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Zenial

Trik Vs. School

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omg..geeks! Seriously, just mix the damn helms already! you wasted how many mixing hours pressing calc buttons?!?!

 

True....

But this is for everyones benefit... self sacrifice! I know it seems petty, but I'd prefer to do this, than do it wrong for a few million exp.

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I was looking at the table.

 

G47 is =ROUNDUP(I43-((F56-F42)*C12), 0)

Why is the helm cost of Trik subtracted from the time cost of the school?

 

I don't agree with the "Gain" table, as the Time Cost is already taken in to account for Total Cost.

 

EDIT: Oh, and it should be noted that table 5 takes a fraction of the starting cost, to the other tables.

Ok so you know the "official" term for what we are doing here it is called Cost Benefit Analysis

 

In order to compare the methods we need to allow them to stand on the same footing of time. As stated in above link "all costs are expressed in money terms, and are adjusted for the time value of money, so that all flows of benefits and flows of project costs over time are expressed on a common basis in terms of their “present value.”"

 

So what I did in the "Gain" Table was express the total value gained by using School based on the amount of time needed for each proposed leveling method based on the 97.5 gc/min base.

 

So here's how it works in order to compare One method to another we have to "use" the same amount of time. If we don't then the formula is wrong as one part will have been calculated with one time and the other part with a completely different time there fore not creating a balance. So we in order to find a gain or loss versus Method 2 and Method 4 it would look like this:

 

Total Cost 4 - (Total Cost 2 +((Time 2- Time 4) * gc/min)

 

116501 - (154245 + ((852-346) * 97.5)= Gain or loss

116501 - (154245 + (-506 *97.5) = Gain or loss

116501 - (154245 +(-49335)= Gain or loss

116501 - (104910)= Gain or loss

11591= Gain (because number is greater then 0 it is considered a gain)

So this means for the total amount of time spent on the project you gain 11591gc. If Total Cost 2 had been a Higher number causing the final number to be negative then there would have been loss.

 

Hope this helps

 

 

omg..geeks! Seriously, just mix the damn helms already! you wasted how many mixing hours pressing calc buttons?!?!

I'm still in EL while doing this :) multitasking

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I was looking at the table.

 

G47 is =ROUNDUP(I43-((F56-F42)*C12), 0)

Why is the helm cost of Trik subtracted from the time cost of the school?

 

I don't agree with the "Gain" table, as the Time Cost is already taken in to account for Total Cost.

 

EDIT: Oh, and it should be noted that table 5 takes a fraction of the starting cost, to the other tables.

....

So what I did in the "Gain" Table was express the total value gained by using School based on the amount of time needed for each proposed leveling method based on the 97.5 gc/min base.

 

So here's how it works in order to compare One method to another we have to "use" the same amount of time. If we don't then the formula is wrong as one part will have been calculated with one time and the other part with a completely different time there fore not creating a balance. So we in order to find a gain or loss versus Method 2 and Method 4 it would look like this:

 

Total Cost 4 - (Total Cost 2 +((Time 2- Time 4) * gc/min)

 

116501 - (154245 + ((852-346) * 97.5)= Gain or loss

116501 - (154245 + (-506 *97.5) = Gain or loss

116501 - (154245 +(-49335)= Gain or loss

116501 - (104910)= Gain or loss

11591= Gain (because number is greater then 0 it is considered a gain)

So this means for the total amount of time spent on the project you gain 11591gc. If Total Cost 2 had been a Higher number causing the final number to be negative then there would have been loss.

 

Yes, I can see what you've done but I can't see why you've done it.

 

Total Cost = Trip Cost + Total Helm Cost + Time Cost (I agree with that).

 

As you're aware, part of Total Cost is Time Cost. Total Cost 4 - Total Cost 2 gives the time/cost difference due to: Time Cost = total time * 97.5gc/m - which is exactly what you've repeated in your Gain Table as you've shown above.

In my opinion, the error is that Total Time * GC/Min, takes on two aliases. Firstly it is known as Time Cost which is added to Total Cost, then swiftly followed as part of Adjusted cost/time which is again added to Total Cost. Total Cost shows adjusted cost/time already as Time Cost 4 - Time Cost 2 being within it.

 

But I think it should then simply be: Total Cost 4 - Total Cost 2. Or remove the first set of Time Cost.

Edited by Zenial

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Ok maybe I wasn't clear. The reason that we HAVE to add in the time saved by the school to compare the two methods is because in theory you make 97.5gc for every min you are not doing the project. So if there is a difference of 506 min between Method 4 and method 2 then you have to take that into consideration when you are doing an Analysis of the different methods so that you can track them evenly over time. Our time base right now it the largest Number in the two methods: 852. So in order to get an accurate reading both methods have to be measured against 852 min. As it stands in the "Total Cost" of Method 2 only 346 min are taken into consideration. So you must make up the other 506 remaining min in order to compare the methods evenly otherwise you are doing what everyone has been doing this entire post forgetting totally about time cost. This would be the same if you had 10 Methods you were comparing or 50. Every single method would have to be measured against a stable unit of time.

 

Lets put this in a real world example and see if it makes more sense to you. The schools in EL are kinda like Outsourcing in the real world. In outsourcing I can get a product made for me that I could probably make myself but it may cost me more time. In a business time is defiantly money. I would have to pay someone to make the part in my company and then install it in whatever final product I'm making. So say I'm a DVD company and i produce DVD that come with a case. Right now my company makes cases ourselves and it takes 6 hours for us to make 1000 cases and we pay 1 employee to make those $12/hour and and our material costs are $.05 per case. Now I've just got a brochure from a company that says they can sell me DVD cases for $.15 each and free shipping! If you are a true business person then you will do cost analysis to see if it saves you money, if your a bad business person then you say LOL they are charging triple what I pay now ROTFL.

 

So what would you find out if you did an analysis on this? Well in theory you save the 6 hours you pay your employee so that is a savings of $72 per 1000 cases, if the materials for 1000 cases cost you $50 total then that added up to $122 total that you spend on each 1000 DVD cases. How much does it cost to order 1000 cases from your brochure? $150, But wait? Now I have an employee that can make the company money somewhere else for 6 hours. So say I can set him to making graphic's for inserts that makes the company $144 in that same 6 hours. I still have to pay them so that means we only make $72 but I can say that because I'm now Outsourcing the DVD cases I make the company $72 more in 6 hours so I can take that $72 off of the expense of the $150 I'm paying for the DVD cases since I have to calculate what I'm doing with the extra time I have. So that means it costs the company right now $122 to make it's own DVD cases or with a re-adjustment of resources by outsourcing and re-assignment it costs $78 for the same 1000 DVD cases.

 

If you can't follow that don't go into business. You will fail.

 

Oh and I could possibly give the employee a raise to compensate for the new position and still make money.....or I could fire him and still "save" $72 for that six hours which result would be the same but I wouldn't have the extra money making potential.

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omg..geeks! Seriously, just mix the damn helms already! you wasted how many mixing hours pressing calc buttons?!?!

 

My thoughts exactly. Unfortunately you do not get any experience over analyzing

a trivial thing in a game. Personally I did all my helms in a school, I hate walking to trik.

If lhelms stacked...like summon stones do, then selling to the npc would be worthwhile.

 

Honestly it sounds like you enjoy the analysis more than the actual skill, to each his own.

I know I've bitched at several people for over-thinking a\d training, the best experience is

actually doing it. A friend, former guildie, long lost el player (left for WallyOfWalrusCrap),

used to spreadsheet (was a CPA) all this per exp an hour projections for his a/d leveling, I never calc'd

a damn thing and ended up always ended up near even. (His advantage, he would do 8+ hour

sessions while I never managed more than 6 on the weekend, tops, normally 2 hours max)

 

So the best plan? the one you enjoy and act upon immediately.

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I would say, just try to enjoy the game. It is the most effective way how to get exps. Otherwise you just mix like a robot and start to be bored then. Use the way you like.

 

My personally, I have started with Trick, to keep my gc a bit in plus, when got enough gc, I "invested" them at school.

 

Have a nice game:)

Edited by Holar

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After reading most of the posts [ no offense but it was quite boring to read some of them as they were repeated ] I still dont know what shall i try... the school or Trick :P

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After reading most of the posts [ no offense but it was quite boring to read some of them as they were repeated ] I still dont know what shall i try... the school or Trick :P

Try both and then decide for your style, what works and feels the best.

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My personally, I have started with Trick, to keep my gc a bit in plus, when got enough gc, I "invested" them at school.

I guess this reply answers your question.

 

If you have enough GC and are willing to spend them -> use school.

If you don't have enough GC (or don't want to spend them) -> use Trik

 

Imho, i would always go to the school on day of schools...

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Imho, i would always go to the school on day of schools...

100% agree with this. Even if you don't burn all your helm ings, it's pretty hard to resist triple xp for at least some of them on schools day. I try to keep a few in stock for just such an occasion.

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First: Buy a big book of manu XD

 

Second: Basically for me it all this stuff boils down to:

 

School is twice to three times as fast(time wise) as Tirk depending on your emu imo, I feel that this means you can get manu training out of the way and then focus on other things thus making your gc back faster. Your going to loose it slowly to Tirk anyways. It is hard for many to see past the idea of losing the gc all at once vs. losing it slowly over time, we are wired that was as humans, big investments/risks make us nervous/afraid in real life and that transfers into games(not just mmo's).

 

But like others have said try both decide what you like, try again when you have a larger emu if you have a small one now and defiantly have some ingredients stored up for 3x school day.

Edited by Elf_Ninja

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