Each "player" is at this current moment a beta tester and has a obligation to report bugs, errors, and game play issues no matter how small it is. And no matter how small it is the developer in charge of handling these issues, bugs and errors should attempt to solve them.

 

I don’t complain about the leveling up system for myself as there would be no point of doing so at this moment, I don’t play EL and to make the point clear all my stats for the combat and such are 29s, and 30's, Those are my highest and they will remain that way until the issue that I ran into is resolved.

 

It sorta burns in my head when you told me; you wont accept timed quests because not all players can be on at that time or have that time. Well I believe in some ways the same is applicable to the caps and such that you added, as well as the amount of exp needed to level past level 50.

 

I don't believe the question is about whether I care about leveling, it should be about if you care about the people playing the game. Even some of the devote believers of your exp system that I have talked to thoroughly, have some wavering about getting to a high level.

 

I understand your belief and your questioning my is intriguing but still invalid. I am not here playing your game to level up, if I was I don’t believe I would be just level 29. I am here to test your game, and test the developer’s ability to drive through on the original promise of “something differentâ€.

 

Which though in minor specifics you have achieved in the large picture was a failure.

 

Just like I am not judgmental about this game because it is in early development, you shouldn't blow the casket on requirements as such.

 

You are going to erase all the players any way right?

 

It's only natural since these accounts are from alpha.

 

---I hope I made a point for you, I made one to me but you may perceive something different from what I actually typed, or maybe I perceived something different. But note that in no way is this an offensive message, and if you interpret it as such then, ok.

 

=D