Vista

[Draconey]

Me the Draconey

My dad fixes computers so I might get it. But XP has helped me lots so I don't know.

[Ikaris]

Essentially ... if you do not exclusively use Microsoft's licensed malware to develop your game... they do not want you to be able to connect to a windows platform to play that game...

 

They could even patch older versions of windows to prevent it ...

 

(win 2k... XP ... and vista all use very similar kernals (core os design ... for loose terminology)

 

essentially ... you don't pay ... you don't play.

[BlacKat]

I am using my boyfriends laptop which has Vista installed on it for his company (thats been said so i dont feel guilty for using it and having bought it from Billy Willy Gates ).

I'll install EL on it later today and let you know how it behaves.

Must tell you i hate the OS so far. Too many useless options, clicks, old features that are just too crappy and old for the "fresh Vista" and many many other annoyances!

 

May Ubuntu live forever!

[BlacKat]

DISASTER!

Long story short, Eternal Lands wont play on damn Vista.

It started in full screen, everything went black,then white, then i got the connection window that said that OpenGL doesnt work so they're not using it, etc, etc, then Login Window, then it all crashed into pieces!

Does anybody know where Billy Willy lives?I think i'll pay him a visit!

So...in 3 weeks i'm getting my computer...until then...you wont see me around the happy lands of EL

[Cycloonx]

I have a free version of Windows Vista via my school, just waiting on my serial that is normally delivered via mail

[Entropy]

BlacKat, try to install the video drivers from your video card maker (what chipset do you have?)

[BlacKat]

I have an NVidia 6000 or something. I dont know right now,i'm away from that laptop. Thing is i went to the Nvidia site to download the latest driver and there only was for 64bit and 86. Maybe they made a mistake with that 86 one but there was no driver for 32 bit. I'll try to look into it today.

 

Edit: I went to the Nvidia site again.If you want to download a driver from Gforce for Vista x86 it takes you to a page that says you're downloading driver for 32 bit. But the actual file is named for vista x86. I might be reading this all wrong, but it really doesnt seem right.

Edited February 9, 2007 by BlacKat

[Cycloonx]

Maybe it was for x86? Download that one then

[BlacKat]

I dont get it, is 86 the new 32? O.o Why cant they just say which is which?Its not enough that they made a crappy OS but they have to change the numbers too?

[Entropy]

x86 is the original procesor (from 80x386).

So that is the 32 bit version.

[Cycloonx]

I dont get it, is 86 the new 32? O.o Why cant they just say which is which?Its not enough that they made a crappy OS but they have to change the numbers too?

 

It has been x86 for ages, and if you can make a better OS than microsoft then you can go say it's crappy I know it might sounds cool to say "Arg windows is crap" but from what I can read in your posts you really don't know what you're talking about

[BlacKat]

x86 is the original procesor (from 80x386).

So that is the 32 bit version.

 

 

Really??You genius! Cant wait to get home and check it out

[BlacKat]

I dont get it, is 86 the new 32? O.o Why cant they just say which is which?Its not enough that they made a crappy OS but they have to change the numbers too?

 

It has been x86 for ages, and if you can make a better OS than microsoft then you can go say it's crappy I know it might sounds cool to say "Arg windows is crap" but from what I can read in your posts you really don't know what you're talking about

 

 

Err maybe you'd like to refrain from making comments about people you dont know. I didnt insult you or your mother so back off. And for your knowledge i'm a linux user, so yeah to me windows is Crap, oki?

[Cycloonx]

It wasn't a personal attack on you, but I read everywhere comments like: "Vista is tEh cr4p", "Linux is th3 pwnz0rz"

 

Except for the high price I think vista is quite a nice toy.

[BlacKat]

I personally dont like it. Apart from the Eyecandy which requires loads of resources and is not so special if you think about it, Vista has nothing smart or new about it. My boyfriend only bought it because he needs it for his company. They could have spent the 6 billion dollars Vista costed in far better ways, but i guess that taking freedom from people is an expensive deal.

No further comments.

[Cycloonx]

It's like linux has all the things that are needed on a desktop to work fluently with it? I think a standard desktop user is way better off with a windows than with a linux. Why else are there such a low amount of users on a free OS?

[Ornitorrinco]

lol ubuntu newbs

 

get a real distro

[Schmurk]

It wasn't a personal attack on you, but I read everywhere comments like: "Vista is tEh cr4p", "Linux is th3 pwnz0rz"

 

Except for the high price I think vista is quite a nice toy.

Until you don't need any anti viruses, firewalls are other stuffs that slow down your system, sorry to say that windows in general (not just vista) is crap. Just my personal opinion.

And I will not give all the advantages of Linux compared to Window$ because the list can be long...

 

Oh btw:

It's like linux has all the things that are needed on a desktop to work fluently with it? I think a standard desktop user is way better off with a windows than with a linux.

I installed Ubuntu on my parents comp few months ago and they are really happy with it

[ttlanhil]

It's like linux has all the things that are needed on a desktop to work fluently with it?

a normal gnu/linux installation has most of the stuff you need, including an office suite... and the package managers will allow you to install, for free, a heck of a lot more. and although using the latest versions of some software can cause it to crash (only the software, not the operating system, unlike what's common for windows), the rest is quite stable... why else would linux be able to get the highest security rating from the american government for a general purpose operating system? why else would over half the internet be running on apache on linux/bsd (or sometimes others like solaris, but not that much)? why else would big businesses be moving towards clusters of linux computers for the large-scale number crunching?

there are some problems with using linux. some big ones. technical quality isn't one of them.

I think a standard desktop user is way better off with a windows than with a linux. Why else are there such a low amount of users on a free OS?

because they're ignorant. how many people think windows is the computer? a lot of them. how many people have heard of linux apart from microsoft's FUD (microsoft has been found out 'sponsoring' tests comparing windows and linux, and the marketing department is rather active...)? not that many.

how many people think windows is free when they bought their computer? or that the salespeople have to sell windows with the computers (they're usually under contract to only sell computers with windows, which is probably illegal in many places, as forcing the licensing of a non-required piece of software at the same time you purchase hardware is hardly establishable as necessary)?

and who says the numbers are that low? linux doesn't have a majority on the desktop at the moment (it does on servers), but it's a significant portion, and it's growing. look at the votes, around EL there's a large percent that use linux/BSD

 

as for the problems I mentioned before, I'll list a few. for one, it's that linux isn't usually available installed on a new computer. historically, installing and configuring linux has been the hardest part (though nowadays it's quite easy... maybe easier than windows... but the user doesn't have to install windows)

another problem is there are too many choices. this is normally a good thing in that people have options, but they need help deciding. do they go ubuntu, kubuntu, suse, linspire, fedora? and those are just some of the more user friendly well known ones (there are hundreds of linux distributions about)... then, do they use firefox, mozilla, konqueror, galeon? kde vs gnome? they typical windows user who's told not to fiddle with things in case they accidentally destroy their hard drive will be intimidated... but in reality, apart from the distro, you can just install all options and try each out to see which you like best

another problem, it's free. no really, that can be a problem. y'see, some people are used to paying for windows, and hence think that if something goes wrong, they paid for the right to sue (of course, they gave up that and many other rights in the EULA)... or the people who think that something paid for is going to be higher quality (sometimes it is, but on the other hand, a million people around the world working on their speciality in their spare time, vs a thousand people working professionally in areas that aren't always of interest to them...)

and another problem, maybe the biggest one nowadays (though probably second to the lack of information), is the users. many of the users think they're special (or worse yet, 3133t) because they can use linux, and disparage new users, insult them for asking questions, etc. in some cases this is partly valid, for when people really should have read the help menu (in which case they should be told to go read the help, and given a pointer if need be, and refused any answers... but not insulted), but far too often it goes beyond that. these low-lifes, however, will be insulting wherever they think they have an advantage (or can act like they have one), and really are a (albeit vocal) minority

 

so, to quote you, "but from what I can read in your posts you really don't know what you're talking about"

 

ed: oh, and one other comment on usability... people trying out linux after using windows will sometimes say something like "this isn't the same, it's all too scary and new" and go back to windows... but people who haven't used either have often found linux to be easier to use

of course, the key in either case is how much information and support you have... and if you can avoid the "I R ill-ertar8 N lunix roxx0rz" people, linux support is probably going to be easier to find online

Edited February 9, 2007 by ttlanhil

[Cycloonx]

Well I'm not using a virusscan and firewall on this computer. I'm running on windows xp with all patches an SPs. I run now and then a free trial of virusscanners and never had a virus so far. The amount of virusses is decreasing anway... And I bet if linux ever gets 90% of the market there will also be viruses, exploits, etc etc

 

In the past viruses on windows were horrible, but actually now it isn't anymore.

 

And for your parents, if they don't go further than using an internet browser and something like open office linux will be ok ofcourse...

 

I'm not really pro windows, neither anti linux but a lot of people have been crying out nonsense the last weeks... Imo everyone should get a little more respect for everything they don't use.

[Cycloonx]

To ttlanhil:

 

Yes you are correct about the things you say, but i'm not really talking about the superiority or minority of a system. I'm more commenting on the people with comments like windows is crap, it's shit, it's worthless, etc... Most of the times those people are the 3l1t3 people like you call them, that 'can' work on a linux OS.

 

The thing is imo that you need to work a little longer with linux to get the hang of it. It takes some time before you know and find everything you need to know. Imo linux systems are still build for the geeks (it's evolving in a positive way though last years and it's getting more open for normal users).

 

And linux is imo the best OS if it comes to working (real work) on it. It's less busy, less things that can take away your mind (dunno how to say in english).

 

But like I said 3 times now I think: Everyone has an opinion and everyone else should respect that. If I would go to linux I would never flame to windows users, nor would I put lame comments about windows.

Edited February 9, 2007 by Cycloonx

[maximos]

i simply don't use Linux because i can't play my own games on it, and if i can it takes a lot of time/effort to run them

[ttlanhil]

Well I'm not using a virusscan and firewall on this computer.

if you're on a controlled network (such as a home network behind an ADSL/cable router that has a firewall built in, which is common these days) then a firewall isn't really necessary (for inbound, at least, it's still quite useful for anti-virus stuff outbound)... virus scanner, on the other hand, shouldn't be optional.

The amount of virusses is decreasing anway... And I bet if linux ever gets 90% of the market there will also be viruses, exploits, etc etc

lets have a look at why (for the first part). since long, long ago, multi-user systems had security so one user couldn't destroy the work of another (or the system files). there was also an administrator, who could change anything needed. security is built in to this design pretty well. unles syou have administrator rights, the worst you can do is slow down the system or damage your own files. no damage to the computer or any other files.

then, we have the single-user systems... dos, win 1-3, 95, 98, and ME. there's no inherent security here. if a user does something wrong, the system can be destroyed. and if they have a virus, it runs with system-level rights, same as the user. this is where virii proliferated (there were a few before that, which attacked *nix machines, but that either damages only the users' files or requires a security hole to exploit to gain more rights)

next we have the semi-multi-user windowses... NT, 2k, XP (and vista, but that's a different beast)... there's a notion of file permissions and rights... if you're running as a unpriviledged user, there's a limit on the damage you can do. unfortunately, the typical home user doesn't like the restrictions, so always runs as an administrator. there goes the security.

and now, vista... where, from what I've read, you can't run as admin... you perform tasks with admin rights when needed... wow, they finally copied what has been in *nix for how many years? permissions, and running as admin in limited tasks? those ideas, in IT lengths of times, were ancient when MS picked them up. they're well tested and work... so now that vista is picking them up, security again should go up.

will virii be gone? no. at best, vista will reach levels of security equivalent to unhardened *nix machines... a few virii and worms will exist, and exploit holes in security and user intelligence (many virii require the users to do something silly)

And for your parents, if they don't go further than using an internet browser and something like open office linux will be ok ofcourse...

or, if they want to run an accounting package, or a web server, or... well, gee, gaming and a few niche markets are the few areas linux doesn't come through strongly (well, forn the niche markets, some are already strongly *nix based, others windows based... and there isn't enough interest to port/clone the software across)... and thanks to the wine/cedega people, linux can run most windows programs, including games (for example, WoW) as well.

Imo everyone should get a little more respect for everything they don't use.

I've used dos, win 3.1, win 95, win 98, win me, win nt 3, win nt 4, win 2k, win xp home, win xp pro, linux/slackware, linux/cygwin, linux/gentoo, and linux/fedora. for many of the above, I've done stuff beyond the capabilities of the regular user. in many of them, I've provided support to other users (especially where it's general, like how to do task X under windows/linux).

I know what I'm talking about. I don't think you really do

 

I'm more commenting on the people with comments like windows is crap, it's shit, it's worthless, etc... Most of the times those people are the 3l1t3 people like you call them, that 'can' work on a linux OS.

these idiots are present in the windows world as well. especially in the highly competitive/violent online games. these are people who think they're better than everyone else because of what limited ability they have or seem to have. they're not exclusive to online media, it's just online you can't really see what a luser they are

The thing is imo that you need to work a little longer with linux to get the hang of it.

no you don't. if you came from windows, and took a few years to learn windows, it may take a week to learn all of the common differences. if you come from no computer experience at all, they're rather similar (and yes, studies on this have been done. the ones I've seen had linux come out slightly ahead... I'm guessing this is because the distro managers have packaged everything together better than each software developer putting stuff 'somewhere' in the start menu. it's a bit easier to find programs, and they're already installed when you need them (or can be downloaded with a few clicks)

Imo linux systems are still build for the geeks (it's evolving in a positive way though last years and it's getting more open for normal users).

it used to be. for some distros it still is (LFS, slackware, maybe gentoo, though that's more the domain of the ereet lusers mentioned above nowadays)... for other distros, those designed for new users, it's not (suse, fedora/red hat, linspire, (k)ubuntu, etc)

But like I said 3 times now I think: Everyone has an opinion and everyone else should respect that. If I would go to linux I would never flame to windows users, nor would I put lame comments about windows.

I'm equal opportunity, I'll bag both sides where there's a deficiency that said, there is a problem group on each side. on each side there's the "I R beeta tan U" people... and on the windows side there are the people who believe the microsoft marketing (ie, they don't know the truth)... or they tried linux once 5 years ago, got scared, and now will always think it's terrible without trying it (on the other hand, some of the anti-windows people will talk about security, while vista is bringing windows security up to an acceptable level (for the first time) to be online)

[Schmurk]

Well I'm not using a virusscan and firewall on this computer. I'm running on windows xp with all patches an SPs. I run now and then a free trial of virusscanners and never had a virus so far. The amount of virusses is decreasing anway... And I bet if linux ever gets 90% of the market there will also be viruses, exploits, etc etc

What is a free virusscanner if it's not an antivirus? Buying products to get rid of the viruses is a thing but slowing down your machine is another.

And you have a firewall running because there's one in the SP2, unless you turned it off.

And as ttlanhil stated, linux systems are already widely spread and there's no viruses. Maybe because there are less security faults in linux than in windows...

 

And for your parents, if they don't go further than using an internet browser and something like open office linux will be ok ofcourse...

Were we talking about the OS or about the softwares? IMO, Windows is now just good to play video games because almost all game designers code with DirectX or don't take time to port their games under linux. Out of that, all you can do with windows can be done with linux and for free!

 

I'm not really pro windows, neither anti linux but a lot of people have been crying out nonsense the last weeks... Imo everyone should get a little more respect for everything they don't use.

I have to agree with you on that. In my concern, I never said and will never say bad things on something I don't know.

I don't know vista at all but what I know from the past versions is enough for me. Maybe one day windows will be nice but I don't think it's for now... Look at mac OS, before it was crap too but now it's really nice

[ttlanhil]

i simply don't use Linux because i can't play my own games on it, and if i can it takes a lot of time/effort to run them

package-manager-install 'wine'.

double-click windows executable. (note)

 

for many windows programs and games, that's enough to do it. you may get a few percent slowdown, but that's not really a big problem

alternatively, there are a lot of games available for linux, some ported from windows, which may be available from your package manager

 

Note: this assumes you're using kde/gnome and one of the distros that sets up the association... otherwise you'd have to go to console and 'wine program-name.exe'