Jump to content
Eternal Lands Official Forums
Jezebelle

Newcomers, guilds and such..

Recommended Posts

Erm..where did I say me and 'elected official's 'get to decide? I said its up to the community..

 

Ok, where in your community does new players fall? Are they apart of the community?

What if you are outnumbered by these Titanium Armor wearing Noobs? Do they get to decide too?

and WE need to decide how we want the community to be like.

 

Again, THEY decided as a part of the community to have full titanium and 20ad.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Some people seem to think if a person has lower skills than them, they are a n00b/newb/newbie/newcomer/BJer/long-lost-grandmother and should not be as respected this is NOT the case.

I respect all 130a/d n00bs even if they got very low coord, like 100 or even less :devlish:

(im joking so no pk plz and certainly dont quote me in the "quote myself thread " :P )

 

mp

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Some people seem to think if a person has lower skills than them, they are a n00b/newb/newbie/newcomer/BJer/long-lost-grandmother and should not be as respected this is NOT the case.

I respect all 130a/d n00bs even if they got very low coord, like 100 or even less :devlish:

(im joking so no pk plz and certainly dont quote me in the "quote myself thread " :P )

 

mp

 

(LOL, yeah me and my 32/32 A/D :P )

 

@Jez: Uhhh... I see maybe 6 people posting here, does that count as the 2000+ players every day? :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What I miss to understand is a belief that making higher required levels for joining guils (or specific guils, but I will write about it slightly later) would solve anything.

If we agree that Guild is a comradeship, a gathering of people having the same areas of interestedness, a group of friends or just a group of people liking to talk to eachother ANY required level for settling a guild or joining it is redundant.

If we will think about a guild as a group of people having decent experience in gaming as well as liking gaming together, then - sure - let's have a joining required levels.

I always tended to think about guilds as a gathering of people liking each other, talking to eachother and having fun together. I'm closer to first former idea for a guild than the latter. Hence, I don't think any required skill level is really needed.

On the other hand, I would rather like to know other people before letting them join my guild (if I ever decide on such a crazy step and make one more >.< ). Hence, the required levels are just a way to cause a necessary delay before letting anybody join my comradeship. Mind, though, that such levels should be left only for guild members to decide. Nothing enforced from above.

 

Side note.

I've been playing Lineage 2 a lot recently. I find a clan construction there a very good example of how it may be solved in a slightly different way.

Clans (guils) can have something called Academy, which allows even newly created characters to join. However, such members aren't full clan members, more like rookies. It allows people with low levels join a common chat with more experienced players and learnt from them (even if only by listening to them). They do not feel left out in the world, they have a company, they can ask and solve some of their problems, they can count on help. In the same time, the clan has some time to get to know with them and decide whether they want them to be a full member with time. Advancing from Academy to clan half-automatic. That is, after reaching a certain level rookies are booted from Academy and have a free hand to either join the clan they "attended" academy of or... follow their own path. Of course, settling a guild requires a level above academy ones.

 

In my opinion such solution is absolutely more interesting and just better than raising joining/guild settling levels.

 

I don't get the idea of 'specialised' guilds. Moreover, I don't feel there is a need for such. If one wants to have specialised guild one has to accept only people interested in this skill. Why to implent very complicated and fuzzy structures and solutions? It should be left to players, not server.

 

 

<edit>

Once again, I deny anybody the right to talk in my name as a part of community. Please, do not say anything like community does want this or that. It's far from being correct and you have NO right to do it. Instead say something like I would like to this or that solve in this or that way. Nobody has the right to claim to be a community spokeperson.

Edited by Anshar

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the academy is good idea. maybe it can be mixed with the present rank options.

I do think the requirements for creating a guild should be a wee bit higher. Just to make people think twice, not to make it impossible.

Mind you, I think the requirements for joining do not need changing

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oh, yes. I think that a guild settlement requirements should be way higher. More like any skill at level 60+. I fully agree about it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

 

<edit>

Once again, I deny anybody the right to talk in my name as a part of community. Please, do not say anything like community does want this or that. It's far from being correct and you have NO right to do it. Instead say something like I would like to this or that solve in this or that way. Nobody has the right to claim to be a community spokeperson.

 

 

I do not speak for other people. I stated MY opinion and I said I think its either up to the community OR our maker to make changes on this matter, or not.

 

And, please, do not tell me how to express my opinion, it is my right to do so. I said all I wanted to say on the matter, untill theres new information or suggestion I will keep quiet, to avoid derailing of the topic.

 

 

Jez

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi again,

 

It is not about the full tit. armor ... for all I care beginners walk around in dragon stuff ... fine by me ...

What is annoying is if they keep on asking for more free stuff and call me a bitch if i do not give it because I tell them I do not own it or am not able to make it ... am I to give a col to every noob that asks for it? That'll be a good one ... not! These things happen more often then I like lately, namecalling if you do not give in to their unreasonable demands. I mean asking for a col? Thinking you have the right to it, to demand it ... hello, do I look stupid or something?

 

I'm gladly helping players if they ask and I can what they ask of me ... like the player with 40 health wanting to try kill a puma (a/d lower than mine - 32/33). He/she failed still at a heal and I was asked to help and I find that no problem ... I'm still not killing pumas yet but if someone asks I'll help. So I took my last 2 or 3 essences to do the remote heal and went along. The player died anyway and I watch over the DB ... really no problem there, I always watch over any DB I find up to 10 minutes or so.

 

But players that look like they 'have it all' (wearing any kind of plate armor or weapons) and still ask for more ... even stuff I do not have and therefor can not give it anyway ... I'm still called a bitch and so on. Or a player standing next to a vegetable plot asking : food, food, food, give me food NOW. I'll tell them to go harvest food on that plot and how to eat (ctrl 1 if it's in the first slot of the bag, you know the drill). No, that was not good enough, I was to give it to them. How hard is it for a player with a health of 25 or 30 to harvest their own food?

 

I wonder : do I look like Santa to be giving gifts all the time ... and I'm not G'd : ask and you shall be given ... sorry, that would be ingame financial suicide ...

 

See you around ...

 

BethAhabah

 

PS : the Academy is a good idea!!! I like it.

And I'm hoping the crea-guild will be getting new members with higher stats ... and lower so we can learn from each other and teach others as well.

Edited by BethAhabah

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
It is not about the full tit. armor ... for all I care beginners walk around in dragon stuff ... fine by me ...

What is annoying is if they keep on asking for more free stuff and call me a bitch if i do not give it because I tell them I do not own it or am not able to make it ... am I to give a col to every noob that asks for it? That'll be a good one ... not! These things happen more often then I like lately, namecalling if you do not give in to their unreasonable demands. I mean asking for a col? Thinking you have the right to it, to demand it ... hello, do I look stupid or something?

 

Do what I do, #ignore newpoorbeggar

 

But players that look like they 'have it all' (wearing any kind of plate armor or weapons) and still ask for more ... even stuff I do not have and therefor can not give it anyway ... I'm still called a bitch and so on. Or a player standing next to a vegetable plot asking : food, food, food, give me food NOW. I'll tell them to go harvest food on that plot and how to eat (ctrl 1 if it's in the first slot of the bag, you know the drill). No, that was not good enough, I was to give it to them. How hard is it for a player with a health of 25 or 30 to harvest their own food?

 

Seriously Somehow this horrible noob has by your own admission:

 

* It all (wearing any kind of plate armor or weapons)

* and 25-35 Total Hp?

 

There are a handful of beggars that hand around VOTD storage, true. I type #ignore and move on.

 

The better part is when you kill them, and for 1 week they pm you "give my back my stuff" I don't

ignore these types, I need the entertainment. :) I also flatly refuse to heal any stooge that

comes to a storage and announces "heal me". Whoever does this is enabling their laziness.

 

 

And, please, do not tell me how to express my opinion,

 

If you read, he was asking you NOT to make YOUR opinion everyones opinion by saying community ;) as if you are the official spokesperson.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I only skimmed the thread, dont need to completely read it, here's your problem Jeze:

I spend lots of time at beam
I can usually stay there for like 3 maybe 4 minutes tops. On the rare occasion i go AFK there, i come back and look at local chat history and usually laugh my ass off.

 

Word of EL's existence is spreading, and word spreads quick in the noob community.

 

It's why we have Irilion. Come chill back over here :)

 

...some Trolls or Armed Orcs or something on Port Anitora would be good actually...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I only skimmed the thread, dont need to completely read it, here's your problem Jeze:

I spend lots of time at beam
I can usually stay there for like 3 maybe 4 minutes tops. On the rare occasion i go AFK there, i come back and look at local chat history and usually laugh my ass off.

 

Word of EL's existence is spreading, and word spreads quick in the noob community.

 

It's why we have Irilion. Come chill back over here :)

 

...some Trolls or Armed Orcs or something on Port Anitora would be good actually...

 

 

I am sorry, but spending time at beam is NOT my problem..I am there to welcome and help newcomers into our World and hope and try they enjoy it as much as i did and do.

 

How can be said just to ignore newcomers and their problems? Isnt it our duty, at least of some adults around here, to 'teach our children well'?

And please, dont give me the cliche of 'im here to relax, not to babysit'coz i heard that al before and I AGREE on that. But still, we are, or at least were known for our wonderful community, dont let it go to waste.

 

I like the academy idea, we have had that kindoff in W&W for years now and its working like a charm (see one of my other posts here for explanantion of how we work)

 

Again, this is about protecting the newcomers here..not to shut them out becoz of their stats..

 

Im hoping for a respons of our Maker by now..; Lord Entropy, what do you say?

 

Jez

 

Jez

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A bit about what I have seen recently. Recently I reset, and it has been a grand experience for me. I've met lots o'new folks on IP, and all around C1. Some of them wore guild tags and yet lacked much of the basic knowledge we associate with someone who's earned levels. I associate this with poor guild management, and have no respect for their guild leaders as a result. Now, some guilds I expect to find members like this... they advertise as Teaching guilds... my friends in SiTu are like this.

 

When I joined my first guild, it was because their members had not asked me to join. I was asked by several larger guilds to join, and a few invested some time talk'n with me and get'n to know me, but none spent the time training me like those in ~LE~. What impressed me most of all about the way they were then was how watchful they were over my actions.

 

I left ~LE~ a while back to found the Fellowship, a group that has members from several different guilds, and started a group with the tag FoCW to support this Fellowship. Those whom I loved from ~LE~ supported me in this, and even though they have left their guild over time, they are still members of the Fellowship.

 

When I started to 'recruit' for my 'guild' I made the decision to follow in my mentors footsteps. I have done my best to be there for those whom I am interested in joining my society, but this isn't the case with all the guilds in EL.

 

I am proud to say, however, that all the GM's in the Fellowship, and all the GM's that have been a part of it in the past and in the present, take responsibility to ensure that their guild doesn't become a numbers game. I am proud to know all of them, and yes, I will be friendly to those in guilds with lesser standards, but I won't trust you farther than I can pick you up and throw you in game (note: I've not seen wrestling in this game). If I see members of your guild alone and confused, I will often pull a guild info, and sometimes contact via IG. One guild recently disappointed me greatly. Their platform was very similar to my own, but they had a member whom I befriended that was in desperate need of serious training.

 

I love seeing the new faces, finding new names, and fresh spirits. I am merely wishing that they'd at least read the FAQ, join channel 1, or otherwise seek education. I would like to know that guilds cared more for quality than for quantity, but I know this is unreasonable to impose.

 

As for some of the guild rank things that I have heard. How about a score that is the average of all levels of each character in the guild (except OA) divided by the number of skills divided by the number of members of that guild.... Or a guild rank for each of the skills. Where obviously the time you spend working with your guild will pay off in the ratings... The more alchemy projects the better your guilds rank in that skill... but this is just an old man rambling.

 

Thank you JezeBelle for bringing up this topic, I don't suggest we try to change numerically minded people, but perhaps we can show our preferences with the people who surround us? And if I personally see someone wearing Ti-Armor that can't heal themselves, I will most likely offer to sell them the secrets of how to heal oneself for 10 gc, a few HE's included with the knowledge :) And should someone need to learn to make a fire, I can sell them the knowledge for 5gcs with a Fire Essence thrown in... it's the least I can do to put a value on such basic knowledge.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

I am sorry, but spending time at beam is NOT my problem..I am there to welcome and help newcomers into our World and hope and try they enjoy it as much as i did and do.

 

Ok now you love newcomers. :)

Ok then expect some of them will beg and stop whining about it.

 

How can be said just to ignore newcomers and their problems? Isnt it our duty, at least of some adults around here, to 'teach our children well'?

And please, dont give me the cliche of 'im here to relax, not to babysit'coz i heard that al before and I AGREE on that. But still, we are, or at least were known for our wonderful community, dont let it go to waste.

 

Knock Knock :hiya: Its a game. You want to save the world do it in real life and not in a computer game.

 

I like the academy idea, we have had that kindoff in W&W for years now and its working like a charm (see one of my other posts here for explanantion of how we work)

 

Again, this is about protecting the newcomers here..not to shut them out becoz of their stats..

 

Ah lets protect them now. From What???

Ok so they can't have good armor or guilds?? and must be "taught" by "the community" :D I

thought you wanted to shut them out of guilds, because of their stats? Or just things they say you

don't approve of? Which is it?

 

Im hoping for a respons of our Maker by now..; Lord Entropy, what do you say?

 

Jez

 

He isn't "our maker" :P He is a programmer, and maker of castles, with moats. ;)

Edited by robotbob

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

I am sorry, but spending time at beam is NOT my problem..I am there to welcome and help newcomers into our World and hope and try they enjoy it as much as i did and do.

 

Ok now you love newcomers. :D

Ok then expect some of them will beg and stop whining about it.

 

How can be said just to ignore newcomers and their problems? Isnt it our duty, at least of some adults around here, to 'teach our children well'?

And please, dont give me the cliche of 'im here to relax, not to babysit'coz i heard that al before and I AGREE on that. But still, we are, or at least were known for our wonderful community, dont let it go to waste.

 

Knock Knock :hiya: Its a game. You want to save the world do it in real life and not in a computer game.

 

I like the academy idea, we have had that kindoff in W&W for years now and its working like a charm (see one of my other posts here for explanantion of how we work)

 

Again, this is about protecting the newcomers here..not to shut them out becoz of their stats..

 

Ah lets protect them now. From What???

Ok so they can't have good armor or guilds?? and must be "taught" by "the community" :wacko: I

thought you wanted to shut them out of guilds, because of their stats? Or just things they say you

don't approve of? Which is it?

 

Im hoping for a respons of our Maker by now..; Lord Entropy, what do you say?

 

Jez

 

He isn't "our maker" :blink: He is a programmer, and maker of castles, with moats. :medieval:

 

 

I realy dont think you get my point :)

I never said I dont like newcomers, everyone who knows me knows that.

 

And as for our Maker..he is..without Him, you wouldnt excist..

 

For those who say its a game..ofcourse you are right..but its also more then that for many, many people here; its a virtual world with actual feeling, friendships and even love.

So..im not appologising for caring here.

 

#ignore is the easy way out, and thats not my way.

 

let everyone enjoy 'the game' the way they want? Sure..and that goes for me too, and when I see something not going right, I speak my mind.

 

Only a few people posting here, correct, but I have had many pms ingame, alot of folks dont post on the forums, for various reasons.

I KNOW for a fact this is an issue that needs to be addressed, somehow.

 

Jez

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

I realy dont think you get my point :hiya:

I never said I dont like newcomers, everyone who knows me knows that.

 

And as for our Maker..he is..without Him, you wouldnt excist..

 

Oh I exist. :wacko: I just haven't somehow confused my real life and game playing.

 

For those who say its a game..ofcourse you are right..but its also more then that for many, many people here; its a virtual world with actual feeling, friendships and even love.

So..im not appologising for caring here.

 

If you play this game for love :blink: refer to my first comment.

 

#ignore is the easy way out, and thats not my way.

 

Nope its whining on the forum that players in EL play differently than you and you want some

forced method by the community to make it in your image. Good Luck with that.

 

let everyone enjoy 'the game' the way they want? Sure..and that goes for me too, and when I see something not going right, I speak my mind.

 

So again what is the horrible problem? Since you flip flopped so often I'm not sure what you are

complaining about anymore.

 

Only a few people posting here, correct, but I have had many pms ingame, alot of folks dont post on the forums, for various reasons.

I KNOW for a fact this is an issue that needs to be addressed, somehow.

 

So really How about a concise list ofwhat is so horribly wrong with new players and how you plan to "fix em". :D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

And as for our Maker..he is..without Him, you wouldnt excist..

 

I dare not to agree. I heard about many religions, starting with Christianity, through Shinto, till Pastafarianism, but this... Either you really lost a reasoning and you mess reality with game or it is a really weird rhetoric figure.

Either way. Addressing Entropy with capital letter you DO address him as a god... wait... God. I'm not religious person, yet, I find it at least irritating to treat a living person as a god. [sarcasm]Unless it is Elvis Pressley.[/sarcasm]

You really seem to need to get a lot of distance to the game. For all gods, nature, whomever sake, Radu Privantu is not my maker. I would surely exist without him. Moreover, I successfully managed to live without him for over 20 years.

 

 

For those who say its a game..ofcourse you are right..but its also more then that for many, many people here; its a virtual world with actual feeling, friendships and even love.

So..im not appologising for caring here.

 

It is a game. No matter what you want to think. Game. It is not anything even close to real world. It doesn't mean that real feelings aren't possible here, yet, some distance is really needed.

 

#ignore is the easy way out, and thats not my way.

Then keep fighting, please. Just try not to involve anybody else. Especially when you're not asked to.

 

let everyone enjoy 'the game' the way they want? Sure..and that goes for me too, and when I see something not going right, I speak my mind.

 

Speak up, freely. It is your right. However, give others the right not to listen to you and follow their own common sense.

 

Only a few people posting here, correct, but I have had many pms ingame, alot of folks dont post on the forums, for various reasons.

I KNOW for a fact this is an issue that needs to be addressed, somehow.

 

Who says these issues have to be addressed in any way? Except you and the few who supports yours or at least some of your ideas here. I don't think they need to be addressed by game creator and owner (mind: game creator and owner, not my maker or owner). He may want to address them, but does he really need to? Let the players play their way. Do not force them to play your way.

 

 

Side note. It is not a first attempt somebody is trying to speak in the name of community. As far as I remember the same person tried to do it at least few times in the past. Unsuccessfully so far. It seems a time for another attempt has come.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

[

For those who say its a game..ofcourse you are right..but its also more then that for many, many people here; its a virtual world with actual feeling, friendships and even love.

So..im not appologising for caring here.

 

If you play this game for love :blink: refer to my first comment.

 

Please, if you dont know what you are talking about, dont say anything at all, will you?Its obvious you havent been around that long to know what can happen in this Virtutal World.If you did, you would know that the bounderies of VL and RL are often erased.

 

[so really How about a concise list ofwhat is so horribly wrong with new players and how you plan to "fix em". :D

 

Im not going into the remark of 'whats so horrible about new players, coz thats NOT what i said or meant.

 

Ok, short and sweet:

 

*I would like to see that the requiremetns for wearing armor/weapons and capes are adjusted in a way that its not only nexus-related but also stats related.

 

*I would like to see the requirements for making and joining guilds are adjusted in a way that not only a skill of 20 is required, but also some kind of basic training to join a guild.

As for making a guild, that also should require some advanged training.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Side note. It is not a first attempt somebody is trying to speak in the name of community. As far as I remember the same person tried to do it at least few times in the past. Unsuccessfully so far. It seems a time for another attempt has come.

 

 

It seems to me Anshar, that you are taking this to a personal level with me. Lets take this out of the public forums and discuss this further in Pm please. You are derailing the topic with this attack.

 

Jez

Edited by Jezebelle

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I dare not to agree with your opinion. I think I've just added some background to this thread. Some of the newer players may have not known about simmilar attempts in the past.

 

 

Oh, here's the thread I meant:

http://www.eternal-lands.com/forum/index.p...mp;hl=community

Isn't it similar?

Edited by Anshar

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Only a few people posting here, correct, but I have had many pms ingame, alot of folks dont post on the forums, for various reasons.

I KNOW for a fact this is an issue that needs to be addressed, somehow.

 

Jez

 

Yes only few post here, they do the same as they do to people who beg on IP - Ignore :D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is an interesting topic, and one I'm sure could easily be debated till the thread gets locked.

First off, I'd like to say I am neither fully on jezebelle's side on this, or on the other, I am some where in between.

 

It is indeed very sad to see so many players running around without the basic knowledge of the game, asking for free stuff, joining guilds when they can't light a fire.... etc. However, this is part of the game, and no matter what is done I don't think that can really be changed, in the end, every game has annoying noobs running around.

 

As for changing the requirements for guilds, I searched and searched but couldn't find it, but I thought for sure somewhere this subject came up and entropy agreed with it and said he would likely change it eventually. This is just from memory though, since I can't find the post, and I could be completely wrong :D

 

Somehow I do feel like people are missing jezebelle's point. From what I can conclude she is suggesting some technical changes to the game, to make things better, not forcing rules upon everyone. And all that really does is bring us back to things like newbie island, and raising the requirements for joining/making guilds. Which I believe are topics already disscussed to death.

 

So, what I have to say here... can this idea be thought about and worked on? or can we just receive a resounding 'no' from entropy and we can all stop wasting time debating it to death?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Im not going into the remark of 'whats so horrible about new players, coz thats NOT what i said or meant.

 

Ok, short and sweet:

 

*I would like to see that the requiremetns for wearing armor/weapons and capes are adjusted in a way that its not only nexus-related but also stats related.

 

*I would like to see the requirements for making and joining guilds are adjusted in a way that not only a skill of 20 is required, but also some kind of basic training to join a guild.

As for making a guild, that also should require some advanged training.

 

 

Ok you want to make it way harder for new players to have guilds, capes, and armors, i.e. play this game,

for what purpose? Do you realize if you try to drive every new player away, by making the game impossible

to reach anything fun for say 3 months...no one will play? The point should be to intrigue new players to play

and stay and not form the game into your image.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×