Rolling Stone redone

[Dugur]

This item has been mentioned previously, but thought to bring it up as it's own. Point being able to recover some of lost exp in resets. #edit: And make shit load of $$$.

Now if we take a stone that counts all skills exp together and gives that exp to your oa, we have a dream item for everyone planning to turn their nexi into hydro nexi. On the downside, this will make everyone able to replace use of attribute removals and turn their build to anything they like no sweat. Too easy? Too abusable? Too expensive? Yes, very likely so(?)

 

So instead of doing 100% soft reset with stone, there could be other type of rolling stone, ofc a shop item. This would count the all skills exp, reduce current exp and then give you that exp or percentage of it as overall exp (not adding scholars day bonus!) This isn't selling skills levels or pps from shop, because that exp has actually been in the char and earned. The obvious counterargument is that reset needs to hurt, you need to think how you build char etc etc.

Now obviously to limit automatically redoing of all pps (if this limitation is wanted/needed) you'd need to have half the total exp in your overall already (now you can't just reset and take oa back) or have the returned exp considerably low percentage of total. Ofc one use / reset.

 

In current system, there isn't really need to do resets anymore thanks to removal stones. You need to fail in build or be too cheap to spend on removals, or just need to feel those easy starting oa level dings. The rolling stone would compensate some of the done mistakes in past, that could have been avoided with removals these days. Also now we can also add the comment this is Beta, suck it up, boo-hoo.

 

Example of a highish level person with all exp total of 140 oa (~300 mill exp) done reset and grinded to 117 oa (~100 mill exp) There's 200 mill exp poofed.

If 50% of reset exp is returned they get +100mill and end up in 130's.

If 25% returned - +50 mill = ~125 oa

If 10% - +20 mill = ~120oa

 

If exp is returned from oa 0 (allowing softish reset) same char would end up with oas:

50% - ~125oa

25% - ~110 oa

10% - ~92 oa

 

Even at 50% return the exp loss is so considerable that you'd think twice to redo your build at 140 oa, unless you are an epic resetter that stayed low oa but grinded lots.

 

Same for total exp of ~100 oa = ~40million who is at oa 75 (~10 million) lost exp in resets = 30million

50% - +15 million = ~ 88oa

25% - +7,5million = ~ 83oa

10% - +3million = ~ 79oa

 

And counted from 0 oa:

50 % ~ 81 oa

25% ~ 71 oa

10% ~ 58 oa

(numbers estimates)

 

Would this be away from someone? I know it would be heavy $$$. The bigger the percentage of the returned exp, the more moolah and bigger castle.

Edited October 9, 2009 by Dugur

[Dilly]

I would love to see an item like this get introduced and I would not hesitate to spend a fair amount of gc or even RL $$$ on it.

[Miiks]

Good idea

[groomsh]

This would count the all skills exp, reduce current exp and then give you that exp or percentage of it as overall exp (not adding scholars day bonus!)

I guess this is a showstopper at the moment. I don't think that there is a counter of bonus exp for each skill or even in total...

Edit: but it is a nice idea

Edited October 9, 2009 by groomsh

[Dilly]

This would count the all skills exp, reduce current exp and then give you that exp or percentage of it as overall exp (not adding scholars day bonus!)

I guess this is a showstopper at the moment. I don't think that there is a counter of bonus exp for each skill or even in total...

Edit: but it is a nice idea

 

Groomsh, you still get to keep the scholarsday bonus for the individual skills, but the OA bonus you've previously gained on scholarsdays would be lost forever. Small compromise for something that will make EL life a lot more enjoyable for people who like to try out different setups, I'd say.

[Dugur]

Meant that you can't use the stone on a scholars day, so the oa exp regained won't get the day bonus.

The skill bonuses of scholars days from _past_ will stay obviously, and as Dilly stated the part of oa exp scholars days from _past_ will be ignored. This is minor inaccuracy on the total oa exp counts.

[Aislinn]

1. I don't think reset should be easy, this wasn't meant to be an "easy" game.

2. I really don't like rl$ affecting the game so much. I don't like gc sales, I don't like character buying/selling, and I would rather shop items be items or services that don't affect "gameplay".

This gives WAY too much advantage to $ spending. Don't like it at all.

[groomsh]

Meant that you can't use the stone on a scholars day, so the oa exp regained won't get the day bonus.

Ah ok, i got it wrong then...

[Dugur]

1. I don't think reset should be easy, this wasn't meant to be an "easy" game.

2. I really don't like rl$ affecting the game so much. I don't like gc sales, I don't like character buying/selling, and I would rather shop items be items or services that don't affect "gameplay".

This gives WAY too much advantage to $ spending. Don't like it at all.

 

There are many players that never reset. Atm the game allows tweaking build without reset, using removal stones, while in past only thing you could do is #reset. This is plain business (gotta love the smell of $$$ in the mornings), not just making things easy for players. If you can point out a really heavy argument on how this makes a reset easy or painless, I'll reconsider my opinions. There's no need to fool oneself with the thought that the game isn't affected by $ already. How else would the rostos be known as bricks?

This isn't just game, it's business for some.

[Aislinn]

1. I don't think reset should be easy, this wasn't meant to be an "easy" game.

2. I really don't like rl$ affecting the game so much. I don't like gc sales, I don't like character buying/selling, and I would rather shop items be items or services that don't affect "gameplay".

This gives WAY too much advantage to $ spending. Don't like it at all.

 

There are many players that never reset. Atm the game allows tweaking build without reset, using removal stones, while in past only thing you could do is #reset. This is plain business (gotta love the smell of $$$ in the mornings), not just making things easy for players. If you can point out a really heavy argument on how this makes a reset easy or painless, I'll reconsider my opinions. There's no need to fool oneself with the thought that the game isn't affected by $ already. How else would the rostos be known as bricks?

This isn't just game, it's business for some.

I know it is, but most of it didn't happen by game design, even if it has been "allowed".

I see no reason to force more of the same. I would remove the rl$ influence already in the game, rather than add more.

I don't feel that saying "but rl$ already influences the game (especially since it is not a "good thing")" is a valid reason to make a suggestion making the problem even bigger.

Business can be conducted with things that do not massively affect gameplay as far as gc/items/stats go. (And yes, totally bypassing a #reset with rl $ does affect your stats, even if you did originally "earn" them). I love the smell of rl$$$ in real life. I don't care for it at all in EL.

 

#reset is a luxury, not a punishment.

 

(btw, I don't care nor do I need to change your opinion, I am stating mine)

[Dilly]

1. I don't think reset should be easy, this wasn't meant to be an "easy" game.

2. I really don't like rl$ affecting the game so much. I don't like gc sales, I don't like character buying/selling, and I would rather shop items be items or services that don't affect "gameplay".

This gives WAY too much advantage to $ spending. Don't like it at all.

 

Could be a Tanta-sold item costing 1Mgc too (NPC name, and price both random), doesn't really matter to me. I agree, reset recovery shouldn't be easy, but as Dugur suggested, it could maybe be made so that it's just an aid, after you've already gained a very fair amount of OA back.

 

But as time goes on, people are getting to such enormous OA levels, and I see more and more of them get stuck, and bored, because they just can't seem to manage to change their build around using removals/bought pickpoints without investing huge amounts of time and gc. It isn't that surprising for someone to want to try out something else after having been on a certain track for years, especially in a classless game, right? Not everyone feels like starting a new char from scratch to do the same thing they did years ago on their current char.

 

EL may not be intended to be easy, but I think it's safe to assume that it was made for people to enjoy themselves while they do play it. Is it supposed to be fun, and enjoyable for resetrecovery to be close to impossible once you decide to take a different approach after gaining 140 OA levels the first time around?

Edited October 9, 2009 by Dilly

[Aislinn]

1. I don't think reset should be easy, this wasn't meant to be an "easy" game.

2. I really don't like rl$ affecting the game so much. I don't like gc sales, I don't like character buying/selling, and I would rather shop items be items or services that don't affect "gameplay".

This gives WAY too much advantage to $ spending. Don't like it at all.

 

Could be a Tanta-sold item too, doesn't really matter to me. I agree, reset recovery shouldn't be easy, but as Dugur suggested, it could maybe be made so that it's just an aid, after you've already gained a very fair amount of OA back.

 

But as time goes on, people are getting to such enormous OA levels, and I see more and more of them get stuck, and bored, because they just can't seem to manage to change their build around using removals/bought pickpoints without investing huge amounts of time and gc. It isn't that surprising for someone to want to try out something else after having been on a certain track for years, especially in a classless game, right? Not everyone feels like starting a new char from scratch to do the same thing they did years ago on their current char.

 

EL may not be intended to be easy, but I think it's safe to assume that it was made for people to enjoy themselves while they do play it. Is it supposed to be fun, and enjoyable for resetrecovery to be close to impossible once you decide to take a different approach after gaining 140 OA levels the first time around?

I'm curious how many people have those enormous OA levels that didn't buy an already leveled character. Most that I have seen wouldn't be in that boat without character buying, once again rl$ falsely inflating EL standards.

[Dilly]

OA 140 brings you to the top 100 ranking for overall levels. I don't know all of course, and couldn't count the names that were -private-, but I was able to identify at least 50 of those names as characters that are still being played by their original creator.

 

Right after that come a whole bunch of other originals that have levelled their character all from scratch as well.

[Aislinn]

OA 140 brings you to the top 100 ranking for overall levels. I don't know all of course, and couldn't count the names that were -private-, but I was able to identify at least 50 of those names as characters that are still being played by their original creator.

 

Right after that come a whole bunch of other originals that have levelled their character all from scratch as well.

Assuming that 50 number is correct, I don't have the time at the moment to check, I am pretty sure all of those don't want the easy way out either. I know a fair number of them too

[Dugur]

If we really think that this is ebul rich real life ppl scheme of epic power leveling, it can be implemented other ways too...

As Dilly said, pay 1 milliong gc to Tanta. Or make it a quest with roleplay spice and so on.

Since we have PP buying in, we can add soft reset with a liiiiiittle work. Here is the other, dev side time consuming and therefore not so profitable, way:

 

NPC in a stonehenge, such a lovely cliche it has to be done. Or just in Idaloran in middle of the rocks that make it a stonehengy feeling.

S/he mumbles some RPG stuff telling you s/he found ways of bla bla and doing bla bla and then to interesting part: Bring me a shrubbery and I will attempt to regain some of your lost memories from the past. It can be also cutting an oak tree with a herring or just big load of cash with any item that is good to remove from game (hydro bars, scales, enriched essence, rare stones (*cough rosto cough* oh the corruption of $?) Great, you gather the loot, do some rituals and get those memories back - 10% of lost reset exp regained. Still something missing? Bring more stuff to get more exp back... Limit of gaining exp back decided by those who have the powers.

And the beauty of this is you add fail rate, ha!

And of course the NPC doesn't talk to you on Scholars day since they are doing some research on the memory haxing.

 

Bit more complicated, but gives more to the game.

[Aislinn]

Lol I don't like it no matter how you change the description. As I said already, #reset is a gift, not a punishment.

You have your opinoin, I have mine.

[MasterZen]

Even tho i would like something like this implemented (only cause i like to see different set ups working), i even brought it up once in another topic..

Tho i do have to stand with aislinn in this matter, not for the reasons she stated but just because of this:

 

I'm a massive resetter, i never made it hagher then oa lvl 80 i believe (untill now, since i refuse to reset again), i did this to see how different set ups would look like..

 

So if i counted up all my gained exp, i believe (not in game atm) i will have around 125 mill exp, this will get me to let's say oa 120..

But atm im only oa 98, so with buying a stone no matter at which cost real $$$ or in game GC, i will gain free 22 lvls..

 

And i wouldnt be surprised when im not alone in this matter, so while everyone is hoping to remove the pp buying matter u are suggesting a new way of free PP's (sure i did work for them, but my recebt oa lvl is not showing them)..

 

Another matter, a lot of people bought pp's, for those people this stone is of no use, they have more pp's spend then there is shown in their skill exp..

 

my 2cents..

Edited October 9, 2009 by MasterZen

[Lorck]

As much as i respect Aislinn's opinion, my own opinion is this: people resetted before the removal stones. People who tried to do a "clean build" in the past, lost their OA, FOREVER. I myself resetted once because Entropy changed the way SRs could be used while fighting, making my veg nexus useless, i resetted to have the pps back, and my OA was lost foverer.

 

Nobody said the removal stone should be "an easy" way to work around reset.

EDIT:

i will gain free 22 lvls..

They are not free. You worked in game for those levels.

EDIT2: And this is coming from someone who got posting restriction in this forum because i called someone "char buyer".

Edited October 9, 2009 by Lorck

[conavar]

#reset is a luxury, not a punishment.

 

Never reset at high OA ? If you had you would realise that yes it is a punishment (based on how other MMO's handle resets).. Spend X amount of years developing your character and decide you want to go a differant track or change things you have the following options:

 

A ) Spend another X amount of time earning GC to buy removal stones

B ) Buy GC for $ and buy the stones on the market ( easiest option by far)

C ) Reset and spend another 6 months to a year (maybe more) getting those OA levels back .

 

Should the game be easy ? No it shouldnt, it should be fun not a lesson in hard labour.

 

TBH Radu should just sell a soft reset service from the shop. $50 Resets all your perks and PP's while leaving OA intact.. win for the player, win for the game earning $

 

I'm curious how many people have those enormous OA levels that didn't buy an already leveled character. Most that I have seen wouldn't be in that boat without character buying, once again rl$ falsely inflating EL standards.

 

OA 143 Original owner and character never shared ( OA would be higher but stopped leveling 5-6 months ago)

Edited October 9, 2009 by conavar

[Aislinn]

People aren't here because it's like every other game.

#reset is a gift as it is, rather than just be stuck as you are. Nobody is asking players to ruin their characters by cramming everything bad on it they can just because the 50 lemmings before them did it as well.

Removal stones are above and beyond that.

It all boils down to whether you believe EL should be ruled by money or free play to be whatever is being labeled as "competitive" these days.

As I said, I am not out to change anybody's opinion, I am pointing out mine and why I don't like the idea.

 

And reread my post, I did not say everybody over 140 o/a or whatever o/a you pick, did not singlehandedly reach that himself. I am pretty aware of who did and didn't. Kudos to you who did.

[Dugur]

So if i counted up all my gained exp, i believe (not in game atm) i will have around 125 mill exp, this will get me to let's say oa 120..

But atm im only oa 98, so with buying a stone no matter at which cost real $$$ or in game GC, i will gain free 22 lvls..

 

Fail.

oa 98 ~40 million exp

125-40 = 85 million exp

 

If using the option where 50% of the exp is returned you get +42,5 million = 113 oa.

 

It was mentioned in original post with several examples. One use / reset. The percentage of exp returned is to be decided by development team. The more it returns the more moolah can be gained. Notice this is calced with the 50 % value, I haven't straightly suggested it has to be 50% or 100% or anything. Just pointed out there is a hole for business, and looks like there are ppl that would use the chance.

And this is about the last opportunity to make $ from nothing, new players won't need to reset and they won't get much use of the stone anyway. The segment is for oldbies who were there when several changes came in and therefore reset. A new player has much more stabile playground here atm and once they get few nexus bought or even pps, there won't be a reset to lose exp.

[korrode]

I'm not completely sure yet what i think about the 'get OA you would have had if you never reset', but for this:

TBH Radu should just sell a soft reset service from the shop. $50 Resets all your perks and PP's while leaving OA intact.. win for the player, win for the game earning $

I agree completely.

 

I'm curious how many people have those enormous OA levels that didn't buy an already leveled character. Most that I have seen wouldn't be in that boat without character buying, once again rl$ falsely inflating EL standards.

 

OA 143 Original owner and character never shared ( OA would be higher but stopped leveling 5-6 months ago)

My qualifications aren't quite as impressive as Conavar's, but original owner, currently 132 OA, last reset was iirc 128, and reset before at least 100+.

Each reset could've been prevented with the current array of removal stones, so I am leaning towards agreeing with the 'get OA you would have had' idea...

 

If i calc'ed it all right, i would be OA 148 right now, instead of 132.

 

But the game does say "beta". I expect the pickpoint buyers to accept losing their hard work with no compensation, so i'd be a hypocrite if i now expected compensation for the fact that items implemented since my resets would have prevented those resets... ofc, compensating me can be done without "omfg ruin the economy" and with radu making some nice $.

[Dugur]

But the game does say "beta". I expect the pickpoint buyers to accept losing their hard work with no compensation, so i'd be a hypocrite if i now expected compensation for the fact that items implemented since my resets would have prevented those resets... ofc, compensating me can be done without "omfg ruin the economy" and with radu making some nice $.

 

Hallelujah sister, nuff said. Fully agree.