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Miiks

NMT's, NMT's everywhere. Way to get rid of them?

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More NMTs the better, I don't agree that the NMT should be for the high level or the rich equipment breaks and we need to protect our stuffs

Otherwise why not make everything super expensive and let nubs like us walk around in augs

 

NMT perk is... well a perk. It shouldn't be too easy or cheap to get, otherwise radu can just drop the break chance to 1/4 of normal and remove the whole perk.

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The price of every other cape & cloak has come down as well, so it's not limited to the nmt or due to the fact it doesn't break. From the point of view of encouraging new players to stay the game, raising these prices again is just putting barriers in their way that will make them less likey to stay in my opinion. Perhaps some tweaks or a new recipe is in order but nothing that will double or triple these prices.

Sorry they quit before they get anywhere close to that level. :P

 

If you want to remove capes from game, try and get radu to trade em out of game, for say shop items of equal or lower price.

Simples!

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Make all break rates 75% less and replace all existing NMTs with pink fluffy boots with -1 armor - problem with NMT surplus solved and everybody wins :P

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The price of every other cape & cloak has come down as well, so it's not limited to the nmt or due to the fact it doesn't break. From the point of view of encouraging new players to stay the game, raising these prices again is just putting barriers in their way that will make them less likey to stay in my opinion. Perhaps some tweaks or a new recipe is in order but nothing that will double or triple these prices.

Sorry they quit before they get anywhere close to that level. :P

 

If you want to remove capes from game, try and get radu to trade em out of game, for say shop items of equal or lower price.

Simples!

 

I don't want to remove capes from the game, if prices are lower it's good for new players & frees up spawns that were being farmed for everyone else.. win win in my book.

Edited by Cyrano

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Their aren't any/many new players coming into game, tbh, except alts. And i haven't really ever seen farming on feros/fluffies when i was around some of the popular spawns. I don't see the lower price for newbies to be a really great argument, since one of the major issues are we dont have many genuine newbies about. I can list about 10 in the last few months that i spoke to, and 2 that are active at the moment.

 

Anyway, i like the quest idea, but maybe make it require some roleplaying and a dynamic plots (aka npcs will react differently to you depending on order you speak to them) and take away the nmt, unless that gives a second similiar perk that stacks on the last one.

 

Miiks -

NMT perk is over expensive, and moving cloaks price up to match perk will generally make them the cloak equivalent of thermy's - a rich persons play thing.

Edited by JoeButler

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Make all break rates 75% less and replace all existing NMTs with pink fluffy boots with -1 armor - problem with NMT surplus solved and everybody wins :P

 

I think a lot of people would hate that :P

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here you go Miiks enjoy

http://www.eternal-l...95&hl=breakable

http://www.eternal-l...76&hl=breakable

http://www.eternal-l...66&hl=breakable

 

there might be more but thats a couple of different times the topic has came up :)

 

Do they involve the quest idea? Nope. As I said earlier, it wasn't only about making NMTs going away, also the idea of the quest is involved here but everyone seems to forget about it since they are too busy to rant about the NMT thingies :P

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Their aren't any/many new players coming into game, tbh, except alts. And i haven't really ever seen farming on feros/fluffies when i was around some of the popular spawns. I don't see the lower price for newbies to be a really great argument, since one of the major issues are we dont have many genuine newbies about. I can list about 10 in the last few months that i spoke to, and 2 that are active at the moment.

 

Anyway, i like the quest idea, but maybe make it require some roleplaying and a dynamic plots (aka npcs will react differently to you depending on order you speak to them) and take away the nmt, unless that gives a second similiar perk that stacks on the last one.

 

That's the main problem, soon there won't be enough newbs buying the cloaks. Actually you can already see that happening. The main reason NMT price bumbed a while ago was because there was loads of people starting to train feroses and other monsters that actually demanded some armor and at least CoL.

 

Miiks -

NMT perk is over expensive, and moving cloaks price up to match perk will generally make them the cloak equivalent of thermy's - a rich persons play thing.

 

I've said many times that the price is actually pretty good atm. I think NMT cape should cost about 350-500k so you should at least do some work to get the perk. It's still not too hard to obtain with lvls you actually start getting real benefit from the perk. It's just that this price won't stay for long and I'd like to see it staying between those frames.

 

Edit: Of course it's still not permanent solution, since some day most of the people in EL have done the quest and again there's no demand for NMT's. But imo the quest would be nice add to game and at same time it helps the NMT market a little.

Edited by Miiks

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<Essay/ Text Wall Alert>

 

There are much better ways to gain newbs than lower the price on one object, especially one needed after several months of casual play. NMT wont be a major factor, as most newbs quit before that due to other issues in game, that are much more of a factor to lower levels than what is a high level piece of equipment. Going on that this will make any difference to recruiting newbies to the game is just fooling yourself, as this item only applies to level 70s+ at the earliest. And since 70% of new players quit before then due to nothing interesting to do at low levels, grinding, being scammed and game flaws, i don't really see you all talking about these issues, but going on that nmts dropping in price will help us get more newbs. I can only see this as a benifit to your alts, and the tiny amount of fighters/combat builds left under level 80/90.

 

As for NMTs going out of game, theirs no easy way to do it, and if there was, it will most likely unbalance things further against Lower-medium level players.

 

I still persist that i like the perks concept, but in line with the nmt, it will be basically doable by those who can afford to replace their armours.

 

As for newbies not buying NMTs; I know that mostly alts buy NMTs without buying perk first, as making money as a newbie is difficult without being bored out of your mind. Instances arent available to those who haven't got the NMT yet, and that is the only truely entertaining money making way for low/mid level players. Also, a few players, including myself, always tell (other) newbies to buy perk, as its much more useful for the type of builds new players have right now, which dont really involve the need of every single pick point. For a newbie, 7 pps is WAAAAAY cheaper than 350k-500k. And when they get to the point that cloak might good idea, they see price of NMT removal, and just think F**k that, not worth it.

 

just looked through those links of CherUTs, and though its a little off topic, i still think its connected enough to warrant posting.

The suggestion to remove the branch ...Furthermore, what new player would want to enter PK when he has to be warned "watch out if you decide to enter PK - some rich player might try to destroy all of your hard-earned stuff". As has been mentioned previously on the subject of game development, other successful games should be looked at to see what works. I have not heard of any other (similar) game in which players can deliberately and permanently destroy items of another player.

 

No new players have really got into PK proper, without buying a char. I've tried, but i basically watch or muck about, friend wanted to, but NH got him. It wasnt even as bad as it is now last year, but it keeps getting worse. Why is PK dead; Your attitudes killed it.

 

BroD weapon is griefer weapon, to attract the people that other games ban. If you got rid of it, NMT turned breakable would be more easily welcomed i'd say, and price would probably remain the same for the first we bit, or drop, and increase a little bit up to 400-500k i'd say, through the balance of break/farming, though itd probably be around 250-400k after about a year.

 

So, for the record;

  • I'm +1 for perk, as long as it is slightly cheaper, or say an optional advantage to a quest.
  • If you got rid of BroD, id say NMTs would be more likely to be welcomed as breakable as compensation
  • Its not a huge factor to keeping newbie players intially
  • No real easy way to remove NMT

Now, i know people are going to say im wrong, its been tried before, etc. all the usual stuff. But at the moment radu is losing players to OL, no newbies are coming in, and if he wants to keep the game going for another decade, he needs to finally change to game attract new players, keep old players and not annoy half his low to medium-high level players. This is the BEST time to do radical changes, since as soon as the trickle of newbie players ends, the game is doomed. And its allready on it way.

 

 

For Those of you who think im going off topic:

So, yeah, it goes a little off topic, but changing NMT/BroD would be good start to making the game more attractive, since they both effect most EL players at least once in their entire EL experience. NMT effects those as being an additional burden when they get higher level items at mid 70s, and the BroD screws everybody who is mixer/harver/low level. This is my opinion, is connected to the threads topic, even if mentions the concern of the BroD, as i do say above, removing the BroD would mean alot of people would except the breakable nmt, with a low break chance as more than a reasonable pay off for removing this item.

Edited by JoeButler

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Joe, you haven't said anything I don't agree with. +1 on game updates. We need more newbies.

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Strange that this gets proposed when NMT price is dropping...

A while ago, the price of artificers cloaks dropped from >100k to <25k, and NO suggestion to change anything was made.

 

 

Iirc recall correctly (but not 100% sure), the hike to 750k for an NMT came when NMT removal stones were introduced,

so demand increased. Now most of those who wanted to remove the perk and could afford the stone and the cape have

switched, so yes, demand drops and price with it. (Free economy).

 

Lets try just leaving things as they are for a while, and not try and force the prices higher (or even stable) every time...

You cannot have a free economy when you change the rules every time a price changes in a way you don't like.

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It's not real "free market" if there's no products going out from the system. Especially with such limited player base as EL has. And yes, of course I do these kinds of suggestions when I see the price dropping. Actually I just started to play again like 2 weeks ago and the situation has been going worse since when I was last playing. Anyway NMT's price bumbed before the NMT removal stone was introduced. There was loads of newbs starting to train higher monsters and the demand exploded. Of course NMT removal raised the price a little too, but not as much as the "great newbie rush".

 

About arti capes, I don't believe there's too many people using them anyway since they require 10 human.

 

I also have told like millions of times I didn't do this suggestions only for NMTs. I like the quest idea too and if I ever got extra NMT and the quest existed, I would use it for that. I wouldn't sell the cape even they cost 2M gc. I just don't see any rational point in keeping the things like they are at this moment, because as I said, it's not real free market to have products that stay in forever. Would mixers be happy if radu made armors unbreakable? I don't think so.

 

Edit: Just another point from the mixer's view:

 

I don't actually understand why it's also mixers that want to keep NMTs in game without them going out, since it also distorts the armor market. Items break less, less demand etc. If every newb has NMT because they are cheap, it really makes it much harder to sell armors since they break less. Naturally. Then they whine how it's hard to cover even ingredients from the price they have to sell the armors and weapons. For them the optimal solution should be to remove NMT from game completely but instead they want to keep things as they are now. At least it seems that all suggestions about NMTs have been started by fighters, not mixers.

Edited by Miiks

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I'd like to hear from high level mixers what they make generally (other than on request). And if they don't spend their time making armours,

for what reasons they do make them (on request, for the fun of making them, ...).

 

As for mixers whining, check market prices for ingredients for the high level stuff and compare to NPC prices (where possible). Exemple:

jagged sabre: NPC price 40k, ingredients value ~45k (estimated, probably low, using 23k gc for binding stone, and 11000 for wolfram bar,

and ignore the remaining ings; same pricing for all great swords). And for the items where NPC price is higher than ings cost, the differences

are getting smaller all the time, afaik. Increasing demand for armours and weapons won't change that aspect in the least: everyone who is able

to, will buy from NPC, and the others (anti-social perk) ask friends or use bots.

 

Btw, you do seem to agree that the increase in price was due to a (temporary) change in market demand. Now all those new players have

their NMT cape, so prices go down again. No reason to artificially modify anything. And your suggestion hear only concerns NMT...

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You may, or may not have a valid point about nmt. But why not attack the low hanging fruit first?

 

Golden Star Mace.

Warlock capes

Special sword of Fire/Thermal/ice./magic etc

Perk Removal stones that drop too frequently

 

 

 

 

NMT's may, or may not be an issue, and I stay out of that debate (again for the 4th time) for the moment.

 

Personally I think there are more pressing concerns that should be addressed first.

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As for mixers whining, check market prices for ingredients for the high level stuff and compare to NPC prices (where possible). Exemple:

jagged sabre: NPC price 40k, ingredients value ~45k (estimated, probably low, using 23k gc for binding stone, and 11000 for wolfram bar,

and ignore the remaining ings; same pricing for all great swords). And for the items where NPC price is higher than ings cost, the differences

are getting smaller all the time, afaik. Increasing demand for armours and weapons won't change that aspect in the least: everyone who is able

to, will buy from NPC, and the others (anti-social perk) ask friends or use bots.

 

I agree with this point, ingredient's prices have gone too high. Of course that should be solved first and it's much bigger problem than the one with NMT at this moment.

 

Btw, you do seem to agree that the increase in price was due to a (temporary) change in market demand. Now all those new players have

their NMT cape, so prices go down again. No reason to artificially modify anything. And your suggestion hear only concerns NMT...

 

Of course it was. But at this moment the price is going down because there isn't practically any demand for NMT's.

 

And how does my suggestion only concern NMT's because it involves the quest idea too. Only couple people have commented the quest idea, I'm willing to take critic from that too.

 

Personally I think there are more pressing concerns that should be addressed first.

 

True. Too bad it seems that all the pressing concerns get solved only when the situation is catastrophic. If even then.

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No reason to artificially modify anything.

 

To add to this point; Making item unbreakable in a game where everything breaks is also artificially modifing the market imo.

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Can't quote from my phone but to lighten the mood. Not everything else is el breaks. My damn ti set for example

 

Anyway I agree with wizzy, lower level people get excited when they do an invasion and get a "rare" drop. Then they do a price check such as fr removal.... Talk about a let down to them. Many things don't have a use in game. Why not suggest a quest using them ?

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Can't quote from my phone but to lighten the mood. Not everything else is el breaks. My damn ti set for example

 

:D

 

Anyway I agree with wizzy, lower level people get excited when they do an invasion and get a "rare" drop. Then they do a price check such as fr removal.... Talk about a let down to them. Many things don't have a use in game. Why not suggest a quest using them ?

 

Great idea!

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Can't quote from my phone but to lighten the mood. Not everything else is el breaks. My damn ti set for example

 

Anyway I agree with wizzy, lower level people get excited when they do an invasion and get a "rare" drop. Then they do a price check such as fr removal.... Talk about a let down to them. Many things don't have a use in game. Why not suggest a quest using them ?

 

Agree. Sucks to find a Fast Regen and Hellspawn Removal, get excited, and find out that put together, their not even worth 1kgc...

 

And enchanted swords need balancing way more, the only one really being used is the Serpent Thermal.

 

NMTs aren't that easy to get. When I was looking for one, I spent week advertising on ch3 to buy off player. After not getting a PM for one (offered 400kgc), eventually gave up and bought the only one that was on a bot. That was earlier this year. :)

 

NMT is fine imo, solve the problem with the virtuously pointless Warlock Cape and Enchanted Swords.

 

My 2 pence

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NMTs aren't that easy to get. When I was looking for one, I spent week advertising on ch3 to buy off player. After not getting a PM for one (offered 400kgc), eventually gave up and bought the only one that was on a bot. That was earlier this year. :)

 

NMT is fine imo, solve the problem with the virtuously pointless Warlock Cape and Enchanted Swords.

 

My 2 pence

 

Atm there's 7 NMTs even on bots (I think they have been there for few weeks already) and I've seen at least 2 people selling them on market too.

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NMTs aren't that easy to get. When I was looking for one, I spent week advertising on ch3 to buy off player. After not getting a PM for one (offered 400kgc), eventually gave up and bought the only one that was on a bot. That was earlier this year. :)

 

NMT is fine imo, solve the problem with the virtuously pointless Warlock Cape and Enchanted Swords.

 

My 2 pence

 

Atm there's 7 NMTs even on bots (I think they have been there for few weeks already) and I've seen at least 2 people selling them on market too.

 

You always see a flurry of nmt sales when topics like this get posted.... People speculating, it has happened like this in the past too.

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NMTs aren't that easy to get. When I was looking for one, I spent week advertising on ch3 to buy off player. After not getting a PM for one (offered 400kgc), eventually gave up and bought the only one that was on a bot. That was earlier this year. :)

 

NMT is fine imo, solve the problem with the virtuously pointless Warlock Cape and Enchanted Swords.

 

My 2 pence

 

Atm there's 7 NMTs even on bots (I think they have been there for few weeks already) and I've seen at least 2 people selling them on market too.

 

You always see a flurry of nmt sales when topics like this get posted.... People speculating, it has happened like this in the past too.

 

Well you can't really forbid the fact that most players that actually need an NMT already have one. Added that there's not many new players leveling, it will be some kind of problem in near future.

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Well you can't really forbid the fact that most players that actually need an NMT already have one. Added that there's not many new players leveling, it will be some kind of problem in near future.

 

To be honest lack of newbie creates WAY bigger issues than NMTs. Effectively brings on the death of the game.

Anyway, i agree with Wizzy, attack those issues and oh so many more before going onto the nmt debate.

 

And if you know about the much more pressing needs, why didnt you suggest a fix for them in a thread instead of suggesting a solution to a problem that isnt really that pressing at the moment?

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