Exping in teams

[Vanyel]

I've seen in this feature in some other games where it works quite nicely. However, there is no chance it could work in Eternal Lands without major and rather drastic changes in whole game. I'm not sure if considering this the feature is worth a work.

[timbol]

You don't like this idea because it would be nightmare to code it and there is a lot of problems you will face when trying to do this (you even give one - to less xp to share). People don't like to teaming on monsters because it is no worth to do this in EL not because it is less fun.

 

It is not a nightmare to code, it would take maybe a week at most (including testing, debugging and adjustments). But it is not worth coding it because of the reasons I mentioned. I'd rather spend my time coding stuff people would actually use.

Did you took into consideration that you will have to add new team button and new team window into client? And in this window should be options to create/destroy team, add/drop team member, join/leave team. And of course new chat window...

[ttlanhil]

right, because you know better than entropy how hard it is to add windows and chat channels. I know about adding stuff to the client, and what you're talking about is simplistic. very easy. I don't know about the chat on the server, but I doubt that's more than a few minutes. adding the real teaming stuff would be the part that takes a while

really, ent knows these things. and in a game designed like EL, teaming isn't as important as in other games

[Entropy]

So basically what you guys want (in one way or another) is for a monster to give more total experience if it's attacked by a team, rather than by an individual.

 

So for example if a player would get 2K exp of a monster, 3 players fighting as a team with that monster (for the same time interval) would get maybe 3K exp from the monster (if not more).

Well, it ain't gonna happen.

[jamincollins]

So basically what you guys want (in one way or another) is for a monster to give more total experience if it's attacked by a team, rather than by an individual.

 

So for example if a player would get 2K exp of a monster, 3 players fighting as a team with that monster (for the same time interval) would get maybe 3K exp from the monster (if not more).

Well, it ain't gonna happen.

A total of 3K out of the monster, divided three ways would only be 1k each. I'm not suggesting that the per person XP amount be greater through any party method than it would be if they were able to solo the monster. I'm just saying that I believe the game could benefit from some party mechanics getting people to work together as a team more often.

 

I don't believe that my suggestion would result in the members of the group getting more individual experience than they would if they were able to solo the creature. It would likely result in a combined total greater than that gained by a single individual soloing on the creature.

 

This is similar to several people taking the same class. They can either take it individually (soloing) or as a group (party). Frequently, people will get more out of a class when there are other students in the class. Thus the sum of experience for the class is greater than the experience of an individual taking the class alone.

 

Does this make sense or am I just babbling?

Edited May 7, 2007 by jamincollins

[Entropy]

Yes, I know very well what you mean.

As I said, we are NOT going to have MORE TOTAL exp from one monster, and that's final.

[Guest Trojan_Knight]

I'm just going to toss my 2 cents in on this. Only cuz in some games they do have the feature that is being asked about/ talked about etc. And those games usually pertain that to be one of they're main ways. EL is not that way. We have things we can multi team up on. But lets be honest, do we? Not really. EL is fun, helpfull etc. But lets face the facts,.. A lot of people on EL just rather take out the creature themselfs, so that they can have all the loot to themselfs. I'm not saying this is good or bad. I'm just saying that in a way, this option is already here. We just don't really see it. Since its rare that it is used. With the exception of the dragons, for the time being. Because imho the dragon is really the only monster at the moment where teams are formed by people to kill it. Yeah, its not "technically" described as a team w/ a team channel, and or this or that included. But honestly, we the players, can form a team now, make up a channel to join so we can all talk privately if want, and do etc to organize our team as in ways of how long be a team, who's gonna do what when, and etc.

 

Just my two cents.

Regards,

TK

[timbol]

Yes, I know very well what you mean.

As I said, we are NOT going to have MORE TOTAL exp from one monster, and that's final.

When I was talking about 10% x (number of team members) more defense to each member I wasn't mean defence expirience, I was talking about defence skill. It would make party stronger so thay can hunt stronger monsters than alone.

Example:

4 players with 20 def will get 10% x 4 = 40% more defense each when in team so they will have 28 def.

[timbol]

I'm just going to toss my 2 cents in on this. Only cuz in some games they do have the feature that is being asked about/ talked about etc. And those games usually pertain that to be one of they're main ways. EL is not that way. We have things we can multi team up on. But lets be honest, do we? Not really. EL is fun, helpfull etc. But lets face the facts,.. A lot of people on EL just rather take out the creature themselfs, so that they can have all the loot to themselfs. I'm not saying this is good or bad. I'm just saying that in a way, this option is already here. We just don't really see it. Since its rare that it is used. With the exception of the dragons, for the time being. Because imho the dragon is really the only monster at the moment where teams are formed by people to kill it. Yeah, its not "technically" described as a team w/ a team channel, and or this or that included. But honestly, we the players, can form a team now, make up a channel to join so we can all talk privately if want, and do etc to organize our team as in ways of how long be a team, who's gonna do what when, and etc.

 

Just my two cents.

Regards,

TK

I think everyone knows that you can fight in cooperation with another players on multi maps but it's not the point because nobody do that exept fighting dragon. So we are trying to think up a solution that teaming will be more payable.

[Entropy]

When I was talking about 10% x (number of team members) more defense to each member I wasn't mean defence expirience, I was talking about defence skill. It would make party stronger so thay can hunt stronger monsters than alone.

Example:

4 players with 20 def will get 10% x 4 = 40% more defense each when in team so they will have 28 def.

 

Oh, I understand what you mean now.

But I still don't like it, would allow newbies to go and get leet drops from Yetis and stuff like that.

However, one thing I am willing to do is have a spell or item that will make you have 'aggro', so one strong player can get the aggro, and weaker player still be able to attack the monster without being attacked in return.

[Mango]

Thats a nice thing for starting more teambased fights .

[evilgeorge]

When I was talking about 10% x (number of team members) more defense to each member I wasn't mean defence expirience, I was talking about defence skill. It would make party stronger so thay can hunt stronger monsters than alone.

Example:

4 players with 20 def will get 10% x 4 = 40% more defense each when in team so they will have 28 def.

 

Oh, I understand what you mean now.

But I still don't like it, would allow newbies to go and get leet drops from Yetis and stuff like that.

However, one thing I am willing to do is have a spell or item that will make you have 'aggro', so one strong player can get the aggro, and weaker player still be able to attack the monster without being attacked in return.

 

 

I disagree that this will allow newbies to get leet drops, just limit it to +50% defense (or some other arbitrary and tweakable limit). When I fought a giant (alone), it wasn't my defense that was the problem, in 4-5 restores for me, I had done 14 damage to the giant. If I fought the giant with 5 other similar strength players, we would maybe have done 70 damage. Nothing impressive. This still requires players of a similar ability to the monster to be fighting it.

 

Having said this, I also am in favour of the agro spell. I think the whole idea of fighting in groups improves what guilds are all about.

 

Would be nice to have an aggresive version of this spell too... cast it on enemies and even creatures that dont normally attack them do (invasion style - use would be for KF situations unless they have no fork, a fluff on your side is always useful), can be used to cast on yourself whilst training so you dont have to run after fluffies also!

 

EG

[timbol]

When I was talking about 10% x (number of team members) more defense to each member I wasn't mean defence expirience, I was talking about defence skill. It would make party stronger so thay can hunt stronger monsters than alone.

Example:

4 players with 20 def will get 10% x 4 = 40% more defense each when in team so they will have 28 def.

 

Oh, I understand what you mean now.

But I still don't like it, would allow newbies to go and get leet drops from Yetis and stuff like that.

However, one thing I am willing to do is have a spell or item that will make you have 'aggro', so one strong player can get the aggro, and weaker player still be able to attack the monster without being attacked in return.

If 10% x (number of team members) is too much you can always lower that number. Don't forget that if big group of newbies will kill Yeti it would be great fun for them for the first time but when they share gc between themselfs it will be not much for each other.

It is normal that few persons can kill stronger monster than one.

Edited May 7, 2007 by Timbol

[Llywar]

If 10% x (number of team members) is too much you can always lower that number. Don't forget that if big group of newbies will kill Yeti it would be great fun for them for the first time but when they share gc between themselfs it will be not much for each other.

It is normal that few persons can kill stronger monster than one.

 

I guess the fundamental question there is how much spread you want in levels. Should a level-80 monster be able to slaughter 1000 level-5 newbies? Is level 10 literally double the strength of level 5? Should a mob of newbies be able to take out the top PK-er in the game?

 

I'm not sure there is a right or wrong answer to this, but obviously the game would be a lot different one way or the other.

 

I'm not sure that we want a level 20 OA person joining a guild and being at level 60 OA three days later after killing a swarm of Yetis. On the other hand we should encourage low-level members to contribute to parties however they can (healing, muling, etc). I thought some of the proposals about apportioning xp in relation to OA level were good.

 

One nice thing about partying is that it would hopefully reduce spawn contention. Now you don't have to click like mad on that garg or wolf - you can get the same benefit no matter who attacks it first. Sure, everybody gets less xp than if they were alone, but they get more xp than if they were standing around waiting in line. And if you have some specialists like healers along they can sustain the fighters much longer.

 

I don't want to see EL turning into one of those games where you have to play in 8 hours stretches in order to gather up parties of 100 players. On the other hand, more incentive to form social groups would be nice...

[Vanyel]

To avoid abusing powerleveling the amount of xp/loot obtain from monsters should depend on the difference in a/d (or combat level) between strongest and weakest players or strongest player and a monster (for the team).

[szczupaczek]

I don't see a powerleveling problem. Just make stats growth depended on ammount of damage done / taken (resisted included) or amount of healing made.

Other solution is to make gains for attack/defence depended on maximum attack/def rates of teammates and just divide it by the number of group members. That's how much will they gain for hitting/being hit.

Other idea, like previous, but multiply it by (player OA / highest player OA in group) not to power level lowbies. There are so many ideas.

 

Just make the teamwork possible.

 

The main problem with EL is however it looks nice, it's mostly single player with mutliplayer chat. Grouping is possible, but is almost against the game mechanics.

 

The most important thing for me is teamwork, so I kind of rerolled on another game for a while. I pay for it, but that's no problem for me, at least I get what I'm looking for. Name of the game doesn't matter, I switched to it only cause of my need of team playing.

 

I still hope, some team-based solutions will be brought into EL, cause I miss some friends here and I'd like to face some content really together with them. Learn to RP, one could say.... I'd answer, I can RP playing chess.

 

I just hope for this game to grow greater in mechanics Not only by some new mobs/items.

 

Your often-checking-forums-for-a-while-not-EL-player,

S.

Edited July 3, 2007 by szczupaczek

[Llywar]

Here is an idea - how about a team inventory? You get a new inventory box (maybe controlled by the team lead with delegated access, or maybe just common access). The team inventory is the sum of all players unused emu. So, if 100 players want to mule iron they could harvest into the common inventory, which might have 30k emu. Then it could be split up in any way back at store, or even all dumped into a single char's storage or all given to a bot or something.

 

For mixing projects you could put a pile of stuff in the common inventory and people could all dip into it. This way individuals don't have to try to balance their loads of food, ingreds, harvestables, etc. It would encourage team play, but fundamentally it wouldn't let you do anything you couldn't do by having people carry stuff individually or create hyper bags.

 

There would be some details - like proximity to each other (you can't put one half the team next to hydro ore, and the other half next to store, with instant feeding of S2Es and ore back and forth). But you would have to allow for map changes (don't lose inventory just because the whole group doesn't click flag at same instant). If players leave the group or are killed perhaps their emu's worth of inventory gets dropped at their last position (so your team inventory isn't immune to being dropped if you're hit by PKers/chims/etc). There might also be practical control against mass-scamming, like the one new person in the group storage-trading the whole haul into their personal store - there are a few ways to do this.

[Sir_Exeus]

great idia. and can these teams be used for pk?