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Wipe and Cap

Wipe and Cap  

142 members have voted

  1. 1. Would you be interested on a Wipe&Cap of EL? (read before voting if you please)

    • Yes, I think it's high-time.
      29
    • No, this won't work.
      107
    • Maybe, but I'd like some more clarity.
      6


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Hermit's Topic has inspired me to start my own poll. I've spent some time on this, so please read it before you criticize, I tried to keep it as short and to the point as possible, anyone with a fair amount of braincells should be able to understand the concept.

 

I suggest:

 

a wipe, and then place a cap on levels, start off at about 60/80 or w/e.

 

Advantages

 

*Firstly it will bring balance to the game, the more 'enthusiastic' players (with 'a bit' more time than your average working class) will not get so far ahead that everyone else is just grinding to catch up (leaving very little time to do anything else), skills wont be just numbers that need to get higher, fighters will actually have time to fight each other, than playing 'lets see who can grind the most hours a day. Mixers can actually concentrate on making something worthwhile, instead of creating thousands upon thousands of meaningless items, just because they give the most exp at the lowest cost.

 

*Players will then also get time to try out some other skills they previously disregarded. And if you have achieved maximum level on one particular char, you can always try a new char with a different speci/attributes/nexus or w/e.

 

*Then when you raise the cap, and introduce new content to the game, you will have a larger playerbase at max level, so it will benefit much more people, and it will be used by more people). Thus you can target the majority of players with an update, instead of only a certain amount.

 

*Other advantages of a fresh start is you can also adjust prices for recipe's, NPC items, amount of items required for god quests, price and lvl requirement to start new guild, and ingredients required for items, etc. (and also get rid of PP buying, if one was so inclined).

 

*New players won't leave because of the insurmountable amount of playing time it will take just get to a competetive level.

 

These are but a few things I can think of from the top of my head, I'm sure there are many more, but it all comes down gathering up everything, sifting out the bad, keeping the good and improving on it.

 

Disadvantages

 

*ALOT of things will require readjustments.

 

*People will lose years of playing time (only real flaw I see in my idea... but nothing can be done about it)

 

*Certain people might lose the $$ they spent on buying their chars (/cry)

 

 

It will straighten out alot of issues IMO, and make the game alot more newb-friendly, and retain alot more seasoned players who don't have the time to keep up with the more 'enthusiastic' players.

 

If you have any questions I'd be happy to answer them, if your gunna rant, here's my careface --> :wub:

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You're forgetting something. EL has very limited content and adding a level cap makes this more obvious.

 

Everquest has done this recently by providing a Legends server, but that's a game where the char is defined by it's gear, flags and grouping skills and where levels are secondary. So there is a lot more content to revisit and you can't rely on your main to provide your alt or the market/bazaar to provide you twinkies. Also, it was optional. The server was added, not the entire game was reset as that would've resulted in the mass exit you will see here too from players that have spent years on their chars.

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You're forgetting something. EL has very limited content and adding a level cap makes this more obvious.

 

Everquest has done this recently by providing a Legends server, but that's a game where the char is defined by it's gear, flags and grouping skills and where levels are secondary. So there is a lot more content to revisit and you can't rely on your main to provide your alt or the market/bazaar to provide you twinkies. Also, it was optional. The server was added, not the entire game was reset as that would've resulted in the mass exit you will see here too from players that have spent years on their chars.

 

No I did not forget, I'm of the opinion that compressing the amount of content into a lesser amount levels will actually make it seem like it has more content. Also as I previously stated, that since the majority of people will be around the same level the already overworked dev's can then contentrate on the masses, instead of throwing a bone to one group at a time every few months.

 

edit: sorry forgot to reply to your 2nd paragraph: yes there might be some small exodus, but where have you been the past few years? Players are getting less and less, with very few newbies sticking around for above stated reasons. Population might take a small knock, but it will steadily increase after that.

Edited by St_Arcane

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And what then when everyone is max level. Just pk and harvest your butt off to get more rostos to pay for it? How is that different from the PK-server idea tbh, except that you start with a higher level and don't have to work for your levels? What's the purpose of having levels and attributes on a character, if everyone should be just the same?

 

I find it totally unreasonable that people who spent countless hours (and in some cases $$$$) should lose everything they worked for all these years.

 

However, I do agree that the current situation is also not very awesome, considering that begginers would have to grind around 2 years to get to a decent level.

 

Something like changing the level cap to like 140, and those who already have higher than it get compensation in some way and get de-leveled to 140 would sound a lot more reasonable, but not fair either. Full wipe, no way.

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And what then when everyone is max level. Just pk and harvest your butt off to get more rostos to pay for it? How is that different from the PK-server idea tbh, except that you start with a higher level and don't have to work for your levels? What's the purpose of having levels and attributes on a character, if everyone should be just the same?

 

I find it totally unreasonable that people who spent countless hours (and in some cases $$$$) should lose everything they worked for all these years.

 

However, I do agree that the current situation is also not very awesome, considering that begginers would have to grind around 2 years to get to a decent level.

 

Something like changing the level cap to like 140, and those who already have higher than it get compensation in some way and get de-leveled to 140 would sound a lot more reasonable, but not fair either. Full wipe, no way.

 

Well to start off, the PK server was designed for people already familiar with the game, you also need to pay $5 (well unless it changed in last year or so) to get in, and newbies don't start in that server. Also it's PK.

 

Yes, like I said it shall be a great injustice to the high level's who are still around, I can't see any way around it though. Your suggestion of just nerfing the high levels to a lower level has been suggested (think it was Erma's topic) and shot down before, and aside 140 is still years of work, so back to newbs not wanting to spend the next 2-3 years of their lives to get to a level where they can actually take part in the game.

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By your logic, the pk server should be packed.

Its capped at 100ad, something you can reach in 3-6 months of casual play

(focused on a\d leveling in that period), there is a low population count, and there are few

people in pr0 armor, so most fight in 'augs\ti longs'. It allows multi-play, so you can 'try other skills'

and mixing is with fruit, so leveling is much easier.

 

Yet the #1 reason stated, and is the source of their current poll is, no one wants to start over, even

with caps. (A\D caps only)

 

Any changes that bring balance can be done without a wipe. Most players (PvE Mixers) compete with themselves

and what monster they can fight, and what item they can mix. Only PKers compete with each other.

 

So is pointless to wipe the server to make a minor player population ?happy? by making them start over?

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By your logic, the pk server should be packed.

Its capped at 100ad, something you can reach in 3-6 months of casual play

(focused on a\d leveling in that period), there is a low population count, and there are few

people in pr0 armor, so most fight in 'augs\ti longs'. It allows multi-play, so you can 'try other skills'

and mixing is with fruit, so leveling is much easier.

 

Yet the #1 reason stated, and is the source of their current poll is, no one wants to start over, even

with caps. (A\D caps only)

 

Any changes that bring balance can be done without a wipe. Most players (PvE Mixers) compete with themselves

and what monster they can fight, and what item they can mix. Only PKers compete with each other.

 

So is pointless to wipe the server to make a minor player population ?happy? by making them start over?

Yet again: PK server is P2P, no new players start on it. It's PK-based, its still the same old game, with a 100's cap.

 

The 'pointless wipe' is to equal the playing field (by pissing off the current player base), and (yet again) so that newbs don't have to spend 2 years catching up.

Edited by St_Arcane

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Couldn't have said it better. Voted option #1. Though I do see a lot of people voted no, and I bet I can name 50% of them. :P

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By your logic, the pk server should be packed.

Its capped at 100ad, something you can reach in 3-6 months of casual play

(focused on a\d leveling in that period), there is a low population count, and there are few

people in pr0 armor, so most fight in 'augs\ti longs'. It allows multi-play, so you can 'try other skills'

and mixing is with fruit, so leveling is much easier.

 

Yet the #1 reason stated, and is the source of their current poll is, no one wants to start over, even

with caps. (A\D caps only)

 

Any changes that bring balance can be done without a wipe. Most players (PvE Mixers) compete with themselves

and what monster they can fight, and what item they can mix. Only PKers compete with each other.

 

So is pointless to wipe the server to make a minor player population ?happy? by making them start over?

Yet again: PK server is P2P, no new players start on it. It's PK-based, its still the same old game, with a 100's cap.

 

The 'pointless wipe' is to equal the playing field (by pissing off the current player base), and (yet again) so that newbs don't have to spend 2 years catching up.

 

$5 for life. Pk server players have offered to give accounts. Buy accounts for players, and so on.

Again, your 'playing field' is about PK. (So PK based is a good thing) No PvE or mixer cares about the 'level of the field'. In this regards, there is nothing

for newbs to catch up too. If a player spent 2 years reaching a level, why shouldn't it take a newb 2 years to reach it as well?

 

So if its a not about just PKing, how does reducing (example) everyones summon level to zero, make the game instantly balanced?

I certain Raz, Tigerclaw and others are excited at the prospect of starting over, just so a new player can feel good that his beginning levels are

the tops?

 

So what happens if 80 summons is deemed "too much of a grind, take more than a month to reach" should everything be altered so you can reach the max

on any skill in a month? Is this fun?

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@st_arcane: Well, what you try to fix with it? Pk at high levels? People devoted years training their char, paying real money to buy stuff from shop, then you want to wipe it all because you fail at PvP? Note that it won't fix your PvP problem either, because you would still be pwned anyways.

Edited by Lorck

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$5 for life. Pk server players have offered to give accounts. Buy accounts for players, and so on.

Again, your 'playing field' is about PK. (So PK based is a good thing) No PvE or mixer cares about the 'level of the field'. In this regards, there is nothing

for newbs to catch up too. If a player spent 2 years reaching a level, why shouldn't it take a newb 2 years to reach it as well?

 

So what happens if 80 summons is deemed "too much of a grind, take more than a month to reach" should everything be altered so you can reach the max

on any skill in a month? Is this fun?

 

Bob stop reading what you want and open your eyes. Nobody starts on the PK server, nobody even knows about the PK server, I bet half the people don't even know how to get into the PK server. I'd bet alot of people find out about the PK server long after they started playing so as I've said, they don't start on the PK server, and it's not free, thus your arguement is void.

 

And yes, I understand you and everyone else have alot to lose, as I've said, sorry but it's neccesary. The game is imbalanced, yes fighter levels are way ahead of all the other skills so naturally a wipe benefits fighters the most, but how many top 50 mixers do you know, do not just spam-create the same old cheapest/most exp items over and over to grind levels, instead of making something usefull?

 

So if its a not about just PKing, how does reducing (example) everyones summon level to zero, make the game instantly balanced?

I certain Raz, Tigerclaw and others are excited at the prospect of starting over, just so a new player can feel good that his beginning levels are

the tops?

 

So what happens if 80 summons is deemed "too much of a grind, take more than a month to reach" should everything be altered so you can reach the max

on any skill in a month? Is this fun?

 

Well if everything is readjusted it wont take you all that long to go back to making smegloads of bear/tigerstones to play 'who has the higher number', so that you can summon pretty little critters to follow you around, since you yourself said summoning has no connection with fighting at all.

 

And no, (as I've said before), if there is a large quantity of maxed out level's, increase the cap when you update with new content.

 

@st_arcane: Well, what you try to fix with it? Pk at high levels? People devoted years training their char, paying real money to buy stuff from shop, then you want to wipe it all because you fail at PvP? Note that it won't fix your PvP problem either, because you would still be pwned anyways.

No Lorck actually i don't pvp/play anymore. And if crushing people with uber stats gained by years of clicking and pressing home ** (in your case gained from multi-training summons in guild-maps) is considered being good at PK, then I was awesome.

 

** = forgot to add: or forking out a few $$

 

My careface btw ---> :P

Edited by St_Arcane

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@st_arcane: Well, what you try to fix with it? Pk at high levels? People devoted years training their char, paying real money to buy stuff from shop, then you want to wipe it all because you fail at PvP? Note that it won't fix your PvP problem either, because you would still be pwned anyways.

No Lorck actually i don't pvp/play anymore. And if crushing people with uber stats gained by years of clicking and pressing home (in your case gained from multi-training summons in guild-maps) is considered being good at PK, then I was awesome.

 

My careface btw ---> :P

I never trained with summons in guild maps, i barely trained on guild maps, to be fair, or do you forgot your guild of wimps summoning giants to try to kill me while pvp? And when you was good at pk? Never? You try to be "good" at pk by wiping all people's skills & items? Rofl... This change is not necessary, and ridiculous, imho.

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A wipe would cause a lot of the current player base to leave EL.. I don't see the need, or point in this to be honest.

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Well, thats not what Tempest told me. :P And since I'm not playing I'm not sure what guild you are associating me with, but by your description of them, they will probably side with robotbob on the summoning level thingy.

 

Anyway rant noted, you are entitled to your opinion and have every right to put it in writing, moving along.

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I'm not even voting on this one.

 

Putting the caps on will make EL not all that different from the 500000000 other games out there.

 

I like that EL is different, I like that it's pretty much eternal, and I do not mind the grind (maybe I'm silly, but I doubt I'm the only one :)). And more importantly, and probably the reason I can stand the grind, is that I have no problem seeing that people who invested years in leveling their chars have better stats than I do.

 

I tried some of the games that have caps, which can be obtained in a matter of months. They are fun, but they have grind just as well. And the grind there usually is limited to 1 or 2 activities that give the best experience, the rest is peanuts. Most of these games cannot be played without a focus on combat. Most are questbased in one way or another too. EL can be played for years by people who don't care for combat, and they can still find plenty of things to focus on.

 

More importantly:

I just don't see the use in wiping the entire server (where people still come back to after sometimes years of absence) when the changes needed to come to something similar like you suggest, would rather call for a new game to be built. In that case, if Radu wanted something like this, he could just stop the support for this server (no new chars can be created, no more updates will be done, but can still be played) and start a new server that looks the same but offers just another WoW ripoff.

 

Just my opinion :P

 

PS Starcy I'd still like you to come back :P

Edited by Dilly

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Well, thats not what Tempest told me. :P
Temp has bad taste for friends... :)
And since I'm not playing I'm not sure what guild you are associating me with, but by your description of them, they will probably side with robotbob on the summoning level thingy.
The guild you was when i left playing: HIM. That guild attacked me while pvp (even when there was PACT to not attack while pvp, honorable <3) and now accuse me of training behind bots? Wtf?

 

Btw, yeah, i agree with robotbob, there is no problem with the mixing skills, and the wipe would only make people quit massively...

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And then what? We will find ourselfs with best gear at 80 a/d and fight eachother for unreasonable amounts of time?

I suggest introducing classes, that will make the game more balanced.

We all want to be equal, i wanted that also until few months ago, until i realized that, even if we were equal, we would all have the same things(armor,weps,atributes) so strategy or no strategy, we would just fight for minutes and minutes until someone gets bored

Edited by Soul

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You're forgetting something. EL has very limited content and adding a level cap makes this more obvious.

No I did not forget, I'm of the opinion that compressing the amount of content into a lesser amount levels will actually make it seem like it has more content.

 

Really? 60 a/d is two-three weeks if you know what you're doing, two months at best for a newb. Then what? 80 in all skills....maybe a year, with harvest being the one that'll be tricky.

 

Also as I previously stated, that since the majority of people will be around the same level the already overworked dev's can then contentrate on the masses, instead of throwing a bone to one group at a time every few months.

But EL has nothing to offer if everyone is the same level and the nature of the game doesn't allow for much change in that. You'd have to turn the game up-side down and since that would upset mostly the people that generate the bulk of the income of the game, that's a pretty big risk to take.

 

edit: sorry forgot to reply to your 2nd paragraph: yes there might be some small exodus, but where have you been the past few years? Players are getting less and less, with very few newbies sticking around for above stated reasons. Population might take a small knock, but it will steadily increase after that.

Your small knock is likely to be entire top 50 in non-combat and top200+ in a/d (yes, this sounds more dramatic then it is, cause there's overlap). I would first draw up a road map on what changes there would be, get consensus on that, start implementing the most dramatic ones and then reset.

The fact that el doesn't gain much in population is only partially because of the level grind. In the core, it's a solo game with a chat box and the more popular MMO's require one to work together much more, because of class/race/deity restrictions. The irony is that frustration with these restrictions is what sparked this game. Another major factor is that a lot of small joys have been removed, because game income dropped (rare rates, drops on monsters etc) and grinds have been made more labor intensive.

 

Besides, you can make an alt and dump your main if you wanna regain some of the joys of easy levels. Trust me, it helps.

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I like that EL is different, I like that it's pretty much eternal, and I do not mind the grind (maybe I'm silly, but I doubt I'm the only one :)). And more importantly, and probably the reason I can stand the grind, is that I have no problem seeing that people who invested years in leveling their chars have better stats than I do.

 

speechless. this is exactly what i feel. i dont mind grinding. it just shows i take EL more seriously then others and i'm awarded with the ability to summon better then someone or able to Pk someone.. and just looking at the ranking makes me feel all warm inside :P

 

Voted: No.

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Let's make another poll. :/

 

Why is it that people feel the need to make polls if one they read isn't the way they like it. This is nuts! Enough already please.

 

St_Arcane you said you don't play anymore yet you come here and want to suggest something that was suggested just yesterday but doesn't seem people really want.

 

I am one of the people who leveled my character on my own from a newb on IP. This has taken me around 3 years now to get the levels I have. To have that wiped because someone who doesn't even play anymore (and talks a lot of shit about the game on the unofficial forums iirc) thinks it will "level the playing field" is just messed up.

 

EL is the type of game that most people play to gain levels which put them in a position to be "at the top" of the ranking system.

 

It seems like the only ones that want to be that competitive to suggest a wipe/cap are the a/d trainers (correct me if I am wrong here). But it also seems that 98% of the competitive PKers in EL BUY CHARACTERS that have had multiple owners and much higher levels than they could/want to put in the time to obtain themselves.

 

If PKers really want to level the playing field then here is a hint...

 

STOP BUYING CHARACTERS!

 

Work your levels yourselves and find out exactly how much of an accomplishment feeling you get as you get higher and realize how much it would piss you off if someone took all that work away from you so people from one aspect of the game can be "happy" for a few months.

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