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Quinticus

Summoning

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When reviewing ttlanhil's post on life essences i was struct with an odd curiosity. So perhaps Lyanna and Roja could help us out in this area.

 

Due to Mortos' curse, nothing in EL can die. Well they can't die permenantly. Even the animals and monsters are doomed to an eternity of dying and then returning. So, my question is:

 

If nothing can permenantly die...how does summoning work? Reanimation, as i understood it, involves the returning of a soul to it's dead body. Nothing dies in EL so the soul/life force returns automatically.

 

If somehow one is able to pull a soul from the precurse time...what's to stop that soul from getting caught up in the curse once it has returned?

 

Just kind of confusing to me. Can anyone clear this up, or should we dedicate this thread to fixing it?

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Hehe... I was JUST about to ask you to start a discussion on this, Quint. Looks like you beat me to the idea. ;)

 

We'll need this thread to talk about it. In fact, this was one of the biggest issues I had doubts about when writing my Main Story. I know Roja said she was taking some time off to work on clarifying things like this, so maybe she has some ideas?

 

If not, then this thread is open for input and discussion from anybody.

 

-Lyn-

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I spoke to lyanna about this, she was going to find out if Roja had any points on this.

 

as to the summoned creatures not being respawned, I imagined this as because the life they get isn't 'real' in the sence the respawning ones are, and so immune to the curse of mortos. the way the essence and body parts dissapear sort of works for this as well.

 

the rest of my ideas, at the end of my post on life essences (storylines)

 

<edit>

whoops, lyanna beat me to it 8^)

my post that i referenced to is here, the relevant part is about a page and a half on my screen, near the end of the first post

Edited by ttlanhil

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My first guess is that you aren't summoning a soul, but temporarily putting life into the matter and it is soul less. That is what they dtay near their creator and don't act like a normal animal/monster.

 

Since it doesn't have a soul, it also escapes the curse, bit that is also why di dies off quickly as the magic wears off.

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Not only do we have the problem that the eternally living are being brought back to life, but also summoning is considered a dark art. Which is, as i gather it, something Mortos is keen to dabble in :P.

 

Here is something i was thinking. Perhaps, since Mortos originated the curse, he is free to take what souls he wishes. He takes souls to twist, mangle, and corrupt them. When one summons a creature, they are pulling that tortured soul from it's prison. After all, mortos needs souls to make goblins and such.

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well, selain is the god of summoning, and might object to mortos dabbling in his field.

and the curse was altered by a number of the other gods, led by aluwen in that, to its current form, so mortos isn't really in charge anymore

mortos being able to claim some souls sounds interesting though.

perhaps those from long ago found a way to escape the endless life and aging, some sort of ritual, or better yet, offering their services to mortos, and those are where he got some of his souls

Edited by ttlanhil

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The way i was figuring it, selain and mortos have been working hand in hand for sometime because of the great war. You are right on the aluwen part, though. Just trying to throw ideas out. Personally i think the mortos being able to snatch some souls for his own amusement kinda sounds like some teachers and professors i know. So i'm partial to it. :P

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would mortos (and maybe selain, since they worked together) have enough of a following that their deciples could have people kidnapped and ritually killed? would they be able to get enough souls for mortos to play with and create monsters?

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Try some alternative angles as well. What if a Life Essence is NOT a soul, but just some concrete form of life energy (as Learner suggested)?

 

Ritually-killed doesn't work. Curse problems.

 

Brainstorming can be fun. :D

 

-Lyn-

Edited by Lyanna

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My first guess is that you aren't summoning a soul, but temporarily putting life into the matter and it is soul less. That is what they dtay near their creator and don't act like a normal animal/monster.

 

Since it doesn't have a soul, it also escapes the curse, bit that is also why di dies off quickly as the magic wears off.

160489[/snapback]

 

 

I was also thinking of something along these lines. But i couldn't get past the free movement of the deceased...it just seems like it needs a soul to operate on its own. Perhaps summoning, then, is nothing more than (like i stated in my first post) reanimation. The life essence as well as the sigils supplies the energy to make the corpse move...perhaps, then it is the castors own will that determines the intentions of the reanimated.

 

I'm just throwing stuff out there for ya.

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Maybe you can temporarily summon a recently deceased soul, and it stays attached to the animated body until it wears off, then it can go off to be brought back to life. Pretend there is an underworld for the dead monsters or animals as well, and you can borrow the soul while it is still down there.

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My first guess is that you aren't summoning a soul, but temporarily putting life into the matter and it is soul less. That is what they dtay near their creator and don't act like a normal animal/monster.

 

Since it doesn't have a soul, it also escapes the curse, bit that is also why di dies off quickly as the magic wears off.

160489[/snapback]

 

This is it, exactly :(

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This is it, exactly :P

160644[/snapback]

 

Along those lines, putting life into matter. eventually the matter will degrade until it is gone, or until it is broken up, that would explain why summoned creatures decrease in health and the rest of us under the curse do not.

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So, life essences supply the energy necessary for the spell to bring life back to the corpse of the creature that died. Essences only have certain amount of energy, thus it is depleted as it is used. This is why the creatures lose health.

 

This all works for me!

 

The next question i'll pose then is; how does the summoner actually bring the dead back to life? A spell? or do they simply sew a life essence into the creature and watch life return?

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Humm, 2 different ideas here, but both can work together. I said that summoned creatures degrade and disappear because of the matter degrading, you said the Life essense degrading, well, both work.

The next question i'll pose then is; how does the summoner actually bring the dead back to life? A spell? or do they simply sew a life essence into the creature and watch life return?

Perhaps they never really bring the dead back to life, mearly place life into matter (animal parts for example) and that....being can walk as if it were alive.

 

You see, the curse of Mortos has caused our land to become "Eternal Lands" nothing will degrade or die that lies under the curse. Think about it, all the races, all the flowers, all the monsters. But a summoned being does not lie under the curse because it has no soul, therefore it will degrade and die, just like the rest of us did before the curse fell upon us. Manufacturing for example, what was manufactured can degrade, because it was created and has no soul. Summoning is likewise.

Edited by EWQ222

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So summoning is more like a craft than magic?

 

How about:

 

------------

Having his own motives, Selain, altered the nature of the curse so that the wilderlands would, to a certain extent, have a force unaffected by the curse.

The Selain secretly taught a select few people how to tap that force.

 

The enlightened ones formed the Lodge of Land, a secret society of summoners.

They wrote down their teachings in books and scrolls and in time a few of those copies eluded their grasp and found their way into the lands. The lore of the summoners proved to be magical, yet scientific and possible to learn by others.

-----------

 

So it is a scientific method to tap the magical forces of the wild, and because of that approach you need both essences and the physical objects to manipulate that force.

 

When it comes to gargoyles it is not truly a summoning process but a way to animate stone into a living form, which draws from both magic and the summoning techniques taught by Selain.

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I apologize for the delay in me getting you reference material for all these main skills guys...but unfortunetly other things came up and i didn't find time for it. That and the fact that before I write it I also need to get hte skills more solidly in place, so that will take a bit more time that I though. Hopefully it'll be soon, but the ideas you guys are coming up with here are some good ones, so it'll help me too :D

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