OMG, the PK is dead!

[Entropy]

Many people claim that PKing is dead.

This is complete bullshit. I just checked our logs, and here are some facts:

 

............

Sep 28 - 135

Sep 29 - 214

............

Jan 29 - 411

Jan 30 - 348

............

May 28 - 278

May 29 - 285

May 30 - 186

............

Jun 24 - 102

Jun 23 - 106

Jun 22 - 179

Jun 21 - 201

Jun 20 - 211

Jun 19 - 267

Jun 18 - 347

Jun 17 - 261

Jun 16 - 295

 

Those numbers denote the PK DEATHS for each day.

Yes, during the winter there are more PK fights than in the summer, because more players are in the game. And since January, there were no significant changes done to the PK system that affected it in any way.

 

Now, some of those deaths might be PvP accidents, and some newbies venturing in PK areas and getting killed. Nevertheless, just because you don't go further than KF, that doesn't mean the PK is dead.

[Zamirah]

In normal pk you would use diss/tele ring - not die.

Any way to see how many no drop days there have been, month for month ?

I use to die a lot on these days.

 

Do this count ants too ?

Do this count deaths against monsters too ?

[Entropy]

I said PK deaths.

Yes, it counts ants too. But it doesn't count the fights where no one dies.

 

I just did a quick check, it seems that the ant deaths are between 1/3 and 1/2 of the deaths, depending on the day and so on.

[bkc56]

Many people claim that PKing is dead.

I don't know if PK is on the decline or not (you'd need a log listing from before Rostogol stones were introduced to really see the trends), but PK is very different.

 

In the pre-rost days PK was mostly about strength (p/c) supported by some armor (as people were willing to risk). Since then a large number of weapons, armor, magic, potions, and summoning (including stones) have been added. There's also the CoL and MoL that effect your health above what your p/c would give you, plus some special enhanced armor/weapons giving special powers. This has completely change the face of PK. It's not as simply anymore. A high p/c is not "the one true way" and there are a variety of techniques that can be employed to gain an edge.

 

Even the no-rost #day doesn't really get us back to old-school PK style since all the pots/spells/summons are still available.

 

Without question, PK is very different than it was a year or more ago. Some people are adapting to the changes, some aren't. But then isn't that the way with every major change (like cooldown) that's been added to the game?

 

[edit] It occurse to me...when people say "pk is dead' perhaps what is implied in that is that "pk is very expensive, and very complex now". For some, that means they can't or won't participate anymore, and hence "pk is dead".

Edited June 25, 2007 by bkc56

[Happy_G]

definitely, i spent a day once killing ants, i think i ranked up almost 50 ant kill that day. id also be curious to know how many of those PKs are people running in naked after merc and also harvesters running through PK to get to wolf and hydro (ive been PKed once on the way to hydro)

 

and definitely no-drop days have an effect on it, i die alot on no-drop days.

 

@morto: tigers cause cooldown, some people do die in normal PK b/c they cant dis/tellie. and bears with mana burn so sometimes people get hit with both and have no mana to heal with and no dis/tellie ability

 

Edit: took out some spelling errors, like Moto ><

Edited June 25, 2007 by Happy_G

[LadyReni]

and how many deaths from each day are DP arena (max 40 a/d)?

[Zamirah]

Well my question about monsters was because PK deaths could be - Deaths on PKmaps, but then it must be against other players.

I think a good part of the deaths are players training on pk maps, like EV PK cave.

People go there to train, don't bring pots, ess, summon stones and capes they use for PK, only HE and SRS.

Easy to kill if you come invis and wait untill they have low health.

You can call it PK, I think people who train there would not.

[Entropy]

I think a good part of the deaths are players training on pk maps, like EV PK cave.

People go there to train, don't bring pots, ess, summon stones and capes they use for PK, only HE and SRS.

Easy to kill if you come invis and wait untill they have low health.

You can call it PK, I think people who train there would not.

 

Which part of my initial post wasn't clear?

 

@LadyReni: I have no clue, but why is that important anyway?

[Gohan]

I think a good part of the deaths are players training on pk maps, like EV PK cave.

People go there to train, don't bring pots, ess, summon stones and capes they use for PK, only HE and SRS.

Easy to kill if you come invis and wait untill they have low health.

You can call it PK, I think people who train there would not.

 

Which part of my initial post wasn't clear?

 

@LadyReni: I have no clue, but why is that important anyway?

 

Because it often occurs that every arena is empty, as well as KF. And if you just want to see any action, at DP you will find a couple players, usually around 5 or so.

That's from my own experience.

 

I never claimed PK is dead, but it's a fact that compared to older days, KF is a lot more empty. I remember when I was in my 40s a/d, I'd be sitting in KF every day and people were there at any given time. There were also PK contests with level limits, that lured quite some people out.

 

Today, I don't PK as much and I run around in KF from time to time. Sometimes I see a few people, sometimes I see noone at all. At other times they're having a party in some arena. It really depends. Once there is some action, people go and crowd the area and you get some good fights.

 

I think there's enough action. Then again, I ain't a fulltime PKer either.

Oh, and one last thing. Those PK deaths, noone mentioned these yet: the poor mercury "harvesters" that get slaughtered every day. Unless that falls under your "newbies venturing in PK".

 

-Blee

[agis29]

I am really glad about this post because there were people claiming that during the non drop's day only 20 people were fighting in kf!!

 

If people want more pk then they should ask to put limits in oa (maximum oa 150 and maximum a/d 150).

Something that i dont think it will ever happen.

 

Or weapons specialization to be added. The more u use a sword or an axe or a mace the more you become capable with it. I don't think this will happen either.

 

Or finally to change completely the game and make pk cheaper. This wont happen also for many reasons.

 

Thats the truth. People dont pk all the time because rostos cost, they dont win anything while pking(no leveling up) and they prefer to train a/d to see their names higher in rankings.

 

Conclusion:Pk is not dead but it isn't the first priority.

[Gohan]

If people want more pk then they should ask to put limits in oa (maximum oa 150 and maximum a/d 150).

Something that i dont think it will ever happen.

 

It's generally known that atm, there should be a level cap at 179, just noone got there yet. (Correct me if I'm wrong, I've always heard that. )

 

Or weapons specialization to be added. The more u use a sword or an axe or a mace the more you become capable with it. I don't think this will happen either.

 

I don't see the great point in that and I don't feel like leveling up specialization skills along with my normal skills that I have now already. :-/

 

Or finally to change completely the game and make pk cheaper. This wont happen also for many reasons.

 

PK is actually here to get a break from other things and be fun. When you want fun in RL, let's say an amusement park, I think you'll pay for your fun too.

 

Thats the truth. People dont pk all the time because rostos cost, they dont win anything while pking(no leveling up) and they prefer to train a/d to see their names higher in rankings.

 

Cost, see above.

Don't win anything.. depends what you see as winning. I find enough satisfaction in it if I can beat my opponent and make them lose a rosto. It's also good to know that you can beat someone.

 

And personally, not to see my name go higher, but because the people I do want to PK are in that higher a/d ranks. Besides, p/c makes out a great deal. Look at TempesT, he's ~17/8 a/d lower then me and for as far as I can tell, his coord is so buffed I need to pot up if I want to fight back to him. ;-/

 

-Blee

[Zamirah]

LOL

Look at TempesT, he's ~17/8 a/d lower then me and for as far as I can tell, his coord is so buffed I need to pot up if I want to fight back to him. ;-/

 

You think, no he's just one of the best pkers

 

One thing that hold me from KF is that it take so long time to get ready, if you had everything for pk in same room in your storage would it be easier to go check.

As it is now do it take time and I don't want to waste time if no enemy there.

Edited June 25, 2007 by morto

[agis29]

If people want more pk then they should ask to put limits in oa (maximum oa 150 and maximum a/d 150).

Something that i dont think it will ever happen.

 

It's generally known that atm, there should be a level cap at 179, just noone got there yet. (Correct me if I'm wrong, I've always heard that. )

 

Or weapons specialization to be added. The more u use a sword or an axe or a mace the more you become capable with it. I don't think this will happen either.

 

I don't see the great point in that and I don't feel like leveling up specialization skills along with my normal skills that I have now already. :-/

 

Or finally to change completely the game and make pk cheaper. This wont happen also for many reasons.

 

PK is actually here to get a break from other things and be fun. When you want fun in RL, let's say an amusement park, I think you'll pay for your fun too.

 

Thats the truth. People dont pk all the time because rostos cost, they dont win anything while pking(no leveling up) and they prefer to train a/d to see their names higher in rankings.

 

Cost, see above.

Don't win anything.. depends what you see as winning. I find enough satisfaction in it if I can beat my opponent and make them lose a rosto. It's also good to know that you can beat someone.

 

And personally, not to see my name go higher, but because the people I do want to PK are in that higher a/d ranks. Besides, p/c makes out a great deal. Look at TempesT, he's ~17/8 a/d lower then me and for as far as I can tell, his coord is so buffed I need to pot up if I want to fight back to him. ;-/

 

-Blee

 

To reach oa 179 u ll need years so everybody will keep training. Weapon specialiazation and maximum levels is a common tactic to other games were pk is the most important thing and players pk all the time and believe me it works.

(I wouldn't want to see limits to be added to the game anyway.)

 

Weapon specialiazation is a motive though.

 

The fact that you are having fun the way pk is now doesn't mean that others are having fun too for the same reasons. And maybe you are mature and you dont care about rankings but there are players that are "sick" with rankings and leveling.

 

I agree with some of the things that you mentioned anyway.

Edited June 25, 2007 by agis29

[Guest baneazaghal]

Here's an idea for breathing some life into PK for all those fighters out there - organize a tournament! Every participant should pay for an entry, either in GC or in items. Every round you manage to stay in tournament, you get some GC, and the winner gets the largest prize (maybe even add prizes for 2nd and 3rd place). Of course, the problem is that you will have to impose some limitation, as well as actually see each other's stats in order to determine who will fight with whom (or make it all random, it might be even more interesting that way). You could even charge GC for people who'd like to watch (I'd be happy to pay some GC to see some of the fights, and I even might want to participate, although I'd drop-out pretty quickly). Of course, the main problem in this whole thing is the fact that most of PKers will attempt to cheat, so you might want to have referees. Best solution would be, of course, if we could "make" Entropy add some kind of dueling support to the fighting (where 2 players cannot be interrupted by others).

[masterpiter]

If u dont count deaths of ants, deaths on dp arena and deaths of naked newbies that make mercury runs, u see very clear that almost no fights on pk maps nowadays.

Instead of complaining and comparing it to the old days i have 2 suggestions of new items( both were suggested many times but i think its still worth to post it again):

 

1) (Diss+tele) ring( worth around 500gc)= makes u able to get out of fight instantly and tele to IP, it will make pking less risnky so more ppl will enter pk maps.

2)Semi-rosto(worth 1-2k gc?)= u loose items from ur inventory but u dont loose ur equiped items, it will make sure pkers get some drops(potions, essences, maybe some weak armors), and it will also make pk safer and cheaper.

 

If i think of something else i will post it, atm only those 2 ideas come to my mind.

 

ty 4 ur attention

 

mp

[agis29]

Good ideas but i dont think that something will change.Maybe things will become a bit better but as long as a/d and oa exists and you dont get any kind of exp or award while pking things will remain the same.(i wouldnt like to see oa and a/d limits in the game btw)

Anyway getting a few he's and sr's (when u kill someone) and not losing expensive items (when u die) is one of the smartest ideas i ever saw in the forums.

Edited June 25, 2007 by agis29

[vytukas]

The % at dp arena IS important, because only ppl with a+d < 82 (or w/e the exact formula is) can fight there. Ants shouldnt be counted as well.

 

The claim is, PK above a/d level 60 is dead. According to my own observations, it really is. Well not dead, but very diminished. Mercury does no longer generate PK, because its hard to haul it to hazard. mat. storage.

 

However, I've PKed many noobs harving hydro heard hydro harving generates some PKing, maybe there is some hope in that, because hydro consumption is increasing imho

 

just my 2gc

[darkguy]

I never claimed PK is dead, but it's a fact that compared to older days, KF is a lot more empty.

PK arena's are used more often then PK maps these days.. Perhaps it is because you can easily leave a PK arena without the need to use teleportation. (lowers the risk of death) The maps however are much harder to leave (they are bigger then the arena's) and people have to use teleportation in order to quickly get away from there. So if the place is easy to leave then you have a chance to get out of the area without getting attacked again. That lowers the risk of death and so it lowers the risk of losing items.

If people want more pk then they should ask to put limits in oa (maximum oa 150 and maximum a/d 150).

Something that i dont think it will ever happen.

 

After a certain level every skill requires tons of experience in order to level so it is extremely hard to reach 150 at a skill anyway...

 

_____

 

Personally I don't think PK is dead but people don't pk as much as they used to... The new armors/weapons are expensive and if you lose/degrade/break them while you PK it is much harder to revive those armors/weapons compared to items like iron plate/titanium serpent. Even if you have a rosto with you it isn't really nice to lose your rostogol stone since it is a bit more expensive then it's old price and rosto still doesn't avoid the break rate of the armors/weapons. Also all these additions to the game made PKing much more easier which causes people to feel a reluctance against PKing, the moment they go to a pk area they begin to think if the opponent has an item like a summoning stone with him/her.

_____

[Gohan]

PK arena's are used more often then PK maps these days..

 

I honestly do realize that. But go see for yourself, arenas aren't that active either, KF was just an example.

 

-Blee

[Mango]

Well, 33% till 50% of all those numbers... is quite a lot. Ants are having fun nowadays.

If we let Mufo/Corpus attack ants, we might double those numbers .

 

But for a fact pk is much more 'dead' than before, say like a year ago. NC arena was packed at those times, like 20+ people standing, walking in. Even less powerfull players could sneak in and fight a bit, without too big risks. Now the last time I seen NC Arena crowded was on no drop day, which was fun, but the only thing I 'gained' was a broken Tit set+SoM gone. So I'll think twice about fighting all no drop day next time.

 

The most action nowadays is at DP arena. I wonder how many pk's were at Naralik Arena last 2 months. I think that should be less than 10, but I dont know.

 

Another fact is that many people want to train, including myself, to become stronger. But in order to gain some xp/hour, I need to keep p/c low, and stay on fluff till defense 125? At least for good xp. So it's kinda hard to pk. And people like 30 a/d lower, but decent oa+all negs, own you . This is of course my own decision.

 

Another thing is, the summons are way too powerfull on pk. Last night I pk'd a bit, first time, me and my guildy used summons, and we won. Second time the 'enemy used summons' and we lost. If youre a bit even with your enemy, it goes to the point to who uses the most summons in kf. Most of the times that person wins.

 

 

 

Mabe PK isn't dead, said by those numbers, but I wonder why everyone has a big feeling it does then...

[Lorck]

The "pk is dead" moto was used mainly by some pkers who made alliance with almost everyone then got amazed when they realized that they had nobody to fight. Of course, they blame pk or the game for that. Nothing to see here, move along.

[korrode]

2)Semi-rosto(worth 1-2k gc?)= u loose items from ur inventory but u dont loose ur equiped items, it will make sure pkers get some drops(potions, essences, maybe some weak armors), and it will also make pk safer and cheaper.

I was gonna suggest making rostos alot more common (drops/harvesting events), thus cheaper... but this idea is way better.

[sufi]

2)Semi-rosto(worth 1-2k gc?)= u loose items from ur inventory but u dont loose ur equiped items, it will make sure pkers get some drops(potions, essences, maybe some weak armors), and it will also make pk safer and cheaper.

I was gonna suggest making rostos alot more common (drops/harvesting events), thus cheaper... but this idea is way better.

 

I agree...maybe have "rostogol chips" that can be monster drops and/or found when harvesting. As "chips" they protect your equipped items but nothing else (as in, you lose everything in your inv). They could also be combined (10 chips + enriched magic essence) to form a full rosto. Of course, this probably belongs in the suggestions thread, but I do think it would enliven pk a bit

[Lorck]

2)Semi-rosto(worth 1-2k gc?)= u loose items from ur inventory but u dont loose ur equiped items, it will make sure pkers get some drops(potions, essences, maybe some weak armors), and it will also make pk safer and cheaper.

I was gonna suggest making rostos alot more common (drops/harvesting events), thus cheaper... but this idea is way better.

Well, my point is not that the pk mechanisms are inherently bad. Look at the numbers of January, they are the best so far and it had the same pk system.

 

What happened back in january so? The war between DiE! (which was the strongest guild and their fairly weak ally \a/) against TLB/PkG/=Hc=/THOR/*CO*/Riva/HIM/Dao/PL(which was formally friendly of die! but always fought on the uber team side)/Gwar/HAVN/LT/(almost everyone else else) was catching fire. There was fights pretty often and when there were not fights, we just iged a few guilds and make the fights happen.

 

What changed? Most folks in \a/ resetted (or practically left game, like me), most die!'s left game, other left guild and made ally with the 'horde'. To make points clear: there are tons of guilds which have alliances with each other, so fights never happen (at least above 60+). I was forecasting a polarization between PkG (who are the very few ones who actually dont have ally with everybody else) and NL but that failed to happen so far.

 

EDIT: Again, this is not a problem with the game per si, just with the 'community', maybe teh EL community is too helpful and pacifist.

Edited June 25, 2007 by Lorck

[Guest ohmygod]

Not good at maths but at the high end:

 

Jan 29 - 411

Take away 50% of above for Ant deaths = 206

24hrs x 60 minutes = 1440 minutes per day

 

1440min per day / 206 pk deaths = 1 pk death every 6.9 minutes

 

At the low end:

 

Jun 21 - 201

 

Take away 50% of above for Ant deaths = 100

24hrs x 60 minutes = 1440 minutes per day

1440min per day / 100 pk deaths = 1 pk death every 14.4 minutes

 

So if i stay in a pk map from between 6.9 minutes to 14.4 minutes i should be able to watch some newbie dies from fluffy harvesting merc, hydro ore or in DP arena

 

I suspect the 29th - 30th jan was when we had the double no drop day. now that was fun even if i slept through half of it.

 

PK guilds are too busy monster training to bother to hold KF for their members to pvp + there are many pk maps to pvp more safely on now days.

 

EDIT: Make maps with good training spawns PK (multi) maybe then PK guilds will take to trying to hold it for their members to train? But please wait until after i recover fully from my reset

Edited June 25, 2007 by ohmygod