Changes to client

[csiga]

A closely placed and similar look 'Drop all' button can be dangerous sometimes by misclicking on it :S

[bluap]

Here's an updated image:

 

The buttons have been moved to the left so they have a border on the right.

I have also added a mouse over highlight (the "Drp All" is highlighted) by drawing a double width border around the active button.

 

For the "Drop All" button, would it help if I made that require a double click? This could even be a configurable option.

All the buttons can have help text displayed at the window base if required.

[bkc56]

What about simply switching the order of the first two. That way if you miss "store all" (by being to low) you'll hit "get all" (a no-op) rather than "drop all". Basically you're seperating the two empty-inventory ones with a get so it's harder to click the wrong one (you have to be farther off).

[bluap]

What about simply switching the order of the first two. That way if you miss "store all" (by being to low) you'll hit "get all" (a no-op) rather than "drop all". Basically you're seperating the two empty-inventory ones with a get so it's harder to click the wrong one (you have to be farther off).

Good idea, I'll do that too.

[extrapolation]

I have an idea for a practical layout, I've slightly modified bluap's version:

This layout (drawn properly) would look neat, would avoid the need for bluap's suggested configurable mix one/mix all option, and would reduce the chances of someone misclicking on the drop all button.

 

Another layout idea I have that would look neat, would involve entirely removing the drop all button(Do you ever use it? I don't), and placing the store all and get all buttons beneath the equipment slots.

This disadvantage of this idea of course is that it doesnt incorporate the mixing buttons, however it might well confuse newbs to see those buttons in a window which doesn't have mixing slots anyway. As for the summoners, what about a mix-one keyboard shortcut?

[bkc56]

... entirely removing the drop all button(Do you ever use it? I don't)

Yes, I actually do use it. I think it's hard to extrapolate one's personal usage to the entire player-base and decide what people don't need.

This disadvantage of this idea of course is that it doesnt incorporate the mixing buttons, however it might well confuse newbs to see those buttons in a window which doesn't have mixing slots anyway. As for the summoners, what about a mix-one keyboard shortcut?

I agree with all this. If someone doesn't want the mix window open (due to space limitations or whatever) they may not want the inventory window open for the same reason (making any mix button of little/no help). Having a mix-one and mix-all keyboard shortcuts that will work when the mix window is not displayed could help.

 

Of course the downside is that any messages about mixing clutter up the screen rather than being limited to the mix window.

[The_Piper]

Of course the downside is that any messages about mixing clutter up the screen rather than being limited to the mix window.

 

Then send them to the inventory window? There is a text area too which can be used to display the mix messages.

 

Piper

[Torg]

I'm with bkc56 on this. I don't really like the idea of mixing the inventory and mix windows. It should simply be keyboard shortcuts for mix one/all.

 

If you want to mix outside the mix window, then expect a lot of spam in your log. Potentially, there could be an additional chat tab added for such messages if desired.

[bluap]

I'm with bkc56 on this. I don't really like the idea of mixing the inventory and mix windows. It should simply be keyboard shortcuts for mix one/all.

I personally prefer simple mouse movements to keyboard short cuts; 1) we are very low on available combinations, 2) I dislike having to switch between keyboard and mouse all the time.

 

If you want to mix outside the mix window, then expect a lot of spam in your log.

The mix messages already get sent to the inventory and trade windows too.

 

As for confusing newbies, I have already added a message to guide the user to the manufacture window if they press the button and there is nothing to mix. As I said in my original post, I wanted to add a mix button somewhere so you could for example, summon the last creature again without the manufacture window being open. After experimenting with lots of ideas, I like this the best.

[BloodSucker]

Just a fast* suggestion... what about 'unequip all' button?

Could be handy IMO... unequip all of your gear one-by-one, when youre in a hurry, can be kinda annoying :/

 

*- Without topic search and stuff

Edited October 28, 2008 by BloodSucker

[Torg]

Fair call - a message explaining nothing set up in the mix window should satisfy the learning curve.

[bluap]

Not sure I have enough support to commit this patch so I've uploaded it to berlios. Let me know what you think.

 

If people have any ideas/preferences for mix hot keys, let me know and I'll add that too.

[bluap]

Just a fast* suggestion... what about 'unequip all' button?

Could be handy IMO... unequip all of your gear one-by-one, when youre in a hurry, can be kinda annoying :/

That sounds reasonable and handy. Problem is we will end up with too many buttons.

 

I was wondering if I could add an alternative control mechanism using context menus rather than the current right click for use/look/use-with. That way we could get rid of all the buttons and easily add more functions like the one you suggest. THis might be too radical though....

[bkc56]

I was wondering if I could add an alternative control mechanism using context menus rather than the current right click for use/look/use-with. That way we could get rid of all the buttons and easily add more functions like the one you suggest.

Two thoughts...

 

1. Could you do anything with dynamic buttons (sort of like the magic quick bar) were you could specify which of the menu options would also be buttons (max 4). Pick the ones you use most often, and they'd appear as buttons in the same order as they appear in the drop-down menu.

 

2. You know how the NPC dialogs support numbers to answer the questions? What if each of the menu options was numbered. If you mouse is in the inventory window, you could press a number (like 3 for example) to select that (3d) menu options (store all).

 

We'd still want the most used as buttons, but either of these options would allow more than four choices to be possible and still accessible in a way that's easier/faster than using the drop-down menu.

 

Also, I don't think we'd want the drop-down menus instead of the current use/look/with selector.

[bluap]

1. Could you do anything with dynamic buttons (sort of like the magic quick bar) were you could specify which of the menu options would also be buttons (max 4). Pick the ones you use most often, and they'd appear as buttons in the same order as they appear in the drop-down menu.

That's a good idea and probably easy to implement too. I was thinking of something similar for the stats bar to display only the skills of interest to you. I'll have a play anyway.

 

2. You know how the NPC dialogs support numbers to answer the questions? What if each of the menu options was numbered. If you mouse is in the inventory window, you could press a number (like 3 for example) to select that (3d) menu options (store all).

That could be done but IMHO it sounds a bit complicated. It could be a possibility.

 

Also, I don't think we'd want the drop-down menus instead of the current use/look/with selector.

Of course, I would not dare to remove the old system and replace with menus; it would be an options. I have always thought the right click cursor cycle was a bit clunky, I usually cycle through all the options a few times before I get the one I want. I know you can use the icons at the base of the screen but they are usually a long mouse movement away from where you are. I think the context menu (when did people start calling them drop downs?) system would be much easier to use here and probably easier for the main cursor selection (attach/trade/.....) too. However, I could well be on my own again on this one.

Edited October 30, 2008 by bluap

[asgnny]

If an "Unequip All" message is added, I suspect this would enable players to build up tons of poison damage (i.e. from toadstool), and quickly unequip all && store all. This may be the desired effect on the programming side, but it should at least be considered (might be too powerful, imo).

 

As for "Drop All", I personally hate this button. Is there any way to remove it (maybe via context menu?) from options? Since this button has been added, I have not once used it intentionally, but have managed to mis-click it many times. Forcing a double-click to activate might be a decent workaround as well. I would like to see the same for "Reset" in the session/exp counters.

[bluap]

If an "Unequip All" message is added, I suspect this would enable players to build up tons of poison damage (i.e. from toadstool), and quickly unequip all && store all. This may be the desired effect on the programming side, but it should at least be considered (might be too powerful, imo).

That may be true but the normal use would just save a lot of clicking; not a bad thing.

 

As for "Drop All", I personally hate this button. Is there any way to remove it (maybe via context menu?) from options? Since this button has been added, I have not once used it intentionally, but have managed to mis-click it many times. Forcing a double-click to activate might be a decent workaround as well. I would like to see the same for "Reset" in the session/exp counters.

The patch I posted has the double click requirement for the "drp all" button. It would be easy to add that to the existing button even if no one wants this patch. Adding it to the session/exp counters would also be easy. I'll happy do those changes anyway.

[Entropy]

I don't see any valid reason for an "unequip all" button, except for quickly storing stuff in storage or something like that.

The circumstances when you want to do that are pretty rare anyway.

[bluap]

I don't see any valid reason for an "unequip all" button, except for quickly storing stuff in storage or something like that.

The circumstances when you want to do that are pretty rare anyway.

Such a button is not in the patch I submitted for comment. It was suggested and I thought a good idea. I could see myself using this button much more than the drop all button which I don't remember ever using before testing code changes. Anyhow, your statement is not a "no don't add it" or have I miss-understood?

Edited November 1, 2008 by bluap

[bluap]

I've committed the change (without the unequip all button).

- Existing "Drop all" button modified to match the square buttons.

-- Needs to be double-clicked to activate.

- Added "Mix One" button which can be changed to "Mix All" by right-click.

-- You get a message if you press the mix button with nothing to mix.

- Move the now four buttons to balance the window look.

- Added mouse over help text and highlight for all the buttons.

Edited November 3, 2008 by bluap

[Mar(c)]

- Existing "Drop all" button modified to match the square buttons.

-- Needs to be double-clicked to activate.

For the "Drop All" button, would it help if I made that require a double click? This could even be a configurable option.

Is it? Configurable?

Would be awesome if it is, because I just realized I use "Drop All" quite a lot!

(-- to take lots of items out of storage fast; and a double-click instead of a click would really slow it down.)

 

I also realized that I'm going to use "Sto All" a lot too!

Thank you very much, LabRat and bluap!

[sywren]

I have been using my boyfriend's laptop for the last few months, and I absolutely love my "store all" button. Now that I have my Mac back, I really miss it. Has anyone compiled this for Mac yet?

 

Oh, and I use "drop all" all the time, so I'd hate to see it go anywhere (very convenient for mixing at harvesting site, especially with multi-play, and muling).

[elg3neral]

I don't see any valid reason for an "unequip all" button, except for quickly storing stuff in storage or something like that.

The circumstances when you want to do that are pretty rare anyway.

 

Yes oke. for those who do the same stuff all day.

 

but the following is not abnormal in my daily EL time (just an example).

 

- starting AFK harving ( harv cape , CoL , pickaxe ) till im done my (RL) stuff

- A/D training ( armor. etc etc ) just 1 hour then i have enough of it .

- doing some bar mixing to make s2e's ( more room in the inv the better)

- shooting 600 bolts ( equipment divers where and what you training on)

 

having an unequip all button, won't be unused by me, and i love the idea alot ( but ok im just 1 person)

 

I'm also a big fan of stor all, I didnt know that i got used to that button that quick after i logged at a friend place.

Who havend the new update yet.

 

my 2 cents

 

And thanks to all of you programmers to make this game greater then it already is.

[majestyk]

If an "Unequip All" message is added, I suspect this would enable players to build up tons of poison damage (i.e. from toadstool), and quickly unequip all && store all. This may be the desired effect on the programming side, but it should at least be considered (might be too powerful, imo).

They would still have to take the penalty of having to walk back from the underworld, therefore I don't think this button would be abused as a cheap poison cure. If you have the time to unequip and store all you can as well just take a potion.

I definitely would use this button more than the drop-all button, as elg3neral pointed out it would make swapping equipment for different tasks easier. I often wished I'd have that button when finishing fighting training and going back to doing other things.

 

Aside from the pure programming task (I know that this is not possible with the current framework), I think it would make the interface much more beautiful if we could get rid of those text-style buttons. If we had nice icons for store all, drop all, etc. it would look much better and would be easier to see the difference on the first glance, reducing mis-clicks. Just wanted to add this so it might be considered for the future.

 

Anyway, I love the get-all store-all buttons. Thanks for the great work!

[Alberich]

If you have previously opened the bag Get All will work with one click (open and empty in one click), if not get all needs to be clicked twice (open, get all).

Then what purpose has the S_CLOSE_BAG which is send to the server when the bag window is closed?

I mean could anything go wrong when you send a get all to the server after you told him you closed the bag?

 

Are you sure this "Get all" works?

Yes get all works. It is just a slight recode of the Get All on the bag window itself. When (if) the code is put in serverside for one click get all the change to the code will be trivial.

 

The reason I bring this up again is that you sometimes don't pick up all, that means the client still has the information of an older bag.

We can't make sure we got the right content unless we really open it or have it already open.

e.g. you drop a fruit someone else drops a veg in the same bag then you walk on the bag (without opening it) and use "get all" you'll only pick up the fruit.

 

The same happens all the time when we use 'get all' atm even if we don't see it.

here an example:

1st fluff dropped 23gc and fur boots, first 'get all' send open_bag to the server, the second 'get all' send open_bag again just to pick up all (23gc and fur boots) in the next jiffy

2nd fluff drops 30gc, first 'get all' send open_bag to the server and picks up 23gc and tries to pick up fur boots, the second 'get all' send open_bag again and tries to pick up 30gc (there are only 7gc left)

you see the flaws of this implementation? we are sending a lot useless and false crap to the server.

 

I see no other way around, check if the ground_items_win is open

yes -> pickup all

no -> send open_bag

I submitted a patch on berlios which does this.

 

Is it really planned to make a server side 'get all' because I only see the stubs for a server side STORE_ALL?