Events

[annatira]

I do pm contests for one main reason, *everyone* has an equal chance of winning them. I like doing more difficult/challenging ones, but when the same people win them over and over again they are hard to defend (and I get a LOT of complaints about it.) Not saying the winners do anything wrong, just that the way the contests have to be run seems to favor certain skills/people.

 

So in the interest of being fairer to all players, I intentionally make the majority of my contests chance only.

 

I agree that many people won't make the effort unless the prizes are really good. Was very discouraged a number of times by players demanding to know what the prizes were and then making comments in ch 7 like "Pfft, not worth my time" or "noob prizes, forget it."

 

I have seriously considered sticking with just Newbie contests on Isla Prima as for the most part new people love to win, anything, anytime.

[Enly]

Here's my frank and honest opinions in the contest field, as a lover of contests.

 

Contests of luck are frustrating and annoying, there is little point to taking part as the fun is in the challenge and the seeking, the thrill of discovering a new secret as you search for someone you might not even ever find. Exploring maps, taking things in, familiarizing yourself with the game, exercising your mind. In contrast with this, I think many people are frustrated by the less luck based type of contest, where there is a notable presence of repeated winners. Understandably, this is annoying, and the first suspect is foul play. However, to be frank, the repeated winners (such as those cho mentioned above in his posts) are the avid contest participants, the ones that love contests for contests and enjoy taking part, they are also people with a thorough knowledge of maps and the game, and experience in contests. Practice makes perfect.

 

Also, a note on my definition of 'luck'; Contests in which no obvious lottery format is given, but the hints are obscure or absent, and the chances of winning are mostly dependent on luck or thousands and thousands of hyper keys qualify as, you guessed it, luck.

 

This presents the two views and sides of the argument. The obvious solution, people hosting both. The unfortunate truth; its hard to make time to host a contest, and even harder I'm sure to deal with complaints of unfairness when the same players are congratulated through the blue.

 

To those of you that speak of how experience and your own welfare in the game is more important. This is true, for some (perhaps many) and has always been true for those some. That sentiment was present in the glory days of contests, and is present now, personally I believe that can't be at fault for anything. Though it is possible we're experiencing a growth spurt in the experience fanatic division.

 

I'm afraid I can't dredge up evidence from anywhere, but so far as I can recall, this issue has come up before. "Where have all the contests gone?" "What happened to the good old days where we didn't care about prizes?". Sounds to me like we have cycles of contests, lots of them, people happy to play, less of them, less happy to play.

 

Another frank comment of what I think (And I believe a similar one has been made); We've been spoiled.

 

What's the use of dragging yourself across all maps of the game for 20kgc, when you can win a CoL by typing a sentence? Why indeed. This practice I believe has eliminated the interest of those who are only in contests for the prizes, leaving the sparse crowd of true contest lovers as the only participants in certain events.

 

Personally, I'd rather run all over EL and never win anything (with adequate clues that actually keep me going and tease me enough to keep me interested, but victory out of reach) then type a line of text for a lottery and win a CoL. I might be happy, sure, but where is the satisfaction? However, I'm of the opinion that running all over EL with no adequate clues expecting to run into monsters, or left with only obscure untranslatable unenjoyable vague references are luck, and thus not fun, not only luck, but also horribly time consuming. Its like taking everything thats good and wonderful in a contests and extracting it, then injecting in its place everything that could possibly be bad about a contest. (Okay, maybe thats a bit much, but, if there's no real chance, there's not as much challenge and not as much fun Contests are like that are good and fun for some, but not for all.)

 

Unfortunately I believe the people who share these sentiments are few and far between.

 

To be blunt, I've always detested the "We're all winners and deserve to win" philosophy. The cold hard truth of life is that someone is going to come out ahead, typically due to hard work. But we end up expecting ease when its given to us again and again, and the interest in contests fades. If we're promised ease, we expect it, and if you have no interest in the joy of contests themselves, ignore the true challenges in favor of the cake right in front of you. (this cake is completely a lie, in my opinion)

 

In conclusion, I think the current downturn in contests can be attributed to the lack of participants (only the real contests lovers left) which I believe in turn can be attributed to the adjustment to an easy lucky lifestyle. In cohort with the first perpetrator is the lack of contests actually being hosted (yes, there are some of you doing it, and great job! However the numbers have diminished in recent times I believe.)

 

All of this ads up to a lack of 'real' contests.

 

The solution; do not give a damn what the non contest lovers are up to, lets go host some serious contests and have some fun

 

 

P.S.

 

I do not speak empty words, I believe we need some contest hosters out there who can stir up some fun, rich prizes or not. And I plan to try my hand at when I can dredge up some prizes and a good hiding spot (and time )

 

Disclaimer: No offense or insult was meant by this post, these are honest opinions I feel the need to voice, even if everyone doesn't agree, I believe the key to great contests is a common awareness of all opinions and views. Everyone who puts effort into hosting some form of prize giving event should be thanked, however, there's more than one way to skin a cat.

Edited March 18, 2009 by Enly

[Cruella]

I do pm contests for one main reason, *everyone* has an equal chance of winning them. I like doing more difficult/challenging ones, but when the same people win them over and over again they are hard to defend (and I get a LOT of complaints about it.) Not saying the winners do anything wrong, just that the way the contests have to be run seems to favor certain skills/people.

 

So in the interest of being fairer to all players, I intentionally make the majority of my contests chance only.

 

I agree that many people won't make the effort unless the prizes are really good. Was very discouraged a number of times by players demanding to know what the prizes were and then making comments in ch 7 like "Pfft, not worth my time" or "noob prizes, forget it."

 

I have seriously considered sticking with just Newbie contests on Isla Prima as for the most part new people love to win, anything, anytime.

 

 

First of all, big thanks Annatira for running contests, no matter what type. Whether it is pm type, or something more sophisticated, it is all good and greatly appreciated.

 

However, it is so sad to hear that people complain about the winners. Instead of developing skills by themselves, by exploring and practicing, by taking part in various contests, they prefer to moan and complain. In effect interesting and challenging contests are transforming into trivial and efortless just to please the whinners. This is simply sick.

 

It's not that contest type favors certain people, they are winning since they have worked hard to develop skills and knowledge that allows them to win. Making contests chance only is not making them fairer, it is making them newbiefied for those who have no work ethics to put some effort into skill and knowledge development but they have advanced to level 100 of complaining. It is a common disease these days unfortunately, not limited to EL but also present in our RL (I could go for a long rant so I'll better stop here). Winners take time to explore every map, try to know every secret, spend time after each update to familiarize with changes, have tools that allow them to move fast between locations, and are generally skilled to survive anywhere in EL world. Compare that to those who say in ch7 that they cba to move to another continent to participate ....

 

Conclusion: NEVER complain about someone's skills that allow him/her to win. Skill is not given, like a price in a contest based on luck. Usually shitload of work and effort hides behind a skill. If you want to be a winner, work on the skill to surpass your competition.

 

Apart from that, in all other topics raised here, I agree fully with Ayumu and Enly.

 

Finally, if I can be of any help in preparing any contest, please let me know. I might try to hold some H&S contests soon as well, we'll see how it goes ....

[Khalai]

Conclusion: NEVER complain about someone's skills that allow him/her to win. Skill is not given, like a price in a contest based on luck. Usually shitload of work and effort hides behind a skill. If you want to be a winner, work on the skill to surpass your competition.

 

Amen to that But not all explorers are dead as it may seem, we are still here

[Looter]

For starters make sure that the people donating always get some credit otherwise they will stop donating ... in the past i donated expensive items like rosto's and never even got a mention while that host got massive thx and became famous for it ROFL..

 

stop favouritism, example someone well know like magpie lee wins a contest his name is up there in blue, if a nub like me wins they just say grats to the winners (this happened alot in the past, i rarely enter anything now)

 

How about the host of the event donate themselves huh? or at least themselves and thier guild? seems wrong to me ask for donations from the public.. i meen if u want to host an event surely you should .... get it?

 

Why do most mods that host events always come from the same few guilds? seems to me its become a case of who you know and not what you can do for the comunity. So make more mods out of the nicer people of el and maybe you will get more events

 

i will not accuse anyone of cheating but many of my members in the past got rather pissed that one certain dude always won, even in random events like annatira's events, as a result they screem its FIXED and swear to never enter again.

 

just my honest opinion i hope i dont piss mods off

[Vanyel]

For starters make sure that the people donating always get some credit otherwise they will stop donating ... in the past i donated expensive items like rosto's and never even got a mention while that host got massive thx and became famous for it ROFL..

 

stop favouritism, example someone well know like magpie lee wins a contest his name is up there in blue, if a nub like me wins they just say grats to the winners (this happened alot in the past, i rarely enter anything now)

 

How about the host of the event donate themselves huh? or at least themselves and thier guild? seems wrong to me ask for donations from the public.. i meen if u want to host an event surely you should .... get it?

 

Why do most mods that host events always come from the same few guilds? seems to me its become a case of who you know and not what you can do for the comunity. So make more mods out of the nicer people of el and maybe you will get more events

 

i will not accuse anyone of cheating but many of my members in the past got rather pissed that one certain dude always won, even in random events like annatira's events, as a result they screem its FIXED and swear to never enter again.

 

just my honest opinion i hope i dont piss mods off

 

I'm speechless. Awesome.

[Usl]

I was going to post some of the reasons why I have slowed down with contests (I used to run mostly newbie ones), but after Looter's post, there is no need.

It is just not worth it.

 

For starters make sure that the people donating always get some credit otherwise they will stop donating ... in the past i donated expensive items like rosto's and never even got a mention while that host got massive thx and became famous for it ROFL..

 

stop favouritism, example someone well know like magpie lee wins a contest his name is up there in blue, if a nub like me wins they just say grats to the winners (this happened alot in the past, i rarely enter anything now)

 

How about the host of the event donate themselves huh? or at least themselves and thier guild? seems wrong to me ask for donations from the public.. i meen if u want to host an event surely you should .... get it?

 

Why do most mods that host events always come from the same few guilds? seems to me its become a case of who you know and not what you can do for the comunity. So make more mods out of the nicer people of el and maybe you will get more events

 

i will not accuse anyone of cheating but many of my members in the past got rather pissed that one certain dude always won, even in random events like annatira's events, as a result they screem its FIXED and swear to never enter again.

 

just my honest opinion i hope i dont piss mods off

[rauch]

Just have to agree with Usl here... Not worth saying a lot except that posts like this just are part of not making contests from my side.

 

Enjoy EL.

[Aislinn]

Two things:

Pm contests are not evil. They draw in newer players and the not so "skilled" players, and give everybody a few minutes of fun and good feeling and some laughs. Obviously they are not the same thing as "events", but do NOT presume to insult the pm contests or the announcers of them just because they are easy and based on luck. They absolutely have their place in EL.

 

Second: Thank you Looter for showing everyone so clearly in one concise post exactly why mods and event planners and even random players in channel 7 do not waste their time anymore doing events.

[bromber]

Well i was not going to post but then i saw Looters post

 

Well thanks alot Looter now u have ruined it for the rest of us and now i understand why the mods dont do so many events any more.

 

"stop favouritism, example someone well know like magpie lee wins a contest his name is up there in blue, if a nub like me wins they just say grats to the winners (this happened alot in the past, i rarely enter anything now)"

 

Maybe just maybe this is not favouritism but the ability to work out the clues, some thing you and me seem to be unable to do, i have NEVER won a event since i started playing EL, And the reason why is im totaly crap at working them out, (apperntly so r you ) but it dont stop me trying and enjoying myself while i lose.

 

The mods do a good job running event but alas i think since yr stupid post that will soon stop.......SO A BIG THANK YOU LOOTER

[Entris]

It was a long time ago i held my own contest but i agree with Ayumu on his post, there aint alot of ppl interested in a contest that don't have shitloads of high lvl stuff in them from what i've heard in comments of the prizes and so on ppl wont get off their butt to start searching for someone/something like they used to do a couple of years ago.

 

PM contests are great and i try to particepate in them as often as i can so keep those up! they are easy and fun and as Anna says everyone can particepate in em.

 

I sure would love to hold a big contest with flashy prizes and so on but how do you know it's worth your while to do so? You might get a few ppl to particepate but alot of ppl might not be able to particepate in a big contest due to lack of time in one way or another (bedtime/work/school/RL) or just don't care cos they think the prizes suck or W/E and don't want to run around C1 and C2 to find stuff or ppl..

 

I think that in the years that have past ppl think more about the amount of GC items are worth rather then the fun of particepating and therefore see it as a loss to run around trying to find some clues or similar for an hour or 2 when they could have earned X amounts of EXP/GC staying where they are.

 

To all of you that run contests i salute you, keep up the good work.

 

Edit: Adding a general question to you all:

How would an ideal contest be for you? How much time would you spend on a contest where you might win a prize and how much GC does it have to be worth to make you take a break and go looking?

Edited March 18, 2009 by Entris

[Dilly]

wow Looter, congrats on winning the prick of the month cloak. You can wear it all month for that charming post.

 

People get frustrated for not winning contests and seeing just a few others win the contests all of the time. Did you EVER think that that might be because those people simply have better knowledge of the game, of the maps, or have a better ability to figure out the clues? It's nothing to do with favoritism, those people are just more dedicated, have had more practice and obviously also have more fun in it than others do.

 

LION was working on an event for all, but a response like yours is making me consider to just invite the people WE want to have a shot at winning, how's that for favoritism?

 

Aislinn, Ayumu, Rauch, Anna, and all the other people that put so much time in keeping us busy and entertaining us: Please don't give up over some dipshit like that. Especially the 'PM teh mod' things get quite a few people involved, and most people I know enjoy it. I used to enjoy the hide and seeks, even though I'm totally clueless in them most of the times, but usually I even end up laughing (meanwhile grinding my teeth at my own retardedness) if I don't win at all. The group of EL players that DO enjoy those things might be small, but they are dedicated.

[WolfWitch]

Thank you - at least SOME of you for seeing the frustration that the people running the events feel on a regular basis!!

 

It takes a lot of time and energy to host events - some take weeks of planning that the contestants do not see - and it is a total slap in the face to have to schedule time AFTER the event to deal with people moaning that it was "too hard" - its MEANT to be hard. IMO it is not worth offering a big prize unless you are going to force people to think a little - if its too hard then spend some more time exploring - when I first started to compete in hide and seek type events it was always the same names winning - i felt frustraited too - but not at them, or at the mods/players hosting - at myself for not working it out faster or not knowing the map well enough. Some winners these days choose not to have thier names annouced to stop pms of "omg you won again!" - I find that very sad.

 

Donators do a fantastic job of keeping the hosts supplied with prizes and yes they deserve recognition - but i suspect some people of using this platform to make themselves famous or recruit for the guild - not all of you so please do not think I do not appreciate what you do - I REALLY do - but again the few spoil it for the many.

 

And as for how about donate ourselves WTF?? You really do need to take the chip of your shoulder - I cannot think of ONE person that puts in events on a regular basis that does NOT donate themselves - when a big event is coming up hosted by the official team I know many pull together with time and money and items to make and event that YOU get to participate in and benifit from - a thank you now and then would be welcome along with donations Now I wonder why the mods hosting are always from the same few guilds??? Oh yeah because we take people into the guilds that actually give a damn about helping the community and not what they get for hosting the event - and because when they ask "why are there no events" and we respond with "well why don't we host one?" they get up off their backsides - stop complaining about how unfair it all is and DO SOMTHING about it!!

 

Most of my post is dedicated to the long time - hide and seek style contests because they are my prefrence but that does not mean I do not appreciate the pm style contests which not only are fun - also encourage the newbies to take part and grow - something essential to the future of EL.

 

Yes I will be hosting events in the future - I will not let one or 2 clueless people spoil it for the rest of you (I say this as a player) but right now - points to Looter's post - you can see why I have not done one for a while.

 

Love and Light

 

 

Edit Typo Fae was dancing on the keyboard

Edited March 18, 2009 by WolfWitch

[Dushan]

I stopped doing pk events cause I could never find anyone to announce them

[Peach]

pm contests are the most fun

[conavar]

For starters make sure that the people donating always get some credit otherwise they will stop donating ... in the past i donated expensive items like rosto's and never even got a mention while that host got massive thx and became famous for it ROFL..

 

Surely if you donate a prize for a contest, its because you want others to win a prize, not to get your name up in big flashing neon lights. Credit is nice but a quiet PM "thankyou" from the organiser is all the credit that is needed Imo

 

stop favouritism, example someone well know like magpie lee wins a contest his name is up there in blue, if a nub like me wins they just say grats to the winners (this happened alot in the past, i rarely enter anything now)

 

Who cares ? you won a prize be happy with it, or maybe you would prefer to forgo the prize just to get your name in blue on screen

 

How about the host of the event donate themselves huh? or at least themselves and thier guild? seems wrong to me ask for donations from the public.. i meen if u want to host an event surely you should .... get it?

 

lool I can only answer this from the perspective of Annatira (but Im 100% sure its the same for all event hosts). I know for a fact Annatira has donated who own items for her contests and some prizes have come from her guildies (maybe you dont realise since we dont ask for our names to be in bright lights)

 

Why do most mods that host events always come from the same few guilds? seems to me its become a case of who you know and not what you can do for the comunity. So make more mods out of the nicer people of el and maybe you will get more events

 

Maybe just maybe those mods come from guilds that recruit "nice people" ?

 

edit: There are alot of nice guilds with alot of nice people in them who are not mods and last time I checked "being a mod" wasnt a prerequisite to organising an event

 

 

 

Most of my post is dedicated to the long time - hide and seek style contests because they are my prefrence but that does not mean I do not appreciate the pm style contests which not only are fun - also encourage the newbies to take part and grow - something essential to the future of EL.

 

Pm contests are good, for the simple fact that the winner is random so everyone can feel like they have a chance to win, not every contest should be aimed at those who have spend X amount of hours searching the maps or have spent X amount of hours training a/d etc, a mixture of all types are good and gives everyone a chance

 

 

note: Thanks to everyone who has ever hosted or organised an event in the past... some of us (even if we dont participate in them all) appreciate the work you have put in

Edited March 18, 2009 by conavar

[Looter]

It seems honesty isnt the best policy I could and should say more but i think i had better not #mute.

[Shujral]

For starters make sure that the people donating always get some credit otherwise they will stop donating ... in the past i donated expensive items like rosto's and never even got a mention while that host got massive thx and became famous for it ROFL..

 

Surely if you donate a prize for a contest, its because you want others to win a prize, not to get your name up in big flashing neon lights. Credit is nice but a quiet PM "thankyou" from the organiser is all the credit that is needed Imo

 

I have to agree with you con. On the flipside, however, if more "public appreciation" is needed to get more prizes, why not? Who does it hurt?

[Vanyel]

For starters make sure that the people donating always get some credit otherwise they will stop donating ... in the past i donated expensive items like rosto's and never even got a mention while that host got massive thx and became famous for it ROFL..

 

Surely if you donate a prize for a contest, its because you want others to win a prize, not to get your name up in big flashing neon lights. Credit is nice but a quiet PM "thankyou" from the organiser is all the credit that is needed Imo

 

I have to agree with you con. On the flipside, however, if more "public appreciation" is needed to get more prizes, why not? Who does it hurt?

 

The purpose of donations is to provide the means to give the community some fun. It should be a good enough reason to donate. At least, this is my the way I see it.

[Shujral]

For starters make sure that the people donating always get some credit otherwise they will stop donating ... in the past i donated expensive items like rosto's and never even got a mention while that host got massive thx and became famous for it ROFL..

 

Surely if you donate a prize for a contest, its because you want others to win a prize, not to get your name up in big flashing neon lights. Credit is nice but a quiet PM "thankyou" from the organiser is all the credit that is needed Imo

 

I have to agree with you con. On the flipside, however, if more "public appreciation" is needed to get more prizes, why not? Who does it hurt?

 

The purpose of donations is to provide the means to give the community some fun. It should be a good enough reason to donate. At least, this is my the way I see it.

 

Again, I agree with that point of view. It just seems that if recognizing donors is a way to get donations, and donations are in dire need, we should bite the bullet and recognize them.

[Vanyel]

For starters make sure that the people donating always get some credit otherwise they will stop donating ... in the past i donated expensive items like rosto's and never even got a mention while that host got massive thx and became famous for it ROFL..

 

Surely if you donate a prize for a contest, its because you want others to win a prize, not to get your name up in big flashing neon lights. Credit is nice but a quiet PM "thankyou" from the organiser is all the credit that is needed Imo

 

I have to agree with you con. On the flipside, however, if more "public appreciation" is needed to get more prizes, why not? Who does it hurt?

 

The purpose of donations is to provide the means to give the community some fun. It should be a good enough reason to donate. At least, this is my the way I see it.

 

Again, I agree with that point of view. It just seems that if recognizing donors is a way to get donations, and donations are in dire need, we should bite the bullet and recognize them.

 

In my opinion it would lead to a vicious circle.

 

(I usually avoid announcing donators. That's probably one of reasons I was being desperate about them. The other is, per looter, I'm not a nice person :> )

[Shujral]

In my opinion it would lead to a vicious circle.

 

(I usually avoid announcing donators. That's probably one of reasons I was being desperate about them. The other is, per looter, I'm not a nice person :> )

 

all the power to you then

[korrode]

In regard to PK events, i'm pretty sure i've hosted more than anyone over the last couple of years.

 

I've always given credit to all prize donors, but nonetheless, i saw a decrease in donations with the last few events.

 

I was also hugely put-off running PK events by a lack of support from game officials/mods for the most recent event i ran.

 

I've given enough. The game administration can approach me and show decent support if i'm to run future events.

[MagpieLee]

hmmm ok I guess I caught this thread too late as my thoughts have already been posted by various other people in the thread.

 

It IS true that there have been a decreased number of events when compared to couple of years ago (when the Events team had 5 people? Not many now) - though not all events were ran by them. And it IS true that recent contests/invasions favour those in the western timezones.

 

Ok so, the usual FIND ME contests cater for those who are skilled/patient enough to explore the game and through sheer graft and knowledge of locations in the game...don't they deserve something? I honed a lot of my fact finding from a certain Piper who used to hold lots of them.

 

For those who are fighters and want to participate in some events, there are usually some PK contests...like this one here. There have been others in the past too (see Korrodes)

 

Newbies with low skill lvls can drift through the game without knowing whats going on. They are not forgotten as newbie contests occur sometimes too with restrictions to their skill lvls. They deserve something too

 

The PM contests - though has had some critiques, cater for those who win on just pure luck, so we need these too. On the occasion you may see raffles as well as events linked to the winner of the lottery (extra incentives). We need an objective contest where all have equal chance. Some people may not like them but there was a notable absence of one yesterday

 

And for the RPers you've got weddings to attend...and there just happens to be one coming up! Here is the link. And yes there is a contest after that and no I will not be doing it

 

If you're crap at everything but pr0 at siggy making, there has been some siggy contests (not many these days)

 

Then we have those invasions which can be for anyone (even those bagjumpers!). But I'm not going to talk about that or this post may end up being too long.

 

Anyway, I think I've got most of the groups here but this wasn't the intention of the posts. I'm just illustrating that there's a lot of variation here - we just need the frequency of them to creep up. There's also a problem with effort vs prize (as someone I can't remember already pointed out). You really wanna waste your time finding someone in a very remote place for an ELE? Contestants are smarter than that, the hoster should realise this too which is why some find me contests have not gone very far. There were some really good ones lately, anyone remember the map ones from Theladin? Or the ones with the bots acting as fake monuments?

 

Sure there are some of the usual suspects who win but that can be attributed to many other factors. From my point of view, I don't really have a main skill that I can make money from (magic doesn't count), nor do I have a bot - so these contests actually help me stay in positive gc Also because I like the chase, and I am bored AND I have been working hard not to get myself seen on the blue spam except on The Joker

 

I'm thinking that we could step up the number of contests or maybe get some fresh ideas into the whole events thing as a community.

Those who have the power to #bc (i.e blue spam) should be available to help notify EL about player run contests which leads onto my next point...

...as players, if you can't beat them, JOIN THEM! Help with locations, clues, ideas, anything! If you don't get a nice response from mods, try again.

 

Wanna donate some prizes? http://www.eternal-lands.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=44859 (Yes, I have donated, just anonymously).

 

Oh, and thx to all those people who donated prizes (yes, including you Looter), and those who have hosted them

 

Edit

Free advertisement ftw

 

Warning: Long post

Edited March 19, 2009 by MagpieLee

[Enly]

I'd just like to clarify something, as I'm concerned a few people might have misunderstood my post. But I DO believe that lottery contests have their place, it is the excess of them and the huge prizes which I believe should be toned down, not eliminated by any means.

 

As lee was pointing out, there are many different types of contests, and all of them are good for certain things. But an excess of any one can become a problem

 

My post was in response to what I viewed the thread to be about, the lack of search oriented events.

 

Hopefully this will clarify some things, as I have had a few strong suspicious my post was taken wrong by a few people.

 

My basic conclusion: ALL contests are good, ALL have their place, ALL should be hosted, and it would be nice if we didn't see one more frequently than others, but rather an even representation. The way to make more search oriented events is to run them