Everything will be destroyed eventually(sug. to fix economy)

[elpargo]

ok this may be long but it is a big problem that demands a big solution

 

remenber think of items globally, not the ones you have but the ones EVERY player on EL has.

also remenber that this is an exam of WHAT is the problem and a way to solve it, it is NOT a suggestion of how to create the system nor how to implement it. This just shows the problem and a way to solve it, not how to solve it.(if you didnt undestand the diference think about it before u read on)

 

1- What is the problem?

people have identifed 2 sources of high income for fighters

 

A- books and capes selling for a lot

B- high lvl items, not being sold

 

problem A will be solve with time, ones " everyone"knows how to harv tit ore it wont be that rare anymore. Ex: i have a tit molding book now that anyone will kill for it 2 weeks ago.

 

 

then the real problem is B

 

Now think of EL as a collection of all items. This items r divided into 2 categories:

 

a- the items players have: that is everything in storage and inventory

b- the items AI has: this is divided into items in bags and items not yet "made" like the items monsters "have" and the items NPC sells.

 

the Quotations are because all this items are created and destroyed ones they go from players to NPC/monsters and viceversa.

 

so bottom line is. WE got serps drops, we got manu people making serps. This makes the total number of items of type A(players have) grow and grow and grow. what stop it earlier trik, why trik didnt solve the problem because he didnt destroyed it he just traded for another item (MONEY) and then we had the money problem.

 

so ANY way to make computer take away items form players in exchange for something (because the wont give away for free,exception to the rule god quests) will just make the total of items in the game grow.

 

entropy the concept,not the god :roll: is the problem anything we do that will make AI give items to players will just make the players have more and more, and that will take the prices down and kill the economy.

 

Now that we have the problem. My suggestions(and others i read in this forum)

 

 

 

2- Solutions:

 

a- FULL WIPE!: wrong this will just send the problem into the future in 3-4-6months a year max! this happen again.

 

b- make trik buy items: if we consider money as an items then this wont destroy the items it will just exchange it for other item. so Entropy grows the concept again

 

c- make items SUPER rare: arent they super rare ? come on really how many green cape the game has?

 

variant to c: make it a timed drop. so where is luck? you just have to wait for something to happen? wont that be boring? just make stat and find out the the "drop time" of that item is ones every 2weeks then ones that items is drop u wont play for 1week or so until the times has expire.....

 

so all being said what i suggest:

 

I suggest DESTROY

 

the only way to reduce the items players have is to make them dissapear, not give them something in exchange just gone!

 

the game already destroys items in some ways

1- went you die

2- god quest

 

but they are easy to recover, #1 you can get ur guild or friend or even some1 else to pick and it isint destroyed and the second ones is just a little part of the problem. So we need a real way to destroy the items which wil be it?

 

As in real life everything gets used up, everything gets broken or gets out of date.

 

 

Just think of this ones you have a serp sword why u need a second one? the answer is i dont need it! and thats why the economy is so #$($ up.

 

if we make everything last for some time then the economy starts working again.

 

for example as ent said food spoils so you cant store it. wont a leather armor put into a corner be less usefull then one just made? wont a nice clean titanium armor right from the BlackSmith be better then one a monster drop? the answer to all of them is yes.

 

i suggest a property call durability everything will have "an expiration date" this could be set as the number of times used,(medalions,rings) or the number of HP it has reduced(armor), or the number of HP it has inflicted(weapons), it could lose their magical effect (sigils), everything will die eventually, and you will have to replace it.

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Notes on comments:

1- DO not post stupid 1 line reply

2- DO not reply without reading the whole thing

3- DO NOT talk about implementing this, this is just the theory i know (or think i Know) how to implement it.

4- DO not talk about the other suggestions on this thread.

[Arafin]

I am making a suggestion to your idea:

 

I do not think it should be a damageed hp count or attacked hp count, thats just a waste of time I think.

 

If your fighting a person nad you swing your sword just right, does the other sword not have a chance of breaking?

 

If your armor is hit with a sword or weapon, does it not risk the chain of being piecred and rendered useless or broken by shear force?

 

Wheyou get an item from a creature is it going to be perfect kike on out of the store?

 

 

So I propose this: if and when you strike a a blow to an enemy, you have chance of it breaking.

 

Wood being the weakest, Titanium being the strongest.

 

A wood shield is hit by a rabbit....lol yeah right the rabbits going to break it right? Wrong its not.

 

Now a wooden shield is hit by a cyclops club....yeah you guess it broke and the user is now probably dead if hes using a wooden shield lol.

 

Wooden Shield break chance:

-rabbit=1/10000

-cyclops-1/10

 

Steel shield being the strongest sheidl at the moment is like so:

-rabbit-1/1000000

-Cyclops-1/1000

 

Thats pretty much my idea but let me do some swords too...

 

Gloves seem to be armor now so....we will go to the Iron sword (coolest looking sword if ya ask me lol)

 

Iron sword:

-rabbit-1/1000

-cyclops-1/10

 

Titanium Serpent Sword:

-rabbit-never

-cyclops-1/1000

_________________________________________________________

 

Ok if like Elpargo was saying is done (I just modified his proposed durability idea), it will make economy more steady. We all know when NeXt goes hunting Cyclops he kills atleast 2000 a day, so if he does that, he will waste 2 swords or more depending on mo many hits it takes him to kill the cyclops.

 

e.g.

It takes 10 hits with serp everytime to kill cyc

You kill 100 cyc your sword breaks

You no have to buy a new sword, and if you unlucky, you will have lost your armor as well and need another set of armor

[elpargo]

thanks for the input i really thought about that but as as said in the last part do not talk about implementation or how to make this. the "how to" will come after the comunity accepts the idea.

[Cicero]

At this time, items cannot have any kind of unique statistics like amount of damage received.

[Arafin]

Never said they had to, just stating ideas. If they can not be destroyed, then this is an obsolete way and we will have to move on otherwise make a suggestion, not an unwanted state of fact.

[elpargo]

At this time, items cannot have any kind of unique statistics like amount of damage received.

 

yes Im aware of that, but this is the only way (i have think of) that could fix the economy for ones and for all.

 

 

to arafin: yes i know what i dont want is this thread to become a set of people trowing number of "what they think it should be"

 

in advance i was thinking of a part being the durability and another part that will be a chance of breaking the item has.

[duran]

the break chance would be a all or nothing effect. basicly it either breaks or its fine, there is no health bar for the items. could work i guess but maybe make it based on damage vs armor somehow so that you dont have flat chance. that way a titanium may never break when used against rabbits and similar but when used against cyclops or gargoyles the chance increases...

[elpargo]

as i said before no need for talking about implementation.

 

Just say if u agree and some comments on if this could solve the problem or not. if it is worth to create this or not, etc.

[Learner]

How about if the Ants help out by putting nicer items they find into storage? That means if you die you hope an Ant doesn't find it first and store it forever :!:

 

More seriously, when you die and drop items, there should be a chance that the item will be lost forever and never made it into your bag. But, if you drop 20k in gold, it shouldn't be for the entire 20k, it should be for portions of it.

[Eldwen]

Im not sure if this is possible or not but say that after a monster kills you what ever you drop hte monster picks up. Once someone else kills that monster it will drop all ur stuff, but will be harder to kill because he could possible be wearing tit armor and using a serp. That way people have to fear dying to some degree. It will be hard to get ur stuff back from a monster when he is using it and you dont have any to kill it with.

[elpargo]

eldwen that is adding a huge change to the game engine. And that still keeps the items in the game.

[elpargo]

Suggestion #1

 

Went you die there is a 5%(?) chance that the item is lost forever.(note: if special items are implemented then this will not aply to them)

 

Suggestion #2 variant A

Each weapon/armor will have a "chance to break" on each hit. this chance to break will be determine by a-the creature fighting and b-the armor/weapon itself.

 

For example. if your killing a bunny with a serpent sword the the change to break will be much lower then if your killing a troll with a serp.

 

Suggestion #3 variant B

just have each weapon/armor have a "chance to break" per hit, so if a newbie has a friend that gives him a tit sword it will not be "forever"

 

Suggestion #4

Every artifact you use will "die slowly" capes, medalions, sigils, tools,weapons, armor, anything that ISNT a raw material.

 

for example you have a pickaxe with 5000 points. and lets say each harvest of any mineral takes 1point out of it.

[MoonShadow]

Suggestion #4  

Every artifact you use will "die slowly" capes, medalions, sigils, tools,weapons, armor, anything that ISNT a raw material.

 

for example you have a pickaxe with 5000 points. and lets say each harvest of any mineral takes 1point out of it.

 

I agree that the items gotta break somehow but with those points for each item it's not well i think. The item has to break suddenly, because if you make it how you want it in this suggestion you would be able to plan like "my weapon will break then and then" and you will just carry another weapon with you because you know when it breaks and that is just not logical.

 

Suggestion #3 variant B

just have each weapon/armor have a "chance to break" per hit, so if a  newbie has a friend that gives him a tit sword it will not be "forever"

I don't know if variant A or B is better but i like both of them because it happens suddenly and i think it will add some excitement to the game and it hopefully fixes the balancing.

[Matrixx_sh]

i once posted something about items breaking and the such of other things like that ill have to look for it idea stealer lol jk

[sirdan]

make its chance to break like random like monster drops like a 1-1000 chance for it to break or sumtin

[Killerlamb]

Ways to fix the game:

1. Complete Item Wipe

2. Make books and capes more rare

3. Put High Level Mosnters near Tit mining ares, forcing people to work on fighting AND mining

4. Magical or Unque items--Like in Diablo and every other non-shitty online game

5. The Easy Way--Delete Items all together and go back to Alpha style

[sirdan]

#3 wont work cause i got the magnetizum perk

[elpargo]

Suggestion #4  

Every artifact you use will "die slowly" capes, medalions, sigils, tools,weapons, armor, anything that ISNT a raw material.

 

for example you have a pickaxe with 5000 points. and lets say each harvest of any mineral takes 1point out of it.

 

I agree that the items gotta break somehow but with those points for each item it's not well i think. The item has to break suddenly, because if you make it how you want it in this suggestion you would be able to plan like "my weapon will break then and then" and you will just carry another weapon with you because you know when it breaks and that is just not logical.

 

yes i know, i forgot to say the other part. Items will have an attribute. Like Damaged,New, Used, etc. so this levels wont be real number and you cant number crush the exact time went ur weapon will break. On the other hand remenber they are not independent ideas so a weapon that still has "usage time" can break.

 

Suggestion #3 variant B

just have each weapon/armor have a "chance to break" per hit, so if a  newbie has a friend that gives him a tit sword it will not be "forever"

 

I don't know if variant A or B is better but i like both of them because it happens suddenly and i think it will add some excitement to the game and it hopefully fixes the balancing.

I posted both because i really dont know, the problem with the 1st one is a serp breaking from a bunny :shock:

[elpargo]

Ways to fix the game:

1. Complete Item Wipe

2. Make books and capes more rare

3. Put High Level Mosnters near Tit mining ares, forcing people to work on fighting AND mining

4. Magical or Unque items--Like in Diablo and every other non-shitty online game

5. The Easy Way--Delete Items all together and go back to Alpha style

 

 

1- useless. if u got a broken pipe and u put a bucket to get the water. you fixed the problem? no. Ok so lets empty the bucket. did u fix it now? NO. So lets all just do a periodic reset to EL. HELL NO! noone will play

 

2- they ARE rare enough, and making them more rare will just make the time lapsus so everyone has them longer. but at the end everyone will have them.

 

3- I think the idea of PP and books is so people choose a way of living, not doing all. So this will just bring lag to those areas

 

4- MMORPG please read undestand what that is before you compare this to Diablo. after that go read http://www.eternal-lands.com/phpBB2/viewto...opic.php?t=4856.

 

5- so moronic that wont comment on it.

[duran]

please dont feed the monkey...

 

i wonder what happend to the idea that a weapon would only hold its full potential to a person of high combat level. that way a dagger would be more useful to a starting char then a serpent. hmm, where not the items suppose to have high nexus costs or are people tossing all theyre points into the weapons nexus?

 

or maybe have it so that the attack skill affects your chance of haveing an item break. low skill and high level weapon means that you are more at risk breaking a weapon on a failed attack then if your useing a lower leveld weapon. its kinda the same as trying to make a high level item at low level, screw up and you may well end up looseing items.

 

think about it this way, a newbie have some band new items, then he goes up against a rabbit, the rabbit for some reason manages to dodge the oncomeing attack (the newbie basicly failes his attack) and suddenly the sword hits a rock or something and boom its destroyed. then the rabbit goes on the offence and manages to hit. for some odd reason he manges to hit one of the spots holding the armor together and boom the armor breaks. no gradual degradation or anything like that, just pure bad luck.

 

basicly we make high level/cost items be easyer to mangle in untrained hands...

[Aerowind]

What I was thinking is add on to Elpargo's idea but change it slightly

 

instead of it slowly decaying away have Durability Points (but not actually show the points like Elpargo said) so instead of it slowly decaying away say a Brand New Iron sword will have like 100 durability points and say ur a newb and you go kill a rabbit and you have to hit it twice now ur weapon has 98 durability points but say instead of showing the Durability Points it says New so until like ur sword has 80 durability points (still for an iron sword) it says New and it would be pretty hard to keep track of how many times u've slashed something especially if going on like a fem orc killing spree or something

 

But from wut Cicero posted this isn't possible (if I understood correctly) but thats just my idea

[GatorJaws]

What I was thinking is add on to Elpargo's idea but change it slightly

 

instead of it slowly decaying away have Durability Points (but not actually show the points like Elpargo said) so instead of it slowly decaying away say a Brand New Iron sword will have like 100 durability points and say ur a newb and you go kill a rabbit and you have to hit it twice now ur weapon has 98 durability points but say instead of showing the Durability Points it says New so until like ur sword has 80 durability points (still for an iron sword) it says New and it would be pretty hard to keep track of how many times u've slashed something especially if going on like a fem orc killing spree or something

 

But from wut Cicero posted this isn't possible (if I understood correctly) but thats just my idea

 

But suppose I buy or make 5000 swords. each one is now a unique item and has a durribility ratting, thats 5000 more bits of infomation the game has to store. (to track the durribility of each sword). You are creatting more info for the game to store.

 

No I say just have a % chance of failure with each hit on a moster/animal or player. You dont create unique items this way. No additional info needs to be stored. your just adding 1 extra calculation each hit to see if the weapon breaks, (or your armor if you get hit)

 

Later,

GatorJaws

[Lyanna]

Just to show my support.

 

Yes, the items need to be removed from the game, not merely exchanged for another type.

Yes, the weapon/armor-break idea is good, as well as the small percentage chance of losing items permanently when you die.

Yes, the idea of basing the chances of breaking on the player's attack and defence skills is good, as well as that of opponent's difficulty.

 

No, the idea of durability points or anything else that forces the system to keep track of each and every item's status is bad.

No, allowing monsters to pick up and use player-dropped items is bad.

 

-Lyn-

[Aerowind]

ok now I understand why my idea is bad it will just cause the game to store more info then it will cause more lag (I think) and everything will be more annoying (i would even lag out maybe :shock: )

[elpargo]

What I was thinking is add on to Elpargo's idea but change it slightly

 

instead of it slowly decaying away have Durability Points (but not actually show the points like Elpargo said) so instead of it slowly decaying away say a Brand New Iron sword will have like 100 durability points and say ur a newb and you go kill a rabbit and you have to hit it twice now ur weapon has 98 durability points but say instead of showing the Durability Points it says New so until like ur sword has 80 durability points (still for an iron sword) it says New and it would be pretty hard to keep track of how many times u've slashed something especially if going on like a fem orc killing spree or something

 

But from wut Cicero posted this isn't possible (if I understood correctly) but thats just my idea

 

I think somewhere i said that, and if i didnt say it i did think of that.

 

 

I was thinking ofr 5-6 lvls of Durability instead of actual numbers.