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Is taking death bags considered "dispute'ish"?

Taking deathbags good/bad?  

228 members have voted

  1. 1. Do you think that taking deathbags IN NON PK maps is against community rules?

    • Yes it is against our community rules
      97
    • No because if you die without a rosto that is the risk
      111
    • I'm not sure what I think on this issue
      10
    • What's a deathbag?
      10


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Why do people on this forum fail at making good poll options? :@

 

Didn't vote, the simple answer is no.

 

There is nothing "fail" about the poll options....

 

They are simple and to the point as a poll should be.

 

 

Off topic:

 

Why do "people" fail at understanding simple poll options?

 

Would they like us to make them 30 options to choose from so they feel special?

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Why do people on this forum fail at making good poll options? :@

 

Didn't vote, the simple answer is no.

 

There is nothing "fail" about the poll options....

 

They are simple and to the point as a poll should be.

 

 

Off topic:

 

Why do "people" fail at understanding simple poll options?

 

Would they like us to make them 30 options to choose from so they feel special?

 

 

I tend to disagree. The options you have provided are biased.

 

Let's see... wondering what would be the results if they are like below:

Yes, it's really nasty to take somebody's hard-earnt belongings.
No, it isn't against community rules.
I don't really care.
<put a smartassish options here so people can show how funny they are>

 

In my opinion in this and any other poll options should be unbiased, e.g.

Yes, it is against community rules.
No, it is not against community rules.
I have no opinion.

 

Other than this, the topic of the thread is only loosely related to the title of the thread.

 

 

<edit>

 

Too much of LaTeX. I'm messing \ with /

Edited by Natsume

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In my opinion in this and any other poll options should be unbiased, e.g.

Yes, it is against community rules.
No, it is not against community rules.
I have no opinion.

 

That is what the poll options are. Worded differently but the same.

 

And do you think 100% of EL knows what a death bag is?

 

Because I am sure many don't. But I guess you were never a newb at anytime now were you?

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I didn't vote because none of the options were right for me.

It's not against the official EL rules to take someone's db, but the rules of my guild state that guildmembers must make every effort to return a db to it's owner. If you advertise on channels 1, 2, and 4 and wait a reasonable amount of time, but get no response and the owner never shows up to reclaim his bag, then it's ok to keep it.

Also, I believe that it's ok to keep a known bagjumper's db.

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biased!!!!

 

anyway, michico is right.

newbie deathbags mostly dont contain anything valuable and not worth it to return

no community rules against it anymore

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Why have some people voted (and posted the vote as) NO but theyre actually meaning YES in their explanatory posts?

 

I believe the votes might need scrapping since it appears theres a conflict there, where the voters have picked the wrong option to represent their actual options upon finding a DB.

 

It appears they try their best to return them but are saying its not the right thing to do as a community...? um..oh well I vote YES fully. ACE guild has long had a DB returns policy, we try to give back what we find if humanly possible. Even to red tags, providing its outside PK maps.

 

After a 12 minute wait on the bag tho, our members are allowed to keep the contents since that is assumed the maximum length of time required to return to the scene by a player AND also the time it takes for the bag to pfft naturally (so the person who lost it woulda lost it for good anyway).

 

 

As Ateh said though, this used to be a standard view of the community as I knew it a whiles back..things has changed a lot over the years it seems, and more people have graced the game with a different view to how they choose to play. I just hope it aint one of those ones that ever finds my DB sometime.

 

(not saying EL never had bag takers back then, it was just frowned on more so seemed to be less public - or an outlaw post was made that kinda kept the frequency in check, so it seemed at the time)

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I would vote no, but as Khalai pointed out:

if you lose some expensive stuff, I think that the penalty is quite harsh and can easily bankrupt your storage, if you're unlucky.

The penalty one suffers can potentially be huge... some would probably even agree the word 'devastating' is an accurate term.

 

For example; The new MMO i'm playing still has some fairly 'expensive' armors, i don't know yet how the time required to acquire the best armors in game compares to the time required to get the best armors in EL, but even if it's more, here's the chances of item dropping when killed by a monster:

 

0% chance of dropping equipped items.

1% chance of dropping one item from inventory.

 

(And a sidenote, although the penalties are higher than that in PK (unless you've basically never attacked anyone before), even when you've got the ebulest 'PKer status', the chances of dropping stuff is still far less than EL... and the game even still has a rosto equivalent)

 

 

So the question becomes, how much are we willing to punish people for stupidity? (i.e. not taking rosto)

EL itself is obviously willing to punish very harshly (i.e. it allows you to potentially drop CoL+NMT+IDA).

I'm a really big fan of rewarding intelligence/forethought, but that doesn't mean punishing stupidity is a good thing... really, one must consider how much of the MMORPG worldwide playerbase is alienated if stupidity is going to be harshly punished (keep in mind these peoples $ are as green as the next persons).

 

So as a player, i try and help the game by countering what i see as a flaw in it's system, by returning DB's.

(EDIT: It's not really about being nice, it's about the fact a person may well quit the game if they just finally got that Steel set after some weeks or even months of playing, and then quickly loses it... It's not really about being selfless either, having more players is not only good for Radu and EL in general, it's good for my game experience too.)

 

So anyways, assuming the asked poll question is for within the current system in EL, i voted Yes.

 

EDIT2: If the game was changed to like 8% chance of dropping from each slot (like 4-5% w/ careful man perk), i'd vote No... ofc, that'd screw rosto sales up a bit, eh >.>

Edited by Korrode

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Voted yes. Taking what doesn't belong to you is stealing, pure and simple, and if stealing is not against community rules, what is? Does it even mean something speaking of "community rules" when the common refrain here has been "I'll do what's right for me, stupid noob lost stuff not worth returning" etc.? There's no community when everyone acts like as an anarco-individualist.

 

Note that the reason why someone leaved a db on the ground has little relation to what you're doing: yes, the stupid noob made a fatal tactical mistake, and you're stealing his db; yes, the absent-minded player died by poison, and you stealed his db, etc. You're just trying to justify your stealing repeating to you "oh, you know the risk, you should have carried a rosto". At least many people tried to be smart voting "no", but said they wouldn't do that (which makes their vote choice quite puzzling imho).

 

The only exception I see is pking, when you fight someone else in a drop-area with the explicit purpose of defeating your adversary and looting his gear: common rules for both, spoils go to the winner. In (almost) all other cases returning the db is the honorable and decent thing to do.

 

Rehdon

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The penalty one suffers can potentially be huge... some would probably even agree the word 'devastating' is an accurate term.

 

hmm remmeber 1 day,when was anybody fighting with toomass in td :) he droped rosto,nmt (rd or bd armor,not sure now) and sword <not sure which1 now if js or thermal) <----- This is on suicide :)

 

He kept NMT actually, he dropped rda, thermal and rostogol (which I found hilarious, to drop a rostogol, you really need some skill :)), but it does not matter, what matter is, he lost stuff worth of around 600kgc that days. He even had a rostogol, he just stepped on a wrong map :hug:

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I go trough so much trouble to get a death-bag so no way ill return the contents :P

 

Oh well if someone dies versus some monster that is their own fault too, to bring a rostogol when you are going to die is good for the shop :D

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Depends on my mood, so wont vote :P But I have given back last 3 DB's (in non-PK maps ofc)

 

-Kaddy

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The penalty one suffers can potentially be huge... some would probably even agree the word 'devastating' is an accurate term.

 

hmm remmeber 1 day,when was anybody fighting with toomass in td :P he droped rosto,nmt (rd or bd armor,not sure now) and sword <not sure which1 now if js or thermal) <----- This is on suicide :D

 

He kept NMT actually, he dropped rda, thermal and rostogol (which I found hilarious, to drop a rostogol, you really need some skill :)), but it does not matter, what matter is, he lost stuff worth of around 600kgc that days. He even had a rostogol, he just stepped on a wrong map :D

rofl, wasn't that joskic on the char? toomass not that stupid :D

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The penalty one suffers can potentially be huge... some would probably even agree the word 'devastating' is an accurate term.

 

hmm remmeber 1 day,when was anybody fighting with toomass in td :P he droped rosto,nmt (rd or bd armor,not sure now) and sword <not sure which1 now if js or thermal) <----- This is on suicide :D

 

He kept NMT actually, he dropped rda, thermal and rostogol (which I found hilarious, to drop a rostogol, you really need some skill :)), but it does not matter, what matter is, he lost stuff worth of around 600kgc that days. He even had a rostogol, he just stepped on a wrong map :D

rofl, wasn't that joskic on the char? toomass not that stupid :D

 

It was someone I won't mention here. Toomass was actually the lucky one, who got this rich PK-deathbag in Tahraji :D

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Voted YES - stealing is agains rules of community I play with.

 

Ofcourse if the DB is anounced, you wait there long an try to find the owner and the owner do not care and dont came, then it is right to take, what would poof anyway.

 

And i would like to say, that many DB i found and returned was NOT worth of Rosto and the owner probabelly could not affort to buy one, even if he/she would sell all his store+inv+that DB at the best possible price :P

 

Also it is fun to race over continents to be first who save DB which your guildie dropped for Imp in CC and be there even before the victim manage to leave IP to return for his Leather Helm+Woden Shield+5gc :D

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I think there is no a single set of community rules everyone knows and obeys.

 

A lot depends on who you meet during your first days in game, which guild you've joined, how were you "growing up" in EL. I was told from my first days to return all DB's if only possible, announce it in channels, sit it until cows go home etc. and I play by that rule.

 

I've returned many DB's, and I have met a number of people who have returned my DB's to me, the biggest worth well over 700kgc.

 

I have no hard feelings however if noone returns it. I realize what is a community rule for me does not necessarily be a the same for other players.

 

That all applies to non-pk DB's (in my case then to all, since I do not pk). If I was into pk, I would neither hesitate to take DB of my "enemy" nor be mad when he took mine.

 

My impression is that so called community rules have somewhat degraded over the last year. I do not agree community rules are too many, useless and ftl. In my opinion community rules and their practical applications were one of the things that was making EL that special place. Positive community rules are in my opinion slowly vanishing over time (I have my own theory as to why, but that would be long and boring off-topic, so I'd better stfu).

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Just a random thought. Isn't there just too many community rules? Isn't it like the most of them cover our own foolishness? (e.g. DB bagjumping, scamming, etc.) Let's stop this madness. Community Rules FTL!

 

I agree.

 

The more I see discussions as to whether bag-jumping is right/wrong, the more I want to get into bag-jumping.

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Many of us started playing because we loved the structure of the game. Many of us stuck around because of the community. There are a lot of cruel, vicious kids out there who can't bully in RL, so they choose to do it in video games. EL, however, has always had a community who stood together against these little brats. Some of those kids stuck around and have matured and are now very likable members of the community.

 

Yes, it's a game, but it's not pacman. We are playing a game together. Help each other out ffs.

 

"A nation's culture resides in the hearts and in the soul of its people." --Ghandi

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Others work together in real life and just have fun ingame, unbound by rules that they do not like,

 

Be the character of your choice, meet others that play by the same standards and battle with the rest!

 

 

Edit:

I personally like shooters very much :ph34r: Millions of others do too.

Edited by ProHibited

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Voted yes

 

I return DB's as best I can. 90 to 95% of the DB's I have found did not have a value that would justify a rosto, but these DB's had value to their owners. Most of the owners of these bags were new players and very happy to get their gear back. This poll seems to target the high leveled minority at the expense of the low leveled majority. At the heart of this community rule is the idea to protect low leveled players when they are most vulnerable and sometimes this rule protects a more experienced player from an attack of stupidity. I think helping a new player and encouraging alittle honor (not stealing) out weighs teaching a more experienced player a lesson. I think the community rule should stand as is; to protect new players and to maintain the spirit of this unique gaming community.

 

Ty for your time

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My impression is that so called community rules have somewhat degraded over the last year

 

So true, I also see alot of people that used to save them go out of there way to take and announce they took and will not return.

I don't care who you are, redtagged, or neutral..I save it. But still I do NOT acknowledge community rules, only my own. reason number one.....so many players change where they stand when it comes to a community rule, sometimes they follow it, sometimes they do not.... I have my own set of morales which I always follow no matter who you are. After all....I have to live with myself..not the community.

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...

There are a lot of cruel, vicious kids out there who can't bully in RL, so they choose to do it in video games. EL, however, has always had a community who stood together against these little brats. Some of those kids stuck around and have matured and are now very likable members of the community.

 

Lol? Are you serious?.. by any chance, are you a teacher?

 

I won't post my thoughts about bag jumping on this thread, but marikei said it great, use your morals, you need to live with yourself, not the "community".

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