should messages be filtered while in console?

[ttlanhil]

Attention! For those of you who don't read the thread first (indicating that your opinion is of little value anyway), the votes have been counted and a decision made already. stop voting, you're wasting your time

 

anyone who has used one of my precompiled clients, compiled CVS themselves, the JusT client, or any other vesion newer than the release will have seen the new tab system (if you haven't, and you wanna see the new tab bar, click here)

 

you may have noticed that while in console, if you use any tab other than 'view all', the scrolling doesn't work as you expect. it still acts as if the other messages are there, and you may have to press up/down several times to get the desired effect

when changing tabs, it will also shrink the message upwards... if half the messages on your screen in 'view all' were on a non-active channel, the page would then only be half long

this situation isn't ideal.

 

for now, I've disabled filtering in console in CVS, since that's a lot less work than making filtering work

 

so I want to know what the players would prefer.

the first option is to make scrolling work properly in console. it'll be filtered by tab, same as in the main window

second and third options are to not filter it; it will act as it currently does, but the tab bar will be present so you can change your active channel with a click.

if you want the console to remain unfiltered (I think it's more useful this way, and will stay more familiar), then decide if you think the 'view all' tab button should be shown.

if yes, the tab bar will stay the same whether in console or not

if no, then you don't have a redundant 'view all' button while in console (you're always in 'view all' mode anyway)

 

and while I'm at it, do people want an option to jump multiple pages, perhaps also jump to start/end?

I'd have to check what key combos are available, but I'm thinking shift+pageup/dn to jump 10 pages, alt+pageup/dn to jump 50, and ctrl+home/end to jump to start/end of console messages

(note that ctrl+pageup/dn is not available, that's used to cycling through tabs)

 

if you want something a bit different to this, feel free to post another opinion for consideration

 

please take a bit of time to consider what would work best for you; and if you haven't tried out the new tabs and such, please give it a go (JusT client, my precompiled client(see my siggy), compile your own CVS, whichever option you prefer)

 

please don't post anything else about changing the new tab system, stuff like re-adding the console button to the HUD('history' tab replaced it); the development of that was done in another thread, in public, quite a while ago. you had a chance to comment then, and you can start a new thread about it if you have spent a while trying it out. but not here

ed: found the original thread here

Edited May 3, 2006 by ttlanhil

[Arnieman]

Chat Filtering - yeah, it would be nice to be properly filtered in console... I'll wait and see what happens.

 

Multiple page scrolling in chat logs - I really don't care - I mean, I get times I leave my client on for awhile - it'd be nice to to be able to have a quick way of jumping from beginning to end, and back again. On the other hand, I don't see why this is a needed feature. Then again, it's not me putting the work into it, so do I care?

 

Anything else I could comment? I think ttl's last line kinda silenced the only real objection to the new chat tabs - at least here.

[70347]

I think that there should be a key combo that would send you to the end of the log, but I don't think a 10 or 50 key is needed. It would be nice if there was a key that sent you to the time in the chat log when you were afk last, for people who go afk for long periods of time and want to hear what people are saying.

[Aislinn]

the first option is to make scrolling work properly in console. it'll be filtered by tab, same as in the main window

What would end up in the chatlog then and how would it be laid out?

 

and while I'm at it, do people want an option to jump multiple pages, perhaps also jump to start/end?

I'd have to check what key combos are available, but I'm thinking shift+pageup/dn to jump 10 pages, alt+pageup/dn to jump 50, and ctrl+home/end to jump to start/end of console messages

(note that ctrl+pageup/dn is not available, that's used to cycling through tabs)

Can we get this for windowed and old behavior as well? I would LOVE this but I normally use old behavior.

[ttlanhil]

What would end up in the chatlog then and how would it be laid out?

chat_log happens before it's filtered; there'd be no change. I have, before, made it so you can log each channel to a seperate file, but that can make a directory rather full (considering how many channels someone may join in a year. between that and rotating out log files over a certain size, I had dozens of files in a short testing period)

Can we get this for windowed and old behavior as well? I would LOVE this but I normally use old behavior.

the fact that it uses tabs would be pretty much irrelevant, it'd only affect the console anyway. the chat shown in main window will still not be anything except the latest messages.

although it may be easy to add it to windowed chat as well, i don't know yet

[ttlanhil]

okay, because of the upcoming feature freeze, Ima close this issue as of now (I had hoped for more votes, though, it's only a small percentage of people who use the client who voted... oh well)

 

the verdicts:

poll 1: filter console?

no, 13:11

leave the view-all tab present, 9:4

 

poll 2: scroll jumping

yes: 11, no: 12

since the people who don't want it don't have to use it, the 'yes' vote gets a slight weighting (had 'no' gained a significant margin, yes, that would have won)

Ima take the distribution of yes votes as interest mainly in jumping to start/end(mainly end ), so that (coupled with jumping 10 pages being bad for searching) will be the one added, as alt+pageup/dn

[Aislinn]

okay, because of the upcoming feature freeze, Ima close this issue as of now (I had hoped for more votes, though, it's only a small percentage of people who use the client who voted... oh well)

 

the verdicts:

poll 1: filter console?

no, 13:11

leave the view-all tab present, 9:4

 

poll 2: scroll jumping

yes: 11, no: 12

since the people who don't want it don't have to use it, the 'yes' vote gets a slight weighting (had 'no' gained a significant margin, yes, that would have won)

Ima take the distribution of yes votes as interest mainly in jumping to start/end(mainly end ), so that (coupled with jumping 10 pages being bad for searching) will be the one added, as alt+pageup/dn

So what I think you said is:

You won't filter the console, but will leave the view-all tab, and you will only have jumping to start and end and NOT the 10 page increments?

[ttlanhil]

So what I think you said is:

You won't filter the console, but will leave the view-all tab, and you will only have jumping to start and end and NOT the 10 page increments?

yeah. if a few people can explain situations where holding the pageup/dn key when you're searching for something isn't good enough, then a 10page jump can be added... but as a teaser(or hint, if you prefer)... I think being able to search back through the chatlog for whatever word would be the best option if searching is the goal...

[Aislinn]

Well I personally would have liked that because I am always searching back in my f1 for info on players, #abuses, modchat about various things that happened while I was afk so I know what people are talking when they are complaining about this or that. Sometimes when I just do the pg up key it freezes after a certain amount and won't go further up although I know there is more there.

Oh well, if I'm the only one who wants it, I won't whine too much then for it. I'll give searching back with a word search a try though if you are willing to do that.

[ttlanhil]

Well I personally would have liked that because I am always searching back in my f1 for info on players, #abuses, modchat about various things that happened while I was afk so I know what people are talking when they are complaining about this or that.

yeah, I often have to seach back as well, but jumping pages is a good way to miss stuff *shrug*

Sometimes when I just do the pg up key it freezes after a certain amount and won't go further up although I know there is more there.

odd, I don't recall a bug report about that... maybe it's because you're online for too long (no, seriously, the client records a max of 5000 lines, then starts replacing old ones, this is when you start to get the old-message flicker on main screen when the messages move up)

if there's something stopping pageup from working, though, jumping 10 pageups at a time will do nothing to help it

 

ed: oh yeah... look for `#find text`, coming to a client near you soon!

Edited May 3, 2006 by ttlanhil

[Mar(c)]

Before the update, I had chat filtering in my client, and it worked fine as far as I can tell.

I have tabbed chat, and I fail to see the purpose of the buttons in console mode –– other than highlighting another channel or closing a channel (and this is only for channels, not for PM/local/server/etc.).

 

Or in other words, I don't get it, the "no" options in the first poll.

Certainly not the "no, but show the 'view all' tab" option... it's completely useless now!

 

Anyway, I miss the functionality badly...

To be able to click on one of the buttons, so only that channel/etc. talk (plus PM's) is visible, was a great way to view back what was missed.

 

So, is it still being worked on, and/or will it come back in the upcoming (bug fix) client?

You said yourself "this situation isn't ideal" (about scrolling still acting as if the other messages are there, and the messages leaving a half-blank screen), but it worked, didn't it?

 

 

 

Secondly (but maybe not for the upcoming client), I'd like to make this suggestion:

Equip all channel/etc. buttons with an on/off functionality, so you can read back mixed chat (from related channels), e.g. guild channel chat plus #gm/#ig, or channel chat plus local chat.

(Maybe also put all PM's under one button?)

 

 

 

ed: oh yeah... look for `#find text`, coming to a client near you soon!

This one is nice!

[Mar(c)]

So, is it still being worked on, and/or will it come back in the upcoming (bug fix) client?

Nothing about this, before the upcoming bug fix client?

[ttlanhil]

Nothing about this, before the upcoming bug fix client?

hmm, I kinda forgot about this... the good news is that the idea for console change I mentioned in another thread also makes this easy to do. once we have a fixed 1.3.1 out, and it's time to work on features again, it can be made ready for testing

[Mar(c)]

Ah, good thing I bumped it then!

 

Sounds good, I'll be glad to help testing and suggesting.

 

 

 

Suggestion:

Equip all channel/etc. buttons with an on/off functionality, so you can read back mixed chat (from related channels), e.g. guild channel chat plus #gm/#ig, or channel chat plus local chat.

(Maybe also put all PM's under one button?)

 • Click on a channel button to filter it to only that channel.

 • Shift-click to add (or remove) a channel to the filter, so you get mixed chat.

 

I hope that's not making the programming too complicated..