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Entropy

NMT idea

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I have an idea that hopefully most people will agree with.

Basically, I want to make the NMT breakable, with a 1/40K chance (+/- something due to astrology).

However, after it breaks it would transform into a new cape, which would also give the NMT perk, but also some accuracy and armor, maybe 6 points in total. This cape would also have a 1/40K break chance, and would just disappear when it breaks. And if a lot breaks, I can increase the drop rate too.

So, what do you think?

NMT and Skeptic are the best Perks a Man could ever hope to get, any other Perk is just a BoNuS to an already awesome game. "Capes are crap, and only an item of show,and judging by the Cape you are wearing ... shows everyone (ImO) your weakness". Perks are forever. Yeah, due to spending Pick Points on Perks I have small Health numbers...so what. In another couple of years, I'll still have my Perks. Can you say that about your Precious Cape(s) ? Nope. Also, as I continue to grow in Eternal Lands,(with the Perks in place) my Health numbers will get bigger and bigger as I continue to place Pick Points where they are needed...and I will become stronger,quicker and more stealthy in both Attack and Defence. Bet on it. Perks Rule !

 

Tokie

GM of Poundin'You (#nU) Guild :(

 

 

Good Luck to you with that :)

 

 

Here is the issues I see

 

And I don't want to flog a dead horse as we did with the debate we had last time over this issue

 

If you are making a NMT stone, and those like tokie with his awesome perks, decide to remove it, the demand for nmt capes will rise

 

If drop rate is increased, the value of the cape will fall..or will it? If the value falls to say, a 100k/cape range. Then those that fight the higher end monsters /yetis/cocks etc that drop this cape (because the drop rate for cape on fluffy/fero is quite low, and has been very low for a long time) will decide to keep these capes in storage for their own use, and wont flood them outward to market so that newer players have a chance to benefit their a/d trainning to reach the levels faster to be competitive in pk with this yeti/dragon farmers..Then these same people start threads about pk is dead etc.

 

There has been (in the last year or so) a few things that make lower level fighters stuggle to catch up.

 

Most top charaters enjoyed years of -19 true site bug/feature (that newer players will never have)

They have enjoyed farming tougher monsters for xp/gc's/drops in high end armors (do to their undestructable nmt)

True, a lot started before stackable srs etc, and it was slower going in the beginning. I dont argue this. But the top a/ders had a few years with a lot of favorable conditions/advantages which new players can not enjoy.

 

Having the NMT break, is giving an extra advantage to the top players. Not just because they have had the time to level, but these are also the folks that will get dropped the majority of the capes. This gives them the position to either dictate the market value, or to keep for them selves (which will most likely happen)

 

Currently, since the mass Harvestor alts exodus from EL, the player base has seemed a bit smaller, and items on market like NMT, appear to be flooded. I dont think this is a case of the drop rate being to high, just a case of lack of new players entering game. It takes time for a new player to get enough resorces to afford an nmt. Perhaps the drop rate could be tweaked so that less nmt's are dropped/month as new (active) players enter the game.

 

If the broken nmt is repairable, it is a good chance for some income for radu. broken nmt + 2 Binding stones to fix or something of that nature. I would support this, just for this fact. However, even if it is a cheap fix to repair the nmt, I see most people rushing to get it repaired and not risking a used nmt to break in trainning. Then the only way for them to exit would be critical fails tailoring..Though, I doubt they would exit, would just mean a lot of extra saving stones.

 

Anyhow. I have only seen 2 or 3 people use a NMW cape, and iirc it's break rate is about 1/40k. A lot of people will stop using the cape, take the perk like tokie, And the top yeti farmers complaining that they cant sell all thise darn orange capes in their storage. This will slow down the market on nexus stones/nmt's bi-lateral motion in market. Ebul rich yeti trainner buys newbies nexus stone....Newbie got some money and buys ebul rich guys new dropped nmt..

 

This is the way I see it anyhow.

 

It is intresting, and I am not sure how it will all play out, But for those of you that jump on and say oO I 1oo% Support idea, think a bit about it first. There is upside and downside of everything ;)

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Thumbs up for Wizzy's analysis.

So if NMT gets breakable, wouldn't that mean players will be staying on the same monsters for a longer time, hoping to reduce the breaking chance, but at the same time increasing boredom with the prospect of yet another 10k ogre/fluf/feros? I'm not sure that's the effect we want...

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I doubt yeti serpers will hoard all the NMTs, because enough to supply the whole fighting community will come through them, so they would soon have too many for their personal use. It soon wouldnt make any sense for them to not sell them.

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Most top charaters enjoyed years of -19 true site bug/feature (that newer players will never have)

They have enjoyed farming tougher monsters for xp/gc's/drops in high end armors (do to their undestructable nmt)

True, a lot started before stackable srs etc, and it was slower going in the beginning. I dont argue this. But the top a/ders had a few years with a lot of favorable conditions/advantages which new players can not enjoy.

 

Having the NMT break, is giving an extra advantage to the top players. Not just because they have had the time to level, but these are also the folks that will get dropped the majority of the capes. This gives them the position to either dictate the market value, or to keep for them selves (which will most likely happen)

 

This is exactly the problem I have with this, and had with mini-events as well!

 

IMHO, this is a very good post, that totally is in-line with my thoughts.

 

Edit: For the smart asses; mini-events are relevant to mixers, and less to ADers ofc. But same principle: older, higher levelled chars got levels easier than ppl now do get those levels.

Edited by machevort

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I can understand what Wizzy said but wouldn't it help to allow Ogres to drop the NMT also if it gets changed so it is breakable and increased drop rate.

 

I think this would solve the minor issue of having it "favor" the high levels.

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I can understand what Wizzy said but wouldn't it help to allow Ogres to drop the NMT also if it gets changed so it is breakable and increased drop rate.

 

I think this would solve the minor issue of having it "favor" the high levels.

yes, that would help. of course.But there was no indication that this would be the case from previous posts.

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Maybe we should remove NMT completely.

 

Seriously, the idea depresses me. I finally got enough gc in sto to where I can seriously think about saving up for NMT, and now it might be breakable. :-(

 

But then it drops more often, so prices goes down? Or price goes up, because ppl hoard it because it's breakable?

 

Or will we soon see NMT at 35kgc?! :-)

 

I wish it could stay the same, but this game will always be changing.

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tbh if NMT would be breakable it wouldnt have any effect on newer players

most of the older players trained before there was NMT, and when they were breakable before

and most dont even use NMT before fluffy levels, unbreakable or not, its hard to save up for one before that

 

besides if enough break, and the droprate is high enough NMT will be cheaper so newer players dont have to pay that much anymore

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I think, the NMT cape is more or less fine as it is now.

 

The only problem i see is, that it doesn't break, so nearly none leaves the game (only if you drop one and it poofs or BROD)

 

So making it degrade at a very low rate is a very good idea IMO. If the rate is low enough, its nearly unbreakable and the price might be high enough to still make it a valuable item.

 

Keep in mind, that the NMT perk costs 7 pickpoints, so a NMT cape at 20k gc would be just a joke.

 

Yes, if the drop rate and the degrade rate are well balanced, that the cape still would have a market price of 200-300k gc, it should be fine.

 

IMO not everybody should be able to own a NMT cape, example: newbies training on goblins do not really need one, so if it stays expensive and rare, its fine, i think.

 

Piper

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Most top charaters enjoyed years of -19 true site bug/feature (that newer players will never have)

They have enjoyed farming tougher monsters for xp/gc's/drops in high end armors (do to their undestructable nmt)

True, a lot started before stackable srs etc, and it was slower going in the beginning. I dont argue this. But the top a/ders had a few years with a lot of favorable conditions/advantages which new players can not enjoy.

 

You make it seem like the older players had it easier. However, that's not really the case.

Now there are more spawns, more training monsters, some monsters dropping more gold, quests that give a/d exp, better gear, and so on.

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Most top charaters enjoyed years of -19 true site bug/feature (that newer players will never have)

They have enjoyed farming tougher monsters for xp/gc's/drops in high end armors (do to their undestructable nmt)

True, a lot started before stackable srs etc, and it was slower going in the beginning. I dont argue this. But the top a/ders had a few years with a lot of favorable conditions/advantages which new players can not enjoy.

 

You make it seem like the older players had it easier. However, that's not really the case.

Now there are more spawns, more training monsters, some monsters dropping more gold, quests that give a/d exp, better gear, and so on.

 

 

I thought all day about this.I think they should just break! Go ahead and break or degrade and non repair just like dragon armor.Make them cost more gc too..This way when one drops for me? I can raise my price to 550Kgc for it.I think your idea rocks Entropy.:) Go for it bossman!

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If the broken nmt is repairable, it is a good chance for some income for radu. broken nmt + 2 Binding stones to fix or something of that nature. I would support this, just for this fact.

No more bindings, enrichments etc used in new ideas. it's hard enough to get them as it as and all the top manuers bicker and bs over them, and they just keep paying more and more. thread+orange dye would be more feasible, use unused stuff ingame for new ideas.

 

Most top charaters enjoyed years of -19 true site bug/feature (that newer players will never have)

They have enjoyed farming tougher monsters for xp/gc's/drops in high end armors (do to their undestructable nmt)

True, a lot started before stackable srs etc, and it was slower going in the beginning. I dont argue this. But the top a/ders had a few years with a lot of favorable conditions/advantages which new players can not enjoy.

 

You make it seem like the older players had it easier. However, that's not really the case.

Now there are more spawns, more training monsters, some monsters dropping more gold, quests that give a/d exp, better gear, and so on.

 

 

I thought all day about this.I think they should just break! Go ahead and break or degrade and non repair just like dragon armor.Make them cost more gc too..This way when one drops for me? I can raise my price to 550Kgc for it.I think your idea rocks Entropy.:) Go for it bossman!

 

Utterly shallow minded. Try and think as a whole, just not for greed.

 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

make nmt breakable, make everything ingame repairable, not incl little stuff like leathers etc. REMOVE BROD, and up the break rates a tad. problem solved.

Edited by Luigi

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Most top charaters enjoyed years of -19 true site bug/feature (that newer players will never have)

They have enjoyed farming tougher monsters for xp/gc's/drops in high end armors (do to their undestructable nmt)

True, a lot started before stackable srs etc, and it was slower going in the beginning. I dont argue this. But the top a/ders had a few years with a lot of favorable conditions/advantages which new players can not enjoy.

 

You make it seem like the older players had it easier. However, that's not really the case.

Now there are more spawns, more training monsters, some monsters dropping more gold, quests that give a/d exp, better gear, and so on.

 

No. I dont mean to say that older players had it easy.

 

They have had a not easy time. I was one of them ^^

 

Though some of them have had a few advantages,, and I use TS -19a/d pots as an example.

 

 

The old players had a hard road..it is the new players I worry about. And I use the two year ts bug/feature as an example of older players having an advantage over time to the younger players comimg to game.

 

I am not completely against a breakable nmt, or repairable cape..etc. I just wonder about the outcome.

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There have been a lot of good points raised thus far. Overall, I agree that the NMT should be breakable. If unbreakable NMT's keep entering the game, and so few are removed (acid rain, brod, or inactive storages), the market will become increasingly saturated. The end result is a 75% lower break rate for too many players, which in turn leads to far too few items leaving the game.

 

I think it is reasonable to expect that lower level creatures are meant to be fought by lower level players, in lower level armor. Gargoyles should be fought by a player in upper 20s or 30s a/d, maybe in leather armor, rather than someone in full steel armor and a CoL. The same goes for Ogres, which I have seen trained by players in dragon armor and a CoL. The players using level-inappropriate armor (and NMT) can farm those monsters, train for longer, and may spend less overall on armor than another player using augmented leather, or a titanium chain mail, without an NMT.

 

If NMT's are repairable, virtually none of them would leave the game - just a few extra saving stones. If the goal is to remove some of the capes, with a side benefit of stimulating demand of training armor, let them (eventually) break.

 

The suggestion to remove the branch of destruction may be a reasonable offset for the NMT becoming breakable. Some players would be able to use NMT in PK, and still be at a disadvantage to those using perk cloaks (e.g. BP, Mirror), as well as the mana burn rings, bone of death, etc. A cape of the unbreakable would still be important for PK, but not necessarily be the end-all be-all PK cape. PK used to be less of a hateful quest for vengeance, and more of a fun "You killed me, I'll train up and beat you next time" environment. The incessant PK-driven flames and outright disgusting attitudes do not reflect well upon EL. Furthermore, what new player would want to enter PK when he has to be warned "watch out if you decide to enter PK - some rich player might try to destroy all of your hard-earned stuff". As has been mentioned previously on the subject of game development, other successful games should be looked at to see what works. I have not heard of any other (similar) game in which players can deliberately and permanently destroy items of another player.

 

To sum up:

NMT should be breakable, as proposed. Not repairable.

Suggestion: eliminate BroD to improve player environment.

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The brod is in some way good for the el market, since when someone breaks an item it has to be replaced and bought by an ingame manuer..

Then again, since there is a red cape now, i dont think the brod and bod has a real effect, since only newer players or maybe some charbuyers will get hit by a brod, i every now and then walk into a brod, but i still enjoy it, last time i fought against a brod (or maybe a sunbreaker) i lost 2 weapons a bp and degraded some items, it gave me reason to make some money again, it keeps me occupied :)

 

I do agree with asgnny tho, it shouldnt be the fact that pk can only be entered with multiple red cloaks, they break so easy that in multi with 1 using a brod, it wll be destroyed by the other player its weapon quicker then it will block the brod.. Sure this might not be a reason to remove the brod, but it only reduces the fun of pk.. Although it does remove the im evil i brod'ed .... a dragon armor.. I think it will cost me a few months to get over the dissapointment of losing that sentence..

 

Should nmt be breakable? i dont know, i always had the perk and in the time i dont have the perk, i dont feel im losing much armor while fighting..

This might be luck..

I think removing nmt from game (as it used to be right?), would be a nicer idea..

It will cause people to wear leather while training again and remove the dragon armor training people..

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To sum up:

NMT should be breakable, as proposed. Not repairable.

Suggestion: eliminate BroD to improve player environment.

 

Can agree with the 'not repairable' bit, although I do think that in that case: why not slightly increase breakrates in general?From what radu said earlier, he doesn't necessarily want NMTs to leave the game, but he does want the unbreakable item gone. Why not stimulate other skills in the process by making the cloak repairable, while also upping all breakrates by a small percentage. Anyways.. it's fine by me either way, I'll just neg to get the perk anyways :)

 

Would love to see brod removed from the game for all the reasons you named.

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The suggestion to remove the branch of destruction may be a reasonable offset for the NMT becoming breakable. Some players would be able to use NMT in PK, and still be at a disadvantage to those using perk cloaks (e.g. BP, Mirror), as well as the mana burn rings, bone of death, etc. A cape of the unbreakable would still be important for PK, but not necessarily be the end-all be-all PK cape. PK used to be less of a hateful quest for vengeance, and more of a fun "You killed me, I'll train up and beat you next time" environment. The incessant PK-driven flames and outright disgusting attitudes do not reflect well upon EL. Furthermore, what new player would want to enter PK when he has to be warned "watch out if you decide to enter PK - some rich player might try to destroy all of your hard-earned stuff". As has been mentioned previously on the subject of game development, other successful games should be looked at to see what works. I have not heard of any other (similar) game in which players can deliberately and permanently destroy items of another player.

Amen, hallelujah and marijuana.

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To sum up:

NMT should be breakable, as proposed. Not repairable.

Suggestion: eliminate BroD to improve player environment.

 

Can agree with the 'not repairable' bit, although I do think that in that case: why not slightly increase breakrates in general?From what radu said earlier, he doesn't necessarily want NMTs to leave the game, but he does want the unbreakable item gone. Why not stimulate other skills in the process by making the cloak repairable, while also upping all breakrates by a small percentage. Anyways.. it's fine by me either way, I'll just neg to get the perk anyways :)

 

Would love to see brod removed from the game for all the reasons you named.

If NMT's don't leave the game (assuming saving stones are used for mixing), and are repairable, unless there is accelerated growth in the number of new players, there will be more and more NMT's entering the game than exiting. A few more saving stones would be used up, but there would never be a need for a player with an NMT to buy a newly dropped one. The quantity demanded would be dictated by the number of new players who can afford a NMT cape, rather than that same number plus players who have broken theirs.

 

What about repairing other cloaks (such as mirror) instead? (would require the mirror cape degrading to e.g. a black cloak without the mirror skin perk).

 

Another thing to keep in mind: If the NMT cloak is breakable, I'd imagine more players will want tailors to convert their NMT cloaks into NMW. Not a reliable way to level, but something for tailors to strive for level-wise, nonetheless.

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If NMT's don't leave the game (assuming saving stones are used for mixing), and are repairable, unless there is accelerated growth in the number of new players, there will be more and more NMT's entering the game than exiting. A few more saving stones would be used up, but there would never be a need for a player with an NMT to buy a newly dropped one. The quantity demanded would be dictated by the number of new players who can afford a NMT cape, rather than that same number plus players who have broken theirs.

 

What about repairing other cloaks (such as mirror) instead? (would require the mirror cape degrading to e.g. a black cloak without the mirror skin perk).

 

Another thing to keep in mind: If the NMT cloak is breakable, I'd imagine more players will want tailors to convert their NMT cloaks into NMW. Not a reliable way to level, but something for tailors to strive for level-wise, nonetheless.

 

 

I don't know about making other cloaks repairable, that sounds mighty much like making the 'rare cloaks' manuable, which then of course would include more enriched essies or rare stones, while we already have a shortage of those, especially the stones. <insert rant about top manuers driving up the prices to ridiculous heights>

 

As said, repairable or not, I'm fine either way, I just figured yesterday it might be a nice occasion to give new influence to a skill that, at the moment, is pretty much about leveling without incentive (except if bankrupcy is considered a goal too).

Edited by Dilly

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To sum up:

NMT should be breakable, as proposed. Not repairable.

Suggestion: eliminate BroD to improve player environment.

this

 

with perhaps a "small" increase in drop rate and maybe adding it to more monsters, particularly cyclops.

 

i currently have 1 cape and the perk, if the above was implememted with NMT removal i would seriously consider removing the perk and just using the cape again.

 

in adjusting drop rate and break rate think about how much it increases training costs by, say atm with the cape each hit on a lot of the middle lvl mobs costs you about 4gc, that is hits that score dmg, of course lots dont. if the cape even went down to 200kgc and broke 1/40k and ONLY when you took damage that would still more than double the cost of training which would be a big shift within the game. with the recent efforts to allow people who train to build up some gc for pk supplies this could make things worse than before.

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Like the NMT idea but remove the BROD. We got to have BRODs so we can revenge scammers, bagjumpers, ect. Without BROD the will be no BROD tag, bad idea.

AttilaTheHUn

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