One character per person at a time

[Dchels]

I vote no,

 

Only because the two options are extreme, there is a need to address the use of an alt which only is used for the purpose of making gold coins through harving for turning into $'s.

 

If it can be regulated to stop this that would be a better option instead of stopping EL players who genuinly train an alt for enjoyment, either because their main has slowed down levelling or they are taking a different path of play.

 

I regulary play two characters and anything i do in game is for the benifit of the characters only, at times i would mix FE's on them at the same time, collect ings on one as the other is fighting, is this wrong, i dont think so.

 

Address alts that harv only and sell for gc, the tranactions will be there in the logs and produce a rule to combat this. If indeed this is causing a problem. I dont feel those playing more than one character fairly and in the "spirit of the game" should suffer out of someone elses selfishness.

[Raz]

Definitely a YES!

 

Even if 2 characters do not interract in any way - whilst you are training one - the other harvests and increases it's store.

Swap over every few days - lots of gc

[tokie]

One Person. One Character. Prove who you are. No exceptions.

If the MoDs can tell that I am "trading excessivly" with my Wife,Taini,then they can tell if I suddenly have 1 Mil. gc in my storage. Hold those accountable who have no-explaination for the sudden buldge in their wallet.

"If they didnt get it from Eternal Lands the right way, they have no-buisness playing Eternal Lands".

 

Want two Characters from the same I.P.Address ? Prove that there are two diferent players. Just as we did.

Still want an "Alt" ? Dont sign it on when your Main is on, and dont suddenly have one go broke, then 5 minutes later have the other come on, rich as Hell,"with no-explaination as to where the gc came from".

...it's just that simple...

 

Tokie

[Gohan]

There's a very popular solution to gold farmers in most online games.

 

Find them, ban them.

 

*creeps out again*

 

-Gohan

[Burn]

I think the Yes-people need to start providing some (any for that matter) sort of proof that they actually thought this through, and see exactly how this would solve the problem.

 

The problem is not people playing multiple characters as several yessers have focused on.

 

The problem is gold farmers, something done even by people with only one character.

 

 

Show me, and everyone else, exactly how this "definition of overkill" SOLVES the problem of gold farming. Explain how it will affect those who gold farm with only one character.

 

And explain to us how you managed to put a Yes on such a horridly-biased question which makes you look like you approve of gold farmers if you dare disagree with this one OBVIOUSLY WRONG non-solution.

[HereticEast]

Who said a human would be doing that?

The server runs the game and the server can do all the hard work. Just give the server some parameters to work on and a few new fields or a new database table.

 

By the way, scrutinizing every single transaction up to 5+ trades away from you is already done by the server for checking same IP trades.

 

and for this those parameters would be very easy to bypass while increasing

the number of logs that need to be looked at. what are you going to do look at

every trade where someone just gives another character some gc? harvest rate?

you'd spend a lot of time unbanning people.

[Garnoo]

forbid gc buy/sell so no point having a harvesting alt and just buy from shop. How to find out ? gc sellers are known, just track their trades if its a solution to the "gc inflation"

Do you spend your real $$ to buy things from shop? I don't. So I simply pay a gc buyer to get my color/name/whatever change and everyone is happy: I get my color change and the other one gets my gc...what's the problem with that?

 

Same principle, it takes time to get gc, time is worth money. Ingame gc DOES have an irl worth, because people are willing to spend irl cash on saving time and becomming successfull sooner.

 

Many mmorpgs forbid trading rpgcurrency with irl currency.. While it's a good thought, its basically impossible to do. I like the idea of only one character logged in at a time per person.

 

While we're already discussing gold farming, why not ban character sales? It's basically the same thing.

As long as there is a shop there is also an irl worth. For me the gc buyers I sold to only made my el life better. From a half-free/half-paid game they turned it into a fully free game. And I believe it is my right and everyones right to sell anything and demand anything in return (as long as it sticks to the rules). So if I did understand correctly it is about equal opportunity for everyone and if you forbid gc buying/selling and leave the shop there then THAT wouldn't be equal opportunity anymore.

 

 

Just my 2 (whatever you want to call it).

[RallosZek]

[1] Instead forbid gc for dollar on the free server, create a second server where dollar payments can be used to acquire items or characters and take a cut. The price of playing on the free server then is that a) you can't get any real life money for your time and that you're subject to economy balancing changes before they are implemented on the "dollar server" and highly encouraged to give feedback on those.

 

I think a bigger problem is people selling gc for RL cash to other players, not so much the purchases made in the EL shop. Just my opinion tho.

And the gc is used to acquire items. What I'm proposing is for people on the "Dollar Server" to be able to officially buy say 100k iron for 20 dollar, through the game itself and that Radu takes a cut on each transaction, so there is no more need for people to trade gc/dollar if they can immediately acquire from players what they need and the actual problem (not enough revenue created to sustain the game) is tackled as well.

[Burn]

Um.... btw, Radu already said no to this last night. This is the discussion following this idea being brought up last night on channel 6:

 

 

[02:26:21] [asgnny @ 6]: instead of trying to sabotage the economy, can you please at least consider my proposal? :/

[02:26:27] [radu @ 6]: no

[02:26:32] [radu @ 6]: I considered it

[02:26:37] [radu @ 6]: many times

[02:26:37] [asgnny @ 6]: and what's the problem?

[02:26:47] [radu @ 6]: umm.. that it wastes my time?

[02:26:50] [asgnny @ 6]: how?

[02:26:51] [usl @ 6]: Attila, it is inflation. Doesn't matter how much you buy, all prices will increase accordingly, so your spending power will be the same

[02:26:56] [bkc56 @ 6]: Still curious how you'd limit it asgnny?

[02:26:58] [asgnny @ 6]: no coding needed, no work for you

[02:27:04] [radu @ 6]: because banned people come to me as well?

[02:27:14] [asgnny @ 6]: so tell them to go to the bans forum

[02:27:22] [asgnny @ 6]: the person who banned them will deal with it

[02:27:40] [radu @ 6]: yes, but still

[02:27:46] [conavar @ 6]: what do the other admin/mods think gnny ?

[02:27:49] [radu @ 6]: reading and replyign to 50 people a day is not my idea of fun

[02:30:18] [radu @ 6]: also, this does nto address the issue of people farmign with one char only

[conavar]

Well if its by this suggestion or another means something needs to be done tbh.

Edited April 1, 2009 by conavar

[DHT]

There's gold farming (in ways like Labby does or Yeti farmers do) and gold harving (like people in tit mine used to do). These are two different things that bring the same result - lots of gcs and resources into the game. There's an easy way to fight gold harving. Quote from Gohan: Find them, ban them.

[Aislinn]

After that conversation in 6 and more conversation in mod:

#Mod Chat from radu: anyway, gnny, post it in the forums, see what they think

#Mod Chat from asgnny: I will definitely do so

[HereticEast]

what about selling some cheaper bound non transferable items at the store? like rostos that

the character that bought them can't sell. this would ensure the shop would get all or most the money

spent for rostos etc. and would not affect the economy too much. except for inflated rosto prices

etc.

Edited April 1, 2009 by HereticEast

[piiia]

i voted no,

 

although i completely understand the problem of the inflation!

 

but i try to explain why i created an alt myself.

 

i was so bored of my main character piiia in the past.. she is an allrounder and because her oa is pretty high now, levelling is hard. i had no goal and no fun. especially, since i have less time to play i couldnt find anything that i could do in 3-4 hours a day.

 

so i decided to start again from the beginning. i want to train my alt in 1 or 2 different skills than my main character, so it will become kind of my second main and much more specialized. i dont make any money with my alt. her purse is smaller than piiia's if that is possible at all.

 

my alt is my hobby and if i will lose my alt, i dont know how long i will have fun with the game. well.. thats my opinion

 

[RallosZek]

Definitely a YES!

 

Even if 2 characters do not interract in any way - whilst you are training one - the other harvests and increases it's store.

Swap over every few days - lots of gc

 

This is a problem not related to alts, but to how the game works. If this were a seperate person you'd have no problem with it, in fact you'd find joy in the higher number of online players. Don't be misled by the poll answers that alts are bad for the game. There are basic economic flaws in the gameplay that have been hashed, rehashed and rejected year by year, that cause inflation and as a side effect, stimulate gold coin farming.

The problem is that this bypasses the game's (real life) income, so the solution is rather simple: find a way to integrate it into the game and generate revenue from it.

Edited April 1, 2009 by RallosZek

[Garnoo]

what about selling some cheaper bound non transferable items at the store? like rostos that

the character that bought them can't sell. this would ensure the shop would get all or most the money

spent for rostos etc. and would not affect the economy too much.

iirc the rare stones coming from random events isn't that high hence the high prices they are sold and bought for so the way I see it your suggestion will only make things worse.

[DogBreath]

Something like: You may not make/play a character for the sole purpose of harvesting gcs...

 

*shamelessly quotes self*

any chance of you adding this option to the voting? Then I'd vote

[Burn]

I'm awaiting the yes-people explaining how this solves the problem of gold farming, not having multiple characters.

 

Particularly those with only one account, as Radu stated in the quoted discussion is a problem.

 

This is a solution to a problem that doesn't exist, not to the problem of gold farming.

 

 

I am in agreement that something needs to be done about gold farming. I highly disagree that this is a solution, and only the simplest of thought shows that it's not. It won't even slow it down.

 

Do I have a solution? No, other than the community taking a stand against these people and treating them like "outlaws" are treated, as they should be.

 

But implementing something that is NOT the solution based on a horridly-biased poll that is worded in such a way that anyone saying "no" looks bad by default is hardly a reasonable action.

[Wynand]

Didn't read all the comments, don't have time, so excuse me of my answer is redundant but:

 

Why not just program the game client so that you cannot have more than one client open at a time on the same PC? Problem probably wont go away, but it will be much decreased. (also the biggest gc seller of all time uses a single char )

 

Anyways just a suggestion, don't really care either way. Voted yes though.

[conavar]

what about selling some cheaper bound non transferable items at the store? like rostos that

the character that bought them can't sell. this would ensure the shop would get all or most the money

spent for rostos etc. and would not affect the economy too much.

 

That will the make the problem worse IMO

 

Personally out of principle and wanting to support the game will only buy items from the shop, such as rosto's to sell for gc (it saves me ingame time so i can concentrate on doing what I enjoy)

 

Now if I couldnt sell those bought items then the only option would be to buy from GC sellers = less money for teh boss

Edited April 1, 2009 by conavar

[Aislinn]

my alt is my hobby and if i will lose my alt, i dont know how long i will have fun with the game. well.. thats my opinion

You wouldn't lose your alt, you would not be able to log it on at the same time as your other character. One at a time.

[Entropy]

IMO inflation is caused by lowering rates for certain resources like enriched essies and rostos for example so more ppl are forced to buy them from shop. Unfortunatelly supply of items bought from shop is not enough and relation USD to gc is causing these items to be expensive which in turn increases costs for production (like EFE cost) and training (rosto cost). Maybe little offtopic or maybe not. As for the voting - I abstain.

 

Well, until a while ago, if people wanted gold, they bought EFEs from the shop. So there were plenty of EFEs, and the price was relatively low.

Now people want to get 'deals', so they buy stuf from the gold farmers. We need to make some money too, so we have to decrease the EFE rate. Eventually, when the EFE will be around 16kgc, then people will buy back from us.

[Wizzy]

It is noted and appreciated, that at least a couple people who say "no way" are offering at least an attempt at a "better" solution.

The problem isn't going to go away, so if you want to angrily object to this idea, at least offer something you think is better.

forbid gc buy/sell so no point having a harvesting alt and just buy from shop. How to find out ? gc sellers are known, just track their trades if its a solution to the "gc inflation"

 

But, not this : if harvest alts are removed, it means less harvesters, therefore => Less stones found. So counterpart, less stones ingame means their price will increase - along with coal/silver/iron etc i expect because there will be less ressources entering the game. Assgny said "resulting in massive infusion of unnatural gc into the game." He is wrong again, it is not GC entering the game but flowers/ore/stones. You do not harvest GC right ?...

 

This is a good point

 

However, since these items coming into game, like binding stones, efe, can be controled by the server. If radu thinks that a certain week 20 rare items are to come into game, it doesnt matter if there are 100 people harvesting or 500, the same amount can be programmed to come into game. These events are not as random as we think they are. some of this depends on el shop. But I would guess, EL makes more money from services, rostogols, thermal serps then from MM capes, ele's. Of course I might be very wrong about all of this. This is just the way I see things

[LabRat]

What I do is not illegal and not bannable.

 

Why should I be banned?

 

From my point of view I have invested in the game to the tune of at least $1000 in bots, and more still in p2p for myself and friends.

 

It was always my intention to treat EL as a RL business - put in stake money and over time take money out. This is all I am doing.

 

I do not multiplay. I do not cheat. i do not break rules. So again I ask why should I be banned - and from what I have seen posted on @@6 why should Radu tell players not to trade with me and ban me from their bots?

[01:35:49] [Quesar @ 6]: how can the majority of players that AREN'T doing the gc buying/selling fix things/

[01:35:57] [radu @ 6]: simple

[01:36:03] [radu @ 6]: don't sell anything to thsoe who do

[01:36:12] [radu @ 6]: ban them from your bots

Edited April 1, 2009 by LabRat

[Michic0_oL]

If you don't want people to AFK harvest

 

I say...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

... Bring back the "Click each time to harvest a harvestable" this way, you can have 2 players online but if you want to harvest... you cannot play the other chara since you have to click each time (very old times ) -

 

It's the same as flee 15 rounds for xp to prevent from afk training. But it would penalize people only harvesting with 1 char.

 

So, make it something like : IF 2 chars for 1 person -> Then u need to click each time you harvest. If not, leave it regular harvesting system. (but there is a problem for ≠ People on same ip i'm sure you can find a solution though :>)