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Entropy

PK arenas change

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i see dpa very bad idea brcouse people they dont need train anymore and they pk only in dpa

ppl 80 a/d with bronze kill ppl 140 a/d lol

I guess you trained a lot, AMAR.

well i did train a lot ...and i agree to Amar ....kkthnxbb

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I have trained a lot too, probably more than you, and i liked the changes. Now everybody got a chance on a map, if you don't like it, you can still use KF, nothing changed there.

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i know nothing change in kf but no1 come to kf anymore

why we dont make dpa only for ppl 10-100 a/d and ppl 100+ fight in kf ?

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I went to have a look at DPA yesterday and thought it was a bit sad that the rich players were hiding behind their bronzies fulltime, but that's a matter of opinion ofc. Kinda takes away the spirit of 'let newbs be able to fight the pr0s'.

 

But actually, this change takes away what most 'pure PKers' have been complaining about for as long as I can remember.

 

Someone that JUST wants to PK, will not have to spend years of their EL life at spawn. Leveling to 60s a/d will already give the a/d levels to properly fight. Raising all the attributes to 20 isn't all that hard either, having higher p/c is only good for EMU. Zomg they could even afford to get some sort of nexus other than human 7 and inorg 2 :icon13:

The fact they won't have to spend months on fluffs or feros, frees up time for alching or other skills to generate gc so they can actually afford to PK, with all the armors, bronzies and what else they think they need to PK.

 

Give it a few weeks and you'll see the first full on DPA alts new style arrive on the scene.

 

Leveling your a/d further than capped arena levels will still be a huge benefit for PVE combat in the different settings the game provides btw, so any levels obtained by hard work / purchased with $$ are still valuable.

Edited by Dilly

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I also agree with AMAR. I fought several fights on the night of implementation. The standouts were those characters likely with NMT perk who used bronze swords almost exclusively. The way the arenas are currently configured, it seems to be more a war of attrition than what I consider "real" pk--fight until the first person runs out of HE/SRS or MI. If at least one of the purposes was to allow "newer" people a "fair" chance to learn PK, these arenas will not really serve that purpose, they will be easily dispatched without the appropriate equipment and perks.

 

As Dilly said, it's only a matter of time until people build the new "dpa" char, which will dominate the arenas. For me, I chose to level a/d for a reason and that was to pk competitively. If I wanted to be normalized with everyone else, I wouldn't have bothered. Further, it leaves out the more rounded approach to pk which includes other skills like summoning and ranging (haven't tested engineering).

 

Maybe some changes can be made to make it more fun, but I can't think of what they would be at the moment. I'm not interested in prolonged fights with someone 1/2 my a/d just waiting for something to break.

Edited by Ozmondius

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also, new characters who would normally Pk at DPA cant us MI, so they get owned when someone else with no fail restore, ability to mana drain and harm for high amounts use it. the magic level should be lowered as well imo

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also, new characters who would normally Pk at DPA cant us MI, so they get owned when someone else with no fail restore, ability to mana drain and harm for high amounts use it. the magic level should be lowered as well imo

 

They can train magic like everybody else, no? It's not THAT hard to get to magic 21 for restore and 30 for MI, and not even that hard to get to magic 40. Essence wise, they'll need the alch xp for some OA gain anyways, and going into DPA at 20s a/d has always been and will always obviously not be the smart thing to do.

 

I think it's safe to assume this change wasn't to make it all handed to us on a silver platter, just that if you want to PK, even against higherleveled people, there's now a platform for it.

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And the special potions and rings that the newbs won't even know exist. I'm not sure what the point of the arena is now. It's just a mini KF now.

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pk quest at tutorial npc, win or lose 1 fight at DPA \o/

 

Not a bad idea TBH, and doesnt really need to invole the player having to fight.

The Tut NPC could send you to talk to a new NPC at DPA "Arena master " so to speak. The NPC could explain the basics of PK, Dis rings, Brod, CoTu's etc, and on returning to the Tut NPC he could reward them with a few SRS's, Dis rings or such like.

This sounds like a great idea and could save a guildmaster of a newb guild (raising my hand) alot of trouble. I can't explain all this stuff all that well and I sure can't explain it if I don't get the chance to talk to them.

 

This update makes the arenas much more active, but even more impossible for newbies to pvp in. Now they're up against players that have infinitely more gold than they do and unless they're using a leveling attrib build, much much higher attribs and magic than the old DPA alts.

Entropy, perhaps you could stack on top of this another suggestion that was made? A human nexus cap. That would level the gc playing field for the arena.

 

Folk, I know that some of you think this DPA change might be boring and that folk might just fight there instead of going to other pk places. Everyone has to start somewhere though and don't you figure they would have to graduate from the arena eventually?

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Further, it leaves out the more rounded approach to pk which includes other skills like summoning and ranging (haven't tested engineering).

 

i agree. :icon13:

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I think the new DP arenas setup is a good thing, but i don't deny that they don't really generate an overly enjoyable PK experience.

 

Maybe some changes can be made to make it more fun, but I can't think of what they would be at the moment. I'm not interested in prolonged fights with someone 1/2 my a/d just waiting for something to break.

This is the key issue.

Everyone has equal, or nearly equal Might and Toughness, which, combined with the high armor bonus of Dragon and Bronze armors, renders the entire great sword range useless (not that most of them weren't already useless in competitive PK), and results in boring, largely risk-less, drawn out fights... unless Bronze Swords or a couple of other very costly weapons are used.

 

One way to help this situation would be to implement equipment restrictions, allowing only Human Nexus 6 or lower gear. But, the 2 problems with this are:

  • Orange spam gear, which is less accessible than Bronze Swords, would represent a serious imbalance in that those with said equipment would not be at all enjoyable to fight against... at least atm a person only need come up with ~20kgc and at least they'll have a chance to take out that ebul rich orange-spamz0r. Then again, this could easily be resolved by making orange spam gear require Human 7.
  • Radu already said he's not willing to implement equipment restirctions.

Even then, it's possible fights would still be a bit drawn out with only Human 6 and lower gear... but it certainly would be better than it is now.

 

One change that, if done right, could help the situation a lot is that PvP damage modifier idea. ( http://www.eternal-lands.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=50941 )

 

Hopefully it gets further consideration.

 

Give it a few weeks and you'll see the first full on DPA alts new style arrive on the scene.

...and they won't all be 'alts' :icon13:

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How about implementing the npc idea, have it capable of announcing the restrictions a person has when they enter the arena and only have additional (past what there is now) restrictions (like weapons/armor) when the person requests it.

 

This way, the terms of combat can be decided before combat begins. The terms would be known, if not agreed upon. If someone does not like the restrictions that a person has, they could leave the arena.

 

The question is, can npc's speak in local chat? I figure it is possible since Lenny speaks on channel 6 and pk kills are also announced on 6.

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One Interesting thing to consider is the fact that dpa IS single combat. I have spent quite a lot of time there and have noticed that for the most part GOOD MANNERS do prevail. Most people ask others for a fight. Its usually only the higher level chars attack the other higher level chars without asking, for guild or personal reasons. I have NOT seen any higher level person attack a newbie (although some newbies may take in onto themselves to attack high levels). A lot of fights also are negotiated to only use Restore etc. Newbies should enjoy seeing combat and taking part in a fun enviroment and it gives them something to strive for.

Let the fun times roll :(

 

I also think people will still keep leveling for PvE regular PK and invasions, for nexus to persue skills etc (I am). DPA is just fun, a way to relax after a long training session etc.

Edited by Starlite

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Some points i would like to make:

(1)In the new arenas everyone can have a chance. It doesn't matter if you bought a char for a few k's of $, it doesn't matter if you spent years doing boring stuff, you still need a bit of real "human skill" to pwn there, some people lack it.

 

(2)Items restrictions simply wont get implemented, simple as that. Radu won't miss a chance to see lots of high level items poofage. Maybe we can agree in a "community" version, without dragon armors and bronzies, but i highly doubt;

 

(3)Summoning and ranging skills should be fixed, since apparently most pk combat are done on that arenas nowadays. Make it multicombat, also make the summons able to attack, we won't see many ELEs poofage since the high level monster's attrib is also capped. It won't solve everything, but it should point us to the what the next step is;

 

(4)Boost pots should have some effect in that arena. I really think about what do drink and when to drink boost pots is part of the "pk skill", i would not like it to go away. I know, it makes pk slightly more expensive, but i really have fun seeing the cooldown and thinking what pot to drink next to match the opponent, etc, its great fun;

 

(5)Again, KF is unchanged, Amar et all can still go there and hug trees, the problem is that they won't see as much easy preys as before. Pr0s like to fight people at their level or above anyways, and will prefer dp arena, but so its the life. ^^

Edited by Lorck

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Some points i would like to make:

(1)In the new arenas everyone can have a chance. It doesn't matter if you bought a char for a few k's of $, it doesn't matter if you spent years doing boring stuff, you still need a bit of real "human skill" to pwn there, some people lack it.

 

(2)Items restrictions simply wont get implemented, simple as that. Radu won't miss a chance to see lots of high level items poofage. Maybe we can agree in a "community" version, without dragon armors and bronzies, but i highly doubt;

 

(3)Summoning and ranging skills should be fixed, since apparently most pk combat are done on that arenas nowadays. Make it multicombat, also make the summons able to attack, we won't see many ELEs poofage since the high level monster's attrib is also capped. It won't solve everything, but it should point us to the what the next step is;

 

(4)Boost pots should have some effect in that arena. I really think about what do drink and when to drink boost pots is part of the "pk skill", i would not like it to go away. I know, it makes pk slightly more expensive, but i really have fun seeing the cooldown and thinking what pot to drink next to match the opponent, etc, its great fun;

 

(5)Again, KF is unchanged, Amar et all can still go there and hug trees, the problem is that they won't see as much easy preys as before. Pr0s like to fight people at their level or above anyways, and will prefer dp arena, but so its the life. ^^

 

excellent suggestions :(

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(2)Items restrictions simply wont get implemented, simple as that. Radu won't miss a chance to see lots of high level items poofage. Maybe we can agree in a "community" version, without dragon armors and bronzies, but i highly doubt;

Amen to that.

But it's not only about my castle here, it is also about the game economy, if no items poof anymore, wtf is the point in producing half of the game items?

 

 

(3)Summoning and ranging skills should be fixed, since apparently most pk combat are done on that arenas nowadays. Make it multicombat, also make the summons able to attack, we won't see many ELEs poofage since the high level monster's attrib is also capped. It won't solve everything, but it should point us to the what the next step is;

The KJ arena is multicombat, so archery should work. Summons, I'll fix them.

 

 

(4)Boost pots should have some effect in that arena. I really think about what do drink and when to drink boost pots is part of the "pk skill", i would not like it to go away. I know, it makes pk slightly more expensive, but i really have fun seeing the cooldown and thinking what pot to drink next to match the opponent, etc, its great fun;

Potions work fine in the arena, except for a/d potions.

 

(5)Again, KF is unchanged, Amar et all can still go there and hug trees, the problem is that they won't see as much easy preys as before. Pr0s like to fight people at their level or above anyways, and will prefer dp arena, but so its the life. ^^

 

Exactly. I am happy that there are quite a few that don't like the arenas, so they can go and fight in KF.

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(4)Boost pots should have some effect in that arena. I really think about what do drink and when to drink boost pots is part of the "pk skill", i would not like it to go away. I know, it makes pk slightly more expensive, but i really have fun seeing the cooldown and thinking what pot to drink next to match the opponent, etc, its great fun;

Potions work fine in the arena, except for a/d potions.

Really?

I did a little test with LightLan the other day, with him using items i believe would have made him just able to hit me 'well', and then (with me already at the attrib cap for coord and inst) i sunk coord and wilderness potions to see if my dodging ability went up... i saw not effect at all.

 

but kk if you say they're working, great, i'll just write it off as a bad test ^^

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(4)Boost pots should have some effect in that arena. I really think about what do drink and when to drink boost pots is part of the "pk skill", i would not like it to go away. I know, it makes pk slightly more expensive, but i really have fun seeing the cooldown and thinking what pot to drink next to match the opponent, etc, its great fun;

Potions work fine in the arena, except for a/d potions.

Really?

I did a little test with LightLan the other day, with him using items i believe would have made him just able to hit me 'well', and then (with me already at the attrib cap for coord and inst) i sunk coord and wilderness potions to see if my dodging ability went up... i saw not effect at all.

 

but kk if you say they're working, great, i'll just write it off as a bad test ^^

 

 

They do work, unless your at the attrib cap for that particular arena

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Oh, sorry, I meant the accuracy and evasion and stuff. The attributes and a/d will be capped (although their potions work up to the cap).

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Oh, sorry, I meant the accuracy and evasion and stuff. The attributes and a/d will be capped (although their potions work up to the cap).
Well, i was talking about a/d/coord/wildness/reasoning/etc pots, its fun to drink them while pking, my suggestion was to make them have some effect on the capped arenas, like you gain an "effective" bonus of +5 of attack when you drink a potion, instead of increasing your attack skill by 5. Its some minor stuff, but it improves the pk "feeling", at least for me.

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(3)Summoning and ranging skills should be fixed, since apparently most pk combat are done on that arenas nowadays. Make it multicombat, also make the summons able to attack, we won't see many ELEs poofage since the high level monster's attrib is also capped. It won't solve everything, but it should point us to the what the next step is;

The KJ arena is multicombat, so archery should work. Summons, I'll fix them.

 

thank you, u made me a happy Summoner :)

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