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Anamir

About TSP changes

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I think using brown rabbit fur in TSP is not a good change .. well i understand that tsp production should be limitaded cause it sells for a high price in NPC. So using a fur would decrease a lot the production but this particular fur is used by a lot of other things: low manuer uses to start making gloves; low summoners uses to start summoning; hi level sumoners uses to summon the new tank rabbit; and now potioners uses it too (i think fur boots uses it too but very low production)..

I dont think there is enought player killing rabbits to supply all this ppl needing the fur .. and its a bit ridiculous (well i tryed and its really ridiculous) kill brown rabbit instead Mountain Chimeran ..

 

On the other hand we have some furs with no uses in the game like: leopard fur;. tiger fur; black panter fur; snakes skins (only for summon and def quest god)

 

I think would be better if the new needed formula was with some of those non used fur instead the brown rabbit one .. in short period i think the brown rabbit fur would be like 12gc in market and we will have many noobs quiting the initiation in Manu or summon for a nice new armor buyed with the money of the sold furs ...

 

THats my opinion about ..

 

[]'s Anamir

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Same issue: def pot, fur hat. Leopard fur would be my choice, also increases chances of people missclicking Leonard :whistle:

 

Also, leopard isn't a very good monster to train on, high crits, low hp animal with good alternatives like armed gob, unarmed orc and even sticking to snow leo and moving straight to feran. So it will defenitely limit TS pot production once all currently saved up furs are out of the game.

Edited by RallosZek

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Thats not the same issue RallosZek, beaver furs are used a lot less.

 

How about fluffy rabbits start to drop white rabbit furs, and use that for the potion? Loads of people train on fluffy so there will always be a solid, but not unlimited supply. Lower level players could still kill the ordinary white rabbit to get their furs.

 

Please wait with implementing this until i used up my current ingredients please :whistle:

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Thats not the same issue RallosZek, beaver furs are used a lot less.

 

True, but puts pressure on the newbie skill path is what I was referring to. Also, snow leo is used for invis, so leo for TS makes sense in the same way :whistle:

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I doubt anyone ever became rich from making TS Potions. It used to take me a few hours to gather and mix ingredients in the bag at the toads to get 100 potions. This went for 6,000Gc to the NPC. After taking out the price of the vials, the profit wasn't going to set the world alight for anyone. It was enough to keep me ticking over on a small scale basis, but certainly nothing spectacular.

The change is fine by me since I'll adapt and find something else to keep me ticking over.

Whatever animal parts are decided upon for the final potion...it would be nice if it was some animal with good eyesight since that would add to the feel of the game. I don't think it's going to make much of a difference if people use the same animal hide for other things since this will effectively kill TS Potions and not many will be made. So I doubt very much whether it will actually impact on low ranking people finding ingredients to level.

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Based on my logs, there is an overabundance of beaver furs coming in the game every day. I think they will be quite good for the TS potion. Or, something even better, I can change the ingredient every few months, to recycle through some unused items.

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I know most of the recent changes are made to reduce the money income (with which I'm fine), but with first removing the a/d loop from ts and now adding a fur, the potion is alas pretty useless. I liked training my pot with it, as gathering the ingreds allowed me to go afk sometimes and it gave a pretty decent income. Instead of adding furs and thereby limiting the amount a single player can make, wouldn't it be a more fruitful idea to keep the formula as it was (with the henbane) but lowering the npc's price? At least then the ts pot will have some role to play (good pot xp and some income).

My 2 cents.

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I doubt anyone ever became rich from making TS Potions. It used to take me a few hours to gather and mix ingredients in the bag at the toads to get 100 potions.

 

Some people buy ingredients. For me it means I stop making TS no matter the fur, cause I bought toads + wormwood and easily found the time to get the henbane myself and still sell for considerable profit to NPC. With >30k from memory on my deleted counter and little under 7k on this one, I'd say the impact is quite big. And I can assure you a lot of people "became rich" with this (or used the coin to reinvest into other skills).

 

Based on my logs, there is an overabundance of beaver furs coming in the game every day. I think they will be quite good for the TS potion. Or, something even better, I can change the ingredient every few months, to recycle through some unused items.

 

Good idea. Might I also suggest to use something else for the def pots besides silver ore? I think that's one main obstacle for newbies to make them and would reduce this overabundance of beaver furs. Reasoning pots is already under price pressure as M&P breakage hit hard at low level (more food failures, more tries, more breakage), so on alts I usually go straight from mana pots to coord.

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If I could suggest, why not to choose something that is still unused, like black panther fur.

 

Because I would like a way for newbies to make some money too.

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If I could suggest, why not to choose something that is still unused, like black panther fur.

 

Because I would like a way for newbies to make some money too.

 

Too bad it's ruling out mass production by the more experienced players. :D

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Too bad it's ruling out mass production by the more experienced players. :D

 

I think that was the real point.

 

 

(Not a complaint since I've only made about 4k of them despite level 92 potion so doesn't affect me so much, just an observance.)

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Too bad it's ruling out mass production by the more experienced players. :pickaxe:

 

I think that was the real point.

 

 

(Not a complaint since I've only made about 4k of them despite level 92 potion so doesn't affect me so much, just an observance.)

 

Well, mass production isn't really a prob, as long as there's a balance in prices. See for example SRS and BRS.

Hence my earlier suggestion to reduce the price the npc pays you for ts. :D

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Or, something even better, I can change the ingredient every few months, to recycle through some unused items.

Wouldn't that be nothing but an elaborate admission of failed balance on top of further removing role playing aspects from the game? Personally, I couldn't really care a lot less about this change - even though it certainly inconveniences me - or about you making a fool of yourself by following through with that idea. Perhaps a more thorough revision would prove more fruitful, e.g. changing skunk/racoon furs in evasion/accuracy potions to "newbie furs", as those potions are probably in much higher demand/use or could be if not for the furs and the fact that they're also drops >.<

 

Might I also suggest to use something else for the def pots besides silver ore? I think that's one main obstacle for newbies to make them and would reduce this overabundance of beaver furs. Reasoning pots is already under price pressure as M&P breakage hit hard at low level (more food failures, more tries, more breakage), so on alts I usually go straight from mana pots to coord.

I agree, as they at the moment, they're not worth the trouble for a low level potter (low level potter being anyone below Piner :P) and too hard for newbie potion makers, but in principle they're potions that actually are in demand.

 

For me it means I stop making TS no matter the fur.

Exactly, rule of thumb for a potion maker: "do not make potions that require animal items"; possibly modified to include the addition "unless provided by customer", but see below.

 

If I could suggest, why not to choose something that is still unused, like black panther fur.

Because I would like a way for newbies to make some money too.

How many brown rabbit furs entered/left the game on average per day before this change?

Will you make it so newbies automatically ignore bots in channels so they can actually participate in market and sell their furs to players or will True Sight Potions, like the Potions of Accuracy and Evasion, be effectively limited to bot owners?

What about quantities? No single newbie needs to kill even a small fraction of the rabbits required to level using TSPs for just one player and considering the dwindling number of players, thus we have low availability on top of the annoyance to collect ingredients in amounts of low hundreds when you need thousands to level. Much better to heed RallosZek's advice and leave it to the summoners (again) to buy the rabbit furs. Plus I doubt newbies will be attracted to the game by the prospect of starting off with grinding rabbits (but then, the (most likely) real purpose was pointed out by gd2d/burn below).

 

Most potions requiring furs or other animal items today are simply not worth the bother for one or multiple of the following reasons (I don't claim that that list is complete)

1) the critical ingredients are usually only available in small quantities from individual players, 2) the potions are sold as cheap as players can make it from NPCs, 3) there's no demand (what's more, for some there isn't even a possible scenario where using them would make sense).

1) obviously provides a control mechanism for you but also limits the players that will actually hunt for the ingredients on market (and thus creating a market for those ingredients in the first place), 2) is more of a problem of the current ingredient requirements for potions that by their function should have higher demand (attack potions come to mind) rather than a problem of NPC prices while 3) requires a revision of ingredients, function and "possible use" scenarios in every day EL life (first thing that comes to mind here are Potions of Cold Protection by the way).

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It was only an example, but if black panther is not good there is also leopard fur that is usless now or maybe fox fur used to newbie manu staff. I don't think that newbie earn more money because rabbit furs will be more needed. Most of them kill rabbits to get exp and quickly go to harder creatures.

Edited by Korushiku

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I think that if it's to help newbies would the best be to give them a newbie storage on IP.

Change the 4 flower - quest so they need to store the flowers at the quest- giver and they can use him as storage as long as they can get healed there.

A lot of fur, meat and bones are left to puff because the storages are too far away or they can't find them, and a lot money are lost when they die.

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Why don't you put in more puma spawns and use puma fur? They are unused and pumas are good to train on for new players. Now pumas ingame have almost no spawns so they are completely useless ingame.

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Why don't you put in more puma spawns and use puma fur? They are unused and pumas are good to train on for new players. Now pumas ingame have almost no spawns so they are completely useless ingame.

They are used for potion of vitality, I make them sometimes collecting fur people leave and kill them - I know a nice spawn ;P

But no matter what fur would be used would I not buy them, if I need fur do I know good, never used spawns.

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I have nothing against changing the recipe for TS-Pots or any other items. Making use of unused fur like beaver, leopard or even black panther seems a good idea to me. :icon13:

 

But for me the timing couldn't have been worse. I just got VEG 5 and was aiming to make some profit to afford a NMT finally. Now my 42k henbane are worthless and I have to find 14k of "whatever" fur. A hint in advance of such changes would be greatly appreciated. I am not whining, just pointing the problem out, that some players (like me) tend to plan a bit for the future and get screwed :pickaxe:

 

Thank you for your time

Raistlin

Edited by Raistlin

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42k henbane -> 1050 P Ivy/Henbane/Poppy extracts -> 210 ref veg mixes -> 12,600 creature food -> More than enough to fully level your inner mule :pickaxe:

 

Though granted, noone stocks that much solely for extracts, heh.

Edited by GoodDay2Die

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