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Update changes

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working as a team to gather in your cotton will do wonders btw :P

 

and if cotton harving is giving you grief, then i guess i will be a sole supplier of gypsum in teh future. r0x0rz!

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And making thread is as easy as making FE.

You can hit "mix" while mapwalking.

That way you don't "lose" any time sitting around.

 

Great update :P

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Havent you found out right now, that making ring/med molds and mortar&pestle is manufactuable?

 

I dont see why leveling manu is slower or a stillstand now.

 

Piper

 

When you see the ingreds needed for a mortar & pestle for example (the only one that can be sold to NPC if I'm right), it's not a good idea I think...

At this rate, it's better to mass product iron helms. But the fast way for a manuer to train his skill is leather stuff cause you have nothing to harvest :P

But now, with 2gc the thread, we lose a lot of money :D

 

But in fact, it seems quite normal to lose money when you want to earn fast xp (there was already a similar discussion some time ago about this) but the point here is the thread. With 10 cottons by thread, I think that nobody will sell it for less than 2gc on the market channel...

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working as a team to gather in your cotton will do wonders btw ;)

 

and if cotton harving is giving you grief, then i guess i will be a sole supplier of gypsum in teh future. r0x0rz!

 

A team needs the same hours as 1 person if they all want to divide the stuff :P

 

But as someone calculated you can make about 300 threads an hour, they cost about 600gc at npc, harvesting 1200 lilacs, sell them to the flowershop and buy threads. That takes about 10 minutes? Even less I think. You can always make the thread yourself if you have so much time. But there are much faster ways to get thread. No one will make them in the end. Now it's cool because it is new and in 2 weeks everyone buys it from the npc again. Why was this update here then? Better make something that will be used for months, years imo :D

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You can always make the thread yourself if you have so much time. But there are much faster ways to get thread. No one will make them in the end.

 

Harvesting liliacs = harvesting => 120 item limit per hour for xp.

 

Making thread = crafting, unlimited xp.

 

So you can level crafting very easy, and as a side effect, you have a nice amount of thread.

 

Sounds not too bad for me :P

 

Piper

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Just wondering..

 

New Mana Rings, if you use out of combat they disapear, unlike other rings. Is that supposed to happen?

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Ok, this time I did some testing before I decided to post on this update. I just want to comment on what a few others have said. Overall, I think this was a good update. There is just one or two things that might be better if tweeked a bit. These are just my opinions based on my experiences and point of view.

 

This has been a real nice update for crafters and fighters but... it has slowed down manu leveling to nearly a standstill :(

 

Having the CoL/CoMs manuable reduces one of the money sinks effect and gives the crafters a nice and easy income. Finally something for them to get a profit off for those hard earned levels :D

Besides the gc they can earn it will make cols more common and people "might" start training in them more often even without a nmt cloak. All good for the crafters/fighters... but lower manu levels might suffer from the thread price rise because they not only lose ings, but lose money selling to trik. If the thread in the shop was say... 1.5gc instead of 2gc... you could just about live with the gc loss. At the moment even if you make 1000/1000 helms without any loss you lose atleast 3.5kgc from the extra added thread value (pofs included).

 

Yeah, you can make thread from cotton... but with the current formula (10 cotton) it is way too slow to even thing about making them in sufficient amounts to get any "real" levels in crafting. It's real good to kickstart your crafting skill but not very profitable to make it for hours on end. If you wear an exc cloak you can get a max of 3600 cotton hour, including the mix time it takes (~2 sec per mix) it is reduced to a max of 300 thread/hour (assuming 100% succes w.o. any fails). That amount of thread won't get you far, not even close to a level.

 

Ah well, i just had to point it out... don't take it as bitching just pointing out some small calcs i made :devlish:

 

Besides the thread and effect it has on manu levels, this update is one of the best ever. All's good for almost everyone

 

Nook1e

 

I agree with Nook1e on the above. I sat in a cotton/veg field and made thread. I was right in the middle of the row, cotton on one side and veggies on the other. I have a low carry capacity and could only harvest 460 cotton in one go. I have a relatively decent harvest level in the low seventies and it still took me about 5 minutes with an exc cape (maybe a little less time. I did stop harvesting spontaneously at one point and I am not absolutely certain I started again right away). Then I mixed and crit failed 1 and regular failed 2 of the 46 I tried. My craft level is 31. So in about 6 minutes I made 45 thread and received 675 craft xp.

 

Now taking into consideration that I need well over 20k xp for my next craft lvl this is obviously just for beginning crafters. Ok, fair enough. Then to look at it from a manufacturers point of view. I need to make 6k leather helms for my next manu lvl. That will require 24k thread if no fails. Again, not a viable option to make my own thread to obtain that lvl. Looking at the time it takes to harvest the amount of cotton needed to create 24k thread at a relatively decent harvest level, I doubt any newbie is going to sit and make that much thread for me and not charge me 2gc each or more.

 

Using the above numbers nook1e came up with for 1k leather helms (which looks fairly accurate to me) I will lose 21k gc just to get another manu lvl. That alone helps to slow fast leveling because I have to then make that gc back. Since I spent several days of mule/mix to gain that lvl I probably didn't do much else to gain any gc so I then am stalled from continuing my leveling to do something else to make that gc back, and probably more since I will need to make more helms for the following lvl. In general I am fine with this, there is a cost to train a skill. I agree that is the way it should be, but making thread manuable but terribly slow doesn't really offer an alternate outlet to purchase thread for less than the now increased price from gen store.

 

Havent you found out right now, that making ring/med molds and mortar&pestle is manufactuable?

 

I dont see why leveling manu is slower or a stillstand now.

 

Piper

 

Sure, I know they are all manufacturable. I have made them all. Have you not noticed that Gypsum weighs 10 emu each? For someone with low carry capacity that is just not a fun prospect to try and mass produce those items.

 

 

With the above said, if the thread recipe were adjusted a bit to use less cotton then I think more people would make it. Reduce the xp amount as well. 3 thread, 3 base xp sounds fair to me. Yes, I understand that you don't want it mass produced, but shouldn't it be produced? I think that people will give up on it pretty quick. The ones that do make it will probably keep it for their own use in making leather pants/boots for their own training gear.

 

At any rate, overall great update. We'll adapt if things are adjusted or not so keep up the good work.

 

EDIT: Haven't made leather helms in awhile and my math was off for how much thread was needed. Fixed that number.

Edited by CelticLady

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I'm not a manuer so I can't say much about the amount of thread needed, but it seems to me as well the supply of crafted thread won't be enough by far to make up for the demand.

 

Other than that, I think the experience for making it is too high right now. I parked myself at a cottonfield, harvested while I was checking forum and things like that. Every now and then I mixed what I had harvested. Granted, it took a while, but I wasn't even very actively playing this way and I made that much craft experience that it would have gotten me to craft level 13 if I would have started at 0 - with the end result of less than 500 thread.

 

Real newbies will have a hard time making quite a bit, because cotton isn't fast to harvest. And after making 500 threads, your crafting level has gotten high enough to start polishing, without even making plain rings first, so I doubt many people will make lots of threads to supply manuers.

 

But my main concern is the experience given at this moment. Level 13 while doing practically nothing seems very easy to me compared to starting manu (fur gloves, get all those furs, AND more expensive thread for less exp), or alchemy (bonepowder with very little experience, or FEs with harder to get ingredients).

 

IF it turns out the production of thread will indeed be on the low side, I'd suggest having them need 2 or 3 cotton, and give 1 exp. If not, with 10 cotton I think a base exp of around 5 would be more reasonable.

 

It was kinda hard to start crafting, so a nice simple starters thing there is very good imo, might make more people do that skill, but now it seems a bit *too* easy to start :devlish:

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i think the idea behind the xp and amounts of base items needed is that to race ahead of the pack you have to interact with other players, shopping for the base items and all that. this is after all a social game, not a singel player game with a buildt in irc client :devlish:

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Maybe people can do christopher's quest, and go to lvl 8 of crafting.. then start polishing sapps. Thats the way i recomend to newbs to get started on crafting, for getting start on manuf there is mrslorpak's. :devlish:

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It seems that their is an XP disparity between some of the new uber items.

 

Tit Plate = 2800

S2E Thermal = 4000

Giant Summoning is also in the thousands

 

COL or COM is about 1000. Not like these can be mass products (easier to mass produce Giants). Wouldn't it make more sense to raise the xp to 2500-3500xp?

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It seems that their is an XP disparity between some of the new uber items.

 

Tit Plate = 2800

S2E Thermal = 4000

Giant Summoning is also in the thousands

 

COL or COM is about 1000. Not like these can be mass products (easier to mass produce Giants). Wouldn't it make more sense to raise the xp to 2500-3500xp?

Wow that's a lot of exp! I guess anyone interested in mass production of these for exp will have to get some serious help from guildmates...

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It seems that their is an XP disparity between some of the new uber items.

 

Tit Plate = 2800

S2E Thermal = 4000

Giant Summoning is also in the thousands

 

COL or COM is about 1000. Not like these can be mass products (easier to mass produce Giants). Wouldn't it make more sense to raise the xp to 2500-3500xp?

Wow that's a lot of exp! I guess anyone interested in mass production of these for exp will have to get some serious help from guildmates...

 

It isn't a lot for the stuff you need and the amount of crowns you make. On the level you are in crafting when you make crowns you need more than 200k exp per level, so 3k exp is fairly nothing for something you make hardly 5 of or some amount like that.The rare items should give more exp imo, but it's not the first priority imo, but this should be done when there are new rare items implented. It was asked several times before when other items were implented.

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It seems that their is an XP disparity between some of the new uber items.

 

Tit Plate = 2800

S2E Thermal = 4000

Giant Summoning is also in the thousands

 

COL or COM is about 1000. Not like these can be mass products (easier to mass produce Giants). Wouldn't it make more sense to raise the xp to 2500-3500xp?

Wow that's a lot of exp! I guess anyone interested in mass production of these for exp will have to get some serious help from guildmates...

 

It isn't a lot for the stuff you need and the amount of crowns you make. On the level you are in crafting when you make crowns you need more than 200k exp per level, so 3k exp is fairly nothing for something you make hardly 5 of or some amount like that.The rare items should give more exp imo, but it's not the first priority imo, but this should be done when there are new rare items implented. It was asked several times before when other items were implented.

 

 

 

rare items are rare for a reason... I fear that the crowns are going to be flooded now and drop in price to atleast 40K + they are not ment to train on because it are RARE items... items that ppl train manu/craft on are items that are either not rare or break really fast... (+ every body needs em) I think the exp is fine...

 

 

 

Hype

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they will never drop under 50kgc, because the npc buys them back at that price. The lowest they will ever go is 60kgc (and probably nowhere near in the future)

 

col - 50k, com 45 (to npc)

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lol, i love making thread. That gave me 3 crafting levels in less than one hour :D

 

Next, i think, i start mass production of ring molds.

 

Good update, radu, you should definately stay offline for a longer time :)

 

Piper

Yes, it would make more sense, but then manufacturing would be too easy.

What if it gave always 1 exp like bone powder?

The crafting quest is now useless. You can make thread and become a better crafter in less time with little effort. My wife's character is an expert crafter. Soon, she will have a bunch of newbie's for competition and all they would need to do is read the books and make thread. That disturbs me. ;)

 

Thread needs to be the same as bone powder. 3 cotton = 1 thread and 1 xp. :P

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lol, i love making thread. That gave me 3 crafting levels in less than one hour :D

 

Next, i think, i start mass production of ring molds.

 

Good update, radu, you should definately stay offline for a longer time :)

 

Piper

Yes, it would make more sense, but then manufacturing would be too easy.

What if it gave always 1 exp like bone powder?

The crafting quest is now useless. You can make thread and become a better crafter in less time with little effort. My wife's character is an expert crafter. Soon, she will have a bunch of newbie's for competition and all they would need to do is read the books and make thread. That disturbs me. ;)

 

Thread needs to be the same as bone powder. 3 cotton = 1 thread and 1 xp. :P

 

 

i agree with the thread thing. it takes to much cotton, and makes starting crafting to easy. more like bone powder would be better

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I haven't tried making threads because I lack nexus but, I had a crafter char last year and I think I wouldn't have mind an easier start in the crafting skill. IIRC, I had to read a lot of books (harvesting, molding, smelting, rings) and have a pretty decent alchemy level to make the bars myself, just to get my first 3 levels in crafting. It was very expensive investment in books (non-droppable like sapphire, diamond, etc..) and a lot of alchemy training just to be able to make a few simple rings.

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