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Thordin

A/D requrements for battle gear

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If a player is able to get the best weapons and armor in two weeks, it means that either he worked his ass off

No, we've already proven it doesn't take much to earn the gc needed to aquire the best items in the game, just sitting and selling flowers. You should make an anonymous newbie char and try it.

 

or he had a rich friend
I don't think this would be the norm or would happen frequently enough to be a problem unless the "friend" is in actuality an alt.

 

or he bought them from the store, financially supporting the game.
Ok make all level armour/weapons available for purchase. Maybe throw in some low level glowy things as well.

 

I see no reason to penalize them for that.
You aren't penalizing them, rather you would be stopping from spoon feeding them from the silver platter. You HAVE to consider all of your playerbase, not just the newbies. If the newbies are worth a damn, they'll stay to earn what they get. And that is what makes a good playerbase, a mix of happy players...happy newbies, happy middles, happy long-termers. You are only making the newbies happy and for what? For them to stick around for a week or two and curse us out and move on to the next game because they're bored?

 

As for a motivation to level up, umm... how about... like.. being able to kill stronger monsters and players?
Players need and want goals, physical rewards for doing the work. It's human nature! If you had a job and worked at it hard for 5 years and finally got the corner office with the windows, and JoeIntern walks in and gets an identical office after his first week there because his rich daddy paid the boss...you'd be pissed! It's just not fair. And if JoeIntern quit because he didn't get that office, he's a sucky employee you are better off without anyway.

 

I will never feel that buying your way to the top is an acceptable way to play. The top is there to be earned, it's why people should be here. To "play" the game, not buy their way through it.

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There is no way in hell I am going to add level requirements for weapons and armor. There would be absolutely no benefit whatsoever, except for frustrating a lot of people, and making strong people even stronger.

 

 

Thats true. I have been trying to complete a guild quest for my guild and the reward is a serpant sword. If this happens all my hard work won't get me very much but of course it benifits the guild. :(

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There is no way in hell I am going to add level requirements for weapons and armor. There would be absolutely no benefit whatsoever, except for frustrating a lot of people, and making strong people even stronger.

 

 

Thats true. I have been trying to complete a guild quest for my guild and the reward is a serpant sword. If this happens all my hard work won't get me very much but of course it benifits the guild. :(

 

But, it's shortsighted! What motivation left for you to get better equipment? Now, you may feel great that you have one of the best weapons, but sooner or later (hopefully later) you'll get bored of it...

 

And FYI: i have full plate mail, titanium axe and CoM, if this would come in use, I shall be restricted as well with my stats of 33/37 in A/D

 

And this is OPEN TOPIC, if you have better idea of your own, just post it here, but IMHO this issue shouln't be left without anything...

Edited by ThordinElement

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Entropy, the maths do not lie:

 

In lilacs, the rate is, moreless, in teh Votd northern bush, 2.4kgc hour. Full plate is 16kgc right now, so, it is a matter of a couple of days at 3-4 housr each day. THE BETTER EQUIPMENT IN GAME.

 

In lupines, this is doubled, (i said lilacs cause the real n00b will be crushed by bob in portland, still, s/he could go to palong vertas...but well). So, in 4 hours you can have the better equipment and wear it.

 

Then you go, fight a gob (thinking that plate will save your ass, that it will not cause your def is 3, and the plate sucks 2 out of those 3 points, so def become 1 -acuracy is also lowered, btw).

 

So, with those stats, bob crush you, you lose full plate 4 mins after buying it, you think "this game sux", and close the client, just to uninstall it forever.

 

EDIT: THIS, is not my opinion, is a thing that I have seen zillions of times in ch1, Isla Prima, and ch 255, the places, where I talk with newcomers.

Edited by m_bee

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There is an easier way for this to be programmed into the system than level requirement on each weapon.

 

Have the wraith refuse to hand out Human nexus to players with less than whatever a/d.

 

"I'm sorry you must be at least 60/60 a/d before I can let you have a 5th Human nexus."

 

I'm playing a character that is perfectly happy with 2 human for training. Gaining more points is going to be a struggle as at a higher OA getting PPs is a struggle. The mentality at the start of the game is "I'm going to be powerful eventually, so I might as well get 5 Human nexus now", I believe that this is what needs changing. Attitudes are harder to change than numbers though.

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Not a bad idea too, can you please work that deeper and more specific and post it here, so we can discuss it?

And happens something I was afraid of: dividing people into two different groups: on the one side are more experienced players, asking for some system in equipment, on the other side are newbies, who are screaming to not take their toys away. The problem is, that people don't want to foresee. They want everything NOW, not realizing what to do, after they have it. There is no simple solution to this. One way or the other, there will be unsatisfied group of people, now we must to decide, which is bigger, which has future and what solution we choose.

We can let this thing as it is and we will be hoping, it works long enough.

OR

We can try some improvements, hoping, it will make people stay here, not only new ones, but also the older ones, and further broadening the community, which will lead to better economy, perhaps better interaction and maybe more people to give USD for some stuff in the EL shop.

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I am sick of this shit.

First we all cry how hard it is to make money in the game, and how there is so little gold. But now, when it suits our purpose, we change the story to: "It's so easy to make money you can buy the best shit in the game in 6 hours".

 

Well, I am glad to hear that, because I was planning to make the hydrogenium bars sellable for some profit. Now I won't. Same for the new weapons and armors.

 

And no, there will be no requirements for the armors. The requirements are intrinsic.

 

Entropy, the maths do not lie:

 

In lilacs, the rate is, moreless, in teh Votd northern bush, 2.4kgc hour. Full plate is 16kgc right now, so, it is a matter of a couple of days at 3-4 housr each day. THE BETTER EQUIPMENT IN GAME.

 

In lupines, this is doubled, (i said lilacs cause the real n00b will be crushed by bob in portland, still, s/he could go to palong vertas...but well). So, in 4 hours you can have the better equipment and wear it.

 

Then you go, fight a gob (thinking that plate will save your ass, that it will not cause your def is 3, and the plate sucks 2 out of those 3 points, so def become 1 -acuracy is also lowered, btw).

 

So, with those stats, bob crush you, you lose full plate 4 mins after buying it, you think "this game sux", and close the client, just to uninstall it forever.

 

EDIT: THIS, is not my opinion, is a thing that I have seen zillions of times in ch1, Isla Prima, and ch 255, the places, where I talk with newcomers.

 

Yes, this is exactly how the armors were designed. If you are a n00b and use them, most likely they will not help at all, but hurt you. Same thing with the weapons: you will get very little attack exp if you use weapons.

I see no reason whatsoever to mandate people what to wear and when to wear it. It's called a free style game, no classes, no hard walls. If you don't like that, go play some Asian MMO, where they drastically enforce those limits.

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First, I, like the rest around here, would better go away and play anything else if I did not care a shit -like you say- about this game.

 

I have been around for about 2 years now, some people who talked in this thread have been even more time around. I am not saying that that gives me any rights or something, just stating that Im not a newcomer with a short perspective.

 

The toy is yours, and you -as creator and owner- have the last word, that is a natural thing and your will is the only truth here. But remember that if we did not care at all -like you say- we would indeed be playing any other mmorpg. And I would not have been around that much time, like some others players that thinks the same than I do.

 

Anyway, from now on I will better shut my mouth up.

 

EDITED my crappy english for clarification.

Edited by m_bee

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uhhhm no lol. This game is good because of the community, if it wasn't for that many people would have quit long ago. The lvl requirements aren't intrinsic.. why you think people with lvl 20 harv and 5/5 a/d walk round in plate?

Lvl requirements give people a goal to work towards, and then a way of showing off what they have achieved, like the capes used to do before they got changed as well.

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I think motivation is a key stuff in a game. I remember training for entering in a guild when i was noob. My goal was to have skill to enter in the guild of my choice, and the guilds who had the highest minimum levels was -EF- and *O* back then, with 3 skills at 50. That does not mean i would enter for one of that guilds, but i wanted badly to have the levels for it.

I also played another game, because it got a "vagabound cape", a very high level item who looked very cool and i wanted it too. :whistle:

But i also played D&D (still play) and Phantasy star which have no minimum level for stuff. And i was/am happy with it too, kill better monsters is a nice motivation.

______________

Anyway, it would be nice if full plates and other high level stuff got good protection against top armors like thermals...

This days, if you see someone entering kf with full plate s/he probably is noob.

Edited by Lorck

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This was supposed to guide people thru A/D system, not prohibit them. What is the point, if newb buys himself a full plate and serpent, he feels powerful, he goes to kill goblins, they kill him, he feels miserable about loss of items. Remember that not even grown up adults play this game. Also the people aged 11-14, do you expect of them to be reasonable? To get A/D maths well? Of course they don't, they get frustrated about it. I never meant to prohibit people, just to give them help and some guide, perhaps some motivation.

 

Well, doesn't that mean you like the game as it is? At least most of it, that is.

 

Of course we DO like it. If we DID NOT like it, we WOULD NOT care to post here. This is only discussion, you don't need to get upset. I just wanted to post some feedback, some remarks I made in this game. If I didn't like this game, I wouldn't care playing it or posting this "shit" here. Now someone better close this, before we get into a flame war :whistle:

 

EDIT: grammar typos

Edited by ThordinElement

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uhhhm no lol. This game is good because of the community, if it wasn't for that many people would have quit long ago. The lvl requirements aren't intrinsic.. why you think people with lvl 20 harv and 5/5 a/d walk round in plate?

Lvl requirements give people a goal to work towards, and then a way of showing off what they have achieved, like the capes used to do before they got changed as well.

 

Yes, they are.

If you use an armor at a low level, your combat performance will be degraded.

If people lose their motivation and quit because of that, then so be it. Just like any other game, EL is not for everyone.

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Sorry, I sounded a bit rude in my post yesterday.

 

But I still think the same, of course that we like the game. We love it! If we did not we would be in any other place. I just wanted to state that these are disscussion forums, and the people here talk about things, some ideas might go into the game eventually, some will never, like it seem the case for this one. That is fair, as I said, the choice is yours. Im not complaining about the fact that this is or not implemented.

 

I just want you to forget about that phrase of "take it like it is or go away". that is not the first time that I see it. If you really think that, then, you should first close the discussion forums, since there is no need for external opinions. All the people who work in the Enciclopedia and the Client code, and that gives suggestions, only try to do this better, the previous statement, if totally incompatible with something that is community based.

 

If we did not have the will to change things, to create a translation, to change stuff in the enci, to create a patch for this or that thing, or to propose the addition of stuff to the game cause it is lacking in some aspects, then we would beter "take it as it is or go away", and things would change a lot more slowly -if at all-. Just was upset about that. So, no, we will never stop complaining, since if we take the things as they are and never complain, the things will never change.

 

PS: This is totally offtopic, wich I usually avoid to be, but I couldnt help it. Sorry, at least is was short.

 

Regards, m_bee, Transvaal in game.

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I am sick of this shit.

First we all cry how hard it is to make money in the game, and how there is so little gold. But now, when it suits our purpose, we change the story to: "It's so easy to make money you can buy the best shit in the game in 6 hours".

Actually, that's a miscommunication there - the point that people are trying to say is you can either make money in game, or actually do something.

 

There is a tremendous profit potential for harvesters, and for a lesser part essence alchemists - I know. Probably 99% (if not 100%, maybe even more if I account for the negative gains on buying leather from general stores, making helms, selling to Trik (before "cheap leather")) of my profits in game have been from selling harvest items to an NPC, or making essences in bulk and selling to players (takes more time, but the results are more noticable).

 

On the other hand, if you want to do about any other skill, there hasn't been as much profit potential.

 

Summoning has about no profit potential at present, and is seen more as a "show off your wealth" skill, it seems.

 

Manufactors (weapons, armors, clothes) have seen their profit potentials constantly declining, so they can't really support bar alchemists, so the markets here keep falling too.

 

Crafters - hasn't the constant complaint here been that the NPC sells so low there really is no profit margin on rings? I can't go much more into that - not much a crafter.

 

Magic - seen largely as nothing more than a support skill for any decent fighter. Players wanting to be more of a mage character in this game are effectively a joke, and will not make a dime (most of the time) through magic.

 

Potioner - Again, anyone watching the prices on the market will note the rapid deflation of prices... what more can I say?

 

Fighters - while gc drops have gone up (Good Thing), other drops that can be gotten primarily through fighting are already thoroughly saturating the market, except for more recent items which may get there soon. A few things that are actaully needed sell, others have such weak demand that they never sell, and such weak NPC prices as to not be worth emptying out of storages in such manner. Not to mention that there seems a significant focus on saying that only the PKers have ANY value to this game, when there is a significant nonPK fighters base, and also if you want the impressive armors, you need someone who actually can make them...

 

On a point, I want to ask - do we (the players, the writers, the developers, the community) actually matter? Why, if the work we do (those of us who do different works for the game) matters, can't the same apply for our opinions - at least enough to get a polite response?

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Actually, I am quite open to suggestions. Many suggestions have been implemented, while other suggestions did influence me in some way or another.

 

However, there IS a missconception here. If I say that I do not want to do something, it means that I consider that it does not match my vision on how the games should be, so it is not going to be implemented. Period.

If everyone would have a say, and his or her say would be implemente,d there would be total chaos and anarchy, and the game will become totally unplayable. Which is why there is a central authority (me) who decides what game mechanics are going to change and be added in the game.

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If everyone would have a say, and his or her say would be implemente,d there would be total chaos and anarchy, and the game will become totally unplayable. Which is why there is a central authority (me) who decides what game mechanics are going to change and be added in the game.

While I totally disagree with the result of this thread and still feel required levels are better both for game mechanics and player psyche, I do wholeheartedly agree with ent's statement here and therefore have to agree with ending the discussion.

 

Thread locked. (After a good knock to his head with very high heeled pointy toed shoes).

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