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El item stats

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I don't think I'm on any list. Except for one items top list, I'll be on top. You all know which. ;)

I doubt I'm on any other lists, I don't really want to be on any either. I prefer being a riddle in a shadow.

 

-Blee

 

P.S. Entropy, about the one item I should have most of, I do have the #1 position in Fur Hats, right? If not I'll need to work on them. :wub: Would be a reason to play a little. :hug:

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I'd be more interested in the distribution of items across players than the actual names of the players. Maybe something like this:

 

 

Summoning stones:

 

#1 - 231043

#2 - 190921

#3 - 87321

#4 - 54532

. . . (top 50 quantities)

 

Average per character: 0.7

Number of characters with 0: 129843

Number of characters with 1: 99998

 

 

I don't know how to account for the items held by inactive characters or locked characters though . . .

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I apologize for being somewhat off the issue, but Entropy's initial post included the below:

 

P.S. There are 101K players in the game (we prune the inactive newbie accounts), and those quantities include banned players and those who didn't log in in ages.

 

That seems like a hoo lot of players even on the 24 hour clock! Debates such as this one, and particularly those that have been decided by poll results don't add up to one or two thousand, let alone 101...

 

This caught me by surprise after rereading the thread, and to avoid hijacking, I'll start a fresh one.

 

Meanwhile I'm still on the "why should I care who knows my stats" side of the fence. ;)

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Hi.

 

What about to use this data to implement variable NPC prices?

 

you coud also get items per map for example:

 

Wolf furs

 

NC = 12K

WS = 5K

 

 

etc

 

this could make NPC in NC pay less than NPC in WS, thus giving some variability to the game.

 

This stats and recalcs could be done once a week (game), and affect prices with this frequency

 

Also, i don't know if is possible to use this kind of database to store a data for each natural resource. This could be used to store the amount of resource available and the growth rate of this resource. With this you can implement resource limits and players will need to look for other resources alternatively, to let the resources grow. This will make people not use always the same locations for harvesting, or mining. Also this total amount of resources could affect the total per map evaluation to drive NPC prices.

 

This could be controled once a day or also once a week. Is not important to be a precise value or not to get underrun in real time, because is only a indicator to affect prices and if a resource goes to negative, the growth rate is evaluated at day end and this resource do'nt get positive value, this day could not be used. (the user get a resource empty message)

 

this staticstics per map and resource could be published to let the merchants act. Also this could be combined with day messages like iron shortage in VOTD, etc. this could also allow for more NPC in every map.

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I'd be more interested in the distribution of items across players than the actual names of the players.

 

Yes, and i would love too to know the raw material factor (lets call it RMF).

 

Something like this:

 

# == in-game items op

 

rm == raw material = {FE, EFE, Q, BQ, RQ, etc etc}

 

product (rm) == products using that rm.

 

product (gold ore) [ ] = {Potion of Attack, Spirit Essence, Gold Bar}

product (gold bar) [ ] = {Gold ring, Gold Medallion, Sun Medallion, Ring of Palon Vertas, Harvester Medallion, Crown of Life}

product (gold medallion) [ ] = {Sun Medallion}

 

U (rm, product) == Used rm in that single product.

 

U (gold ore, Potion of Attack) = 1 ; U (gold ore, Spirit Essence) = 1 ; U (gold ore, Gold Bar) = 8

U (gold bar, product (gold bar) [ ]) = {2, 3, 1, 1, 2, 50}

U (gold medallion, sun medallion) = 1

 

RMF (rm) = #rm / ( #rm + from i=1 to i=n (U (rm, product (rm) ) * #product (rm) ) )

 

RMF (gold ore) = #gold ore / ( #gold ore + 1*#Potion of Attack + 1*#Spirit Essence + 8*#Gold Bar)

 

For instance: RMF (wood log) = 1 ( 100% unused )

 

This way, would be easy to know what are the immobilized resources comparing different RMF.

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i might think that decreasing repair rate would be a better way to get rid of some items then to decrease to chance to ea. EFE.

 

Lol... so again, WE, fighters pay for everybody...

when u'll check the top 100 richest list, i bet 80% of them are mainly manuers, alchers, crafters and stuff like that... (with a few fighters/manu or some "hybrid" char)

 

maybe make the "workers" pay a bit more now ? like increasing fail rate, but they would anyway increase the price of the item so again fighters will pay more again, fighters will pay more. So what must we do to increase basics cost without increasing the price of an item ?

maybe set a rather low npc sales price to fix a maximum to the market price. (we already got a minimum with the NPC buy price, why not set a maximum price to control the economy ?)

 

you're gonna tell me now, manuers & co that u don't make any profit coz ppl breaking price by selling under ingreds cost. i don't think its really true otherwise u would't manu. (someone will show me i'm wrong again by posting the cost for a tit chain or chat ever ^^)

 

(i got more to say but i'll keep it for later ;p i think i know why the economy is quite fucked up for fighters :rolleyes:)

 

just my imHo :>

~TommyKnocker

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..tommy im a top "hybrid" person and im poor as shit only about the top 5 in each in the mixing sections are rich im sure for the most part the rest are struggling and doing stuff to make money only to spend it on other things

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Being "rich" is relative. IMO having a ti armor set, a steel armor set, a therm serp, a BOD, a BROD and a NMT qualifies for being rich, even if you only have 10gc in storage. This is maybe a bit exaggerated, but good fighters also have their riches.

 

I'd rather not see my name on any "top" items/gc list, but I think that it is certainly helpful in adjusting the economy. Good work!

 

And since we're at that topic: a while ago I thought about getting some skill related statistics: experience points gained per day/skill (I'd like to see the graph for a/d skills on sun tzu day), most frequented maps (maybe count map enter/leave), killed monsters/players, everything as totals/per time, maybe even a nice graph with total players online over a day (like network usage?). Some of that could also be interesting on per-player basis, that would make nice statistics, maybe in the future something like EA does for Battlefield2 (http://www.bf2s.com/ is a frontend for those stats, click a player in the top10 lists for examples). Anyway, that's far off from item stats, but I like to dream :rolleyes:

 

Cheers,

maj

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This is great, thanks Ent. I've been eager to see where i stand in the top mushroomers. and 101K! :rolleyes: lots of alts

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So I'm sure that some people have their own stock (more than 100 in sto), that they don't use them and that they don't want to sell them which I found very sad... :rolleyes:

It's not sad, it's very wise.

 

This game is always changing, with new things being added. As someone above pointed out, Serpent stones have gone from having very little value to having a much higher value (from new items added to the game that use them).

 

We saw the same thing with ELEs when the MoL came out. The addition of one little item has had a large effect on price.

 

I've sold a number of items in the past (including a bunch of Serpent stones) that I later regretted selling because a new use for them came up.

 

I'm not surprised that there's a lot of rare items being saved for future use in storage. Making them more rare is only going to increase people's tendency to save them for the future, "just in case".

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I'm not surprised that there's a lot of rare items being saved for future use in storage. Making them more rare is only going to increase people's tendency to save them for the future, "just in case".
Well "just in case" why using my precious items now as I can wait an hypothetical future object that will be better. And when the new object will come in the game... well "just in case", why using my precious items now as I can wait for a better object again? ... 10 years later ... well, I have 1k serpent stones in my sto but I think I'll wait again for a future object...

To be honest, I know too much this way of thinking and I never understood why some people are like that and how they can have some fun by always acting this way... :rolleyes:

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That seems like a hoo lot of players even on the 24 hour clock! Debates such as this one, and particularly those that have been decided by poll results don't add up to one or two thousand, let alone 101...

 

This caught me by surprise after rereading the thread, and to avoid hijacking, I'll start a fresh one.

 

Meanwhile I'm still on the "why should I care who knows my stats" side of the fence. :rolleyes:

 

Umm, most of those players are NOT active. However, they do have some non total newbie stats, and therefore we are letting them unpruned, just in case they return (and many do, people return every day).

And since we do not know whol will return and who will not, we have to take into consideration everyone's items.

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Bad side of top gc is for example:

I was buying tit greave or cuisses and i got pms with price... 30k. I asked why so much, answer was: Because you have money.

 

And zia is not that rich as other ebul rich or not irl ppl :)

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I think that revealing any personal information (like who has what and in what quantity) should be consulted with the subject. It's not only the matter of privacy, but also the matter of being polite and respecting others.

Afaik, Entropy did ask some people for their agreement and it should stay like this.

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i might think that decreasing repair rate would be a better way to get rid of some items then to decrease to chance to ea. EFE.

 

Lol... so again, WE, fighters pay for everybody...

when u'll check the top 100 richest list, i bet 80% of them are mainly manuers, alchers, crafters and stuff like that... (with a few fighters/manu or some "hybrid" char)

 

maybe make the "workers" pay a bit more now ? like increasing fail rate, but they would anyway increase the price of the item so again fighters will pay more again, fighters will pay more. So what must we do to increase basics cost without increasing the price of an item ?

maybe set a rather low npc sales price to fix a maximum to the market price. (we already got a minimum with the NPC buy price, why not set a maximum price to control the economy ?)

 

you're gonna tell me now, manuers & co that u don't make any profit coz ppl breaking price by selling under ingreds cost. i don't think its really true otherwise u would't manu. (someone will show me i'm wrong again by posting the cost for a tit chain or chat ever ^^)

 

(i got more to say but i'll keep it for later ;p i think i know why the economy is quite fucked up for fighters :))

 

just my imHo :>

~TommyKnocker

 

 

And looking to it from the othereside :

What if required materials get even more rare ? like an efe. What will happen ?

I would only use them for items i use myself and wont sell them. So if more manuers/crafters start doing that ppl like fightertes will have to buy there armor form npc which is ebull high priced or from the shop.

 

Tell me what would be better and who get the most profid ?

 

 

PS.

since i dont have enough items and dont have high enough skills i still prefer not to be mentioned on any listing what soever.

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Well "just in case" why using my precious items now as I can wait an hypothetical future object that will be better. And when the new object will come in the game... well "just in case", why using my precious items now as I can wait for a better object again? ... 10 years later ... well, I have 1k serpent stones in my sto but I think I'll wait again for a future object...

To be honest, I know too much this way of thinking and I never understood why some people are like that and how they can have some fun by always acting this way... :)

I'm sorry, but I only half understand what you're saying here.

 

All I can do is speak from experience. I regretted selling my Serpent stones just a few days after selling them (something new was added that used them). And I was SO glad I hadn't sold my ELEs when the MoL was added. My experience says it's better to keep a supply on-hand than to sell them all off.

 

And no, I'm not talking about 1K of anything rare, but 10-20 is a perfectly reasonable amount to have available just in case you want to make something (new OR old) right now rather than waiting. And it only takes a few hundred people with 10-20 of rare items in storage to hit the types of numbers Entropy posted. So, no, I don't think they are to high (there are not to many in the game).

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I'm one of the people, who never sell stones, I will need them later as I'm manuer. Why sell now and not be able to buy later ?

 

And I would hate to be in KF and get spammed down with pm's from people who have seen on the list that I have rostos in my storage.

 

But to know how many stones in game would be nice.

A top list without names too.

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I'm sorry, but I only half understand what you're saying here.

 

All I can do is speak from experience. I regretted selling my Serpent stones just a few days after selling them (something new was added that used them). And I was SO glad I hadn't sold my ELEs when the MoL was added. My experience says it's better to keep a supply on-hand than to sell them all off.

 

And no, I'm not talking about 1K of anything rare, but 10-20 is a perfectly reasonable amount to have available just in case you want to make something (new OR old) right now rather than waiting. And it only takes a few hundred people with 10-20 of rare items in storage to hit the types of numbers Entropy posted. So, no, I don't think they are to high (there are not to many in the game).

Sorry, this wasn't against you. I'm a manuer so I also try to keep a little stock of stones/enriched essences for my needs (usually not more than 10 of each) but I usually don't keep them for long because I always make things with them. Or when I have too much of them, I sell them for cheap to my guild mates if they need some.

I was more aiming people who own more than 50 of them, don't use them and keep them "just in case". But most of the time, "the case" will never happen...

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Umm, most of those players are NOT active. However, they do have some non total newbie stats, and therefore we are letting them unpruned, just in case they return (and many do, people return every day).

And since we do not know whol will return and who will not, we have to take into consideration everyone's items.

Like I said before - changing the break rate/chance of making a rare item/chance of finding a rare stone won't affect the items those inactive players hold, and would only "hurt" the active players (there would be less active rare items in the game). This is just my own point of view of course, and you, Entropy, probably know better, but I hope you reconsider the source of your data, based on which you makes such decisions.

 

I also have another suggestion - remove players who haven't logged in for the past 6 or 12 months from the main database, and move them to some sort of an archive database. If one of those players decide to log on again, s/he will have to reactivate his/her account, which will move his account from the archive database to the main database. This would make the main database lighter, which would allow the server run better. This is just a suggestion.

Edited by smalul

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Like I said before - changing the break rate/chance of making a rare item/chance of finding a rare stone won't effect the items those inactive players hold[...]

AFFECT, not EFFECT!

It really pisses me of, so learn when you use affect and when to use effect (same goes for except/accept and other stuff).

http://owl.english.purdue.edu/handouts/gra...g_spelprob.html

 

I also have another suggestion - remove players who haven't logged in for the past 6 or 12 months from the main database, and move them to some sort of an archive database. If one of those players decide to log on again, s/he will have to reactivate his/her account, which will move his account from the archive database to the main database. This would make the main database lighter, which would allow the server run better. This is just a suggestion.

 

Because we don't use a 'main database', and we use flat files for the server, there is absolutely no impact on the server performance if we have inactive players, therefore there is no reason to move those players in a separate archive.

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i might think that decreasing repair rate would be a better way to get rid of some items then to decrease to chance to ea. EFE.

Lol... so again, WE, fighters pay for everybody...

when u'll check the top 100 richest list, i bet 80% of them are mainly manuers, alchers, crafters and stuff like that... (with a few fighters/manu or some "hybrid" char)

 

maybe make the "workers" pay a bit more now ? like increasing fail rate, but they would anyway increase the price of the item so again fighters will pay more again, fighters will pay more. So what must we do to increase basics cost without increasing the price of an item ?

maybe set a rather low npc sales price to fix a maximum to the market price. (we already got a minimum with the NPC buy price, why not set a maximum price to control the economy ?)

 

you're gonna tell me now, manuers & co that u don't make any profit coz ppl breaking price by selling under ingreds cost. i don't think its really true otherwise u would't manu. (someone will show me i'm wrong again by posting the cost for a tit chain or chat ever ^^)

 

(i got more to say but i'll keep it for later ;p i think i know why the economy is quite fucked up for fighters :omg:)

just my imHo :>

~TommyKnocker

And looking to it from the othereside :

What if required materials get even more rare ? like an efe. What will happen ?

I would only use them for items i use myself and wont sell them. So if more manuers/crafters start doing that ppl like fightertes will have to buy there armor form npc which is ebull high priced or from the shop.

 

Tell me what would be better and who get the most profid ?

 

if an item becomes more rare, price will rise : the manuer will pay more to get that ingred, but then he will rise the price of the manued item so that, in the end, it doesn't change anything for him, but just for the fighter.

 

...... Fighter ...... (3)

...... Manuer/crafter ...... (2)

...... Alcher ...... (1)

 

alcher buys/harv to make an item (1)

he will sell to crafter/manuer (2)

manuer/crafter will sell to fighter (3)

 

If you change something in (1) like raising price of ingred of XX gc, the alcher, basis of the economical

system will increase his price of XX gc to keep "normal profit", price will raise on (2) of XX gc because he

will have to pay more and to keep up normal gc profit he will sell back the item to the one that needs : the fighter :

who will, in the end, be the only one paying the additionnal GC because the others increased the price of

their item, thats why, to keep em from increasing the item price, you will have to set a maximum selling

price by setting some npc selling a bit above market price.

 

you could, ofc make an ingre more rare, but still, you will have to set a maximum selling price. consider it, its like : fighter = lion, manuer = cow and alcher = grass

the one at the top of the chain will be the only one suffering from the consequences of smth happening to the "lower" part of the chain...

 

anyway, i can't express myself rly well :P i'd prefer to say it in french lol...

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I love list.. thanks entropy, this is simply cool to see where one stand.

By the way for privacy. just use current privacy setting and put dummy place holder for name. I am a database person. let me know and i can probably write sql script to display data.

-Darky

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I love list.. thanks entropy, this is simply cool to see where one stand.

By the way for privacy. just use current privacy setting and put dummy place holder for name. I am a database person. let me know and i can probably write sql script to display data.

-Darky

 

That's good to know, because my SQL knowledge is very limited (I know how to do simple selects, and stuff like order by, limit, etc.), but no fancy stuff such as "select this as" and things like that.

Fortunately Learner is better at SQL than I am, but if I'll ever have a question, I'll let you know.

 

P.S. We are using Sqlite, which is not that advanced as a full SQL server (for example, it doesn't have a date/time data type, so I had to 'emulate' it by using text).

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the listing seems interesting, altho i might not be on any top 200 or 500. altho it would be interesting if we could have a list of those who have killed the most people within 15% a/d less than them and above - to avoid someone from getting top counted by killing their alt repeatedly.

 

about studying the data, i think that entropy means that he would not only look at the existing items in game, but also the change in each item in game. so i dont think that the inactive players would be significant to the analysis of the change. for example i used to know a person who claimed to own hundreds of efes, but i have not seen her for ages.

 

and to michico, i think that price ceiling have been discussed to a great extent in multiple threads. for example, ttl did point out that manu'ers dont make titan cuisses due to drops; and also, manu'ers/crafter/etc are not obligated to sell, so they could just not sell at all and everyone can buy from the npc; and everyone are not obligated to play, so price ceilings are there so everyone can enjoy the game, not only fighters. you could be rich as a fighter if you also alch your HEs. honestly it doesnt take long to make your own HEs. perhaps a 3 day project for 10k or 20k HEs - i've done it before.

 

hope i didnt misread anyone's post as i often do.

 

Sund

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