Bonus exp areas, no item made

[Entropy]

Here is my idea, and I think it will be implemented like this (which can not possibly make anyone not like it).

 

So, you go to this special area (school, workshop, etc.). You go there with your items, and anything you manufacture there just does not materialize (ie. ingredients lost, no item created). However, the food requirement will be /2, and the experience will be *2.

If you do not like the idea, you can always manufacture outside those areas, where everything will be as it is now.

[Kougria]

I read only the first 2 pages, but here is my idea, and I think it will be implemented like this (which can not possibly make anyone not like it).

 

So, you go to this special area (school, workshop, etc.). You go there with your items, and anything you manufacture there just does not materialize (ie. ingredients lost, no item created). However, the food requirement will be /2, and the experience will be *2.

If you do not like the idea, you can always manufacture outside those areas, where everything will be as it is now.

 

 

I like this idea much much better. Its something like I wanted it to be like because everyone still needs to get get all the ingrediants and they would need to choose between double exp or having the item.

 

- Kougria

[bkc56]

So, you go to this special area (school, workshop, etc.). You go there with your items, and anything you manufacture there just does not materialize (ie. ingredients lost, no item created). However, the food requirement will be /2, and the experience will be *2.

If you do not like the idea, you can always manufacture outside those areas, where everything will be as it is now.

Yes, this is a much simpler and (probably) easier to implement plan. A simple trade-off between having the item (for sale or use) or 2x the experience. People will level faster, and there'll be a lot less stuff on the market.

 

I still think the problem can be solved (even easier) with mix delays and experience increases, but the above method is a good second choice.

[Ortak]

That seems like the perfect solution. Nice and simple, and no one gets burned. Also, halving the food cost is a god-send. Not having to learn a huge new system is also really nice.

 

 

I love you, Entropy!

(in a respect way, I'm married )

[Entropy]

Yeah, I thought so (that no one will object). It is very easy to implement as well, so I guess we'll go with this solution.

[sparhawk]

Sounds good. I really cant say anything agaisnt that.

[duran]

sounds workable, entropy.

 

more xp, less food, faster growth. at the cost of getting no items for sale.

still, as one is using ones own harvested items, anyone can in theory do this.

Edited January 15, 2006 by duran

[Ermabwed]

at least one problem i see here (besides being asked for an opinion and then only the first two pages were even considered ... ):

let's say i want to craft a disengagement ring. then i would need to make the silver bars needed for the silver ring outside of "school", because they wouldn't materialize when i made them inside, same goes for the polished ruby needed ...

my suggestion here would be, like proposed originally, to have the items not being able to leave the schoolarea. Besides opposing this idea . but i agree that Entropy's idea would probably be easiest to implement.

[duran]

made outside of school area, for sale. made inside school area, for training and to cover cost of said training

 

basicly it allows a economy where people can make some to sell or make a lot to train. without one interfering with the other.

 

sure, if you want to make everything from scratch, there may be some troubles...

 

still, it will allow for a increase in player to player economy in that some will create to fuel other peoples training...

alltho, as there is no return on said training, they will have to find some other way of paying for the parts...

 

hmm, i would love to see secondary parts. like say partialy made pant legs, or larger surfaces of leather made by stitching together the bits of leather sold over the counter. this way one can get extra exp without creating finished goods.

Edited January 15, 2006 by duran

[Arnieman]

I have to ask - does this mean we aren't even considering the manufacture-by-steps system at all now?

 

I mean, BEFORE we have any work on this, I'd like to see that (say, the process of chain-mail would be something like (starting with bars) make some wire, bend wire into rings, bring rings together to make the chainmail (may be missing some steps).

 

To be honest, I'm not exactly liking the idea as was proposed - Entropy's idea was better, but not necessarily fully "to my liking". Biggest thing I think is that the delays - as much as everyone hated them - made more sense than the food cooldowns do, IMO.

 

If anyone has seen the market as I have, you do note that some areas have dropped in price - I mean, iron plate was something like 20Kgc; now it's 13Kgc (as I saw someone selling for the other day)? If you look at alchemy, the prices have raised significantly on what gets used - I remember when 4-5gc was a good price on Health Essence, and now I'm seeing it at 7-8gc per essence (looks like it's kinda at the proverbial ceiling, if it goes higher, people will just buy at the NPCs (if they can).

 

While the idea of training areas would be nice, I don't necessarily like the idea of NOT making the item after collecting everything to make it... unless there could be some more to it than just increased experience, say, a "goal" of successes that could be counted, and be given a bonus for reaching it?

• Counter-Proposal: (working off Entropy's idea now)
  
• First, you go and talk to the "training" NPC - just going to the training are would NOT be enough to activate it. (Would it be too much to ask if a "border" could be created for the training area after it's activated - say, something like tiles around the area could glow red?)
  
• Depending on your level, he asks you to make a certain amount of an item - ONLY that item would be trainable there, any other item would be normal production. If he asks you to create a certain item, you can choose to attempt to make it or not - choose 'no' to go collect items to make that item, or 'yes' to enter training mode.
  
• You enter training mode - you start to make the item requested, bet bonus xp, halved food cost, maybe even a reduced failure rate for having the master supervising? Your "successes do not materialize, but are counted.
  
• You talk to the NPC again, and tell him you've finished.
  
• The NPC pays you for your "successes" at the same as the normal selling-to-NPC price per item made. He could also compare this to the "goal" he gave you, and depending on if you meet it, he pays you.*
  
• If you leave the training area, or tell the NPC you finished, the training ends. (If you left, you'd get no pay no matter how much you made.) All counters and training modes are reset.
  

*I was thinking of maybe a scaled wage for this.

-So, if you meet the goal, he pays you in full.

-If you don't make the goal, he docks your pay by 10%.

-If you significantly exceed the goal (items made > 1.25 * goal), he would give you a bonus on your pay of 10%.

-If you significantly miss the goal (items made < 0.75 * goal), he refuses to pay you at all.

[belali]

i think making it as part manu god quest would be better

 

will need to do a quest (after the before quests that give %20 more exp)

 

when done you get 2 time's more exp and food advantage near manu god..

 

also other stuff like ent said

Edited January 15, 2006 by belali

[maximos]

please don't make this god-involved, it's because many people have godless, as have I :S

[belali]

you want more exp ?

 

pray your god

[Roja]

I have to ask - does this mean we aren't even considering the manufacture-by-steps system at all now?

 

I mean, BEFORE we have any work on this, I'd like to see that (say, the process of chain-mail would be something like (starting with bars) make some wire, bend wire into rings, bring rings together to make the chainmail (may be missing some steps).

 

 

Unfortunetly since Wytter left(he was going to work on those skill systems), we had to put them on hold. Either indefinetly or until we find a programmer who will do them.

 

But, we still will be adding steps to the current way we manufacture things-such as chainmail:

-You will need the tools used to actually make chainmail in your inventory.

-You'd first make wire from a metal bar

-then you'd make the rings

-then with a ton of rings, you'd make a shirt.

[Jezebelle]

I like Ents idea..

 

Isnt it great we can think outloud here and then our God comes up with one of his brilliant comprimises, lol..

 

I wish education in the schools nowadays would work this way

 

*hugs*

 

Jez

[Aislinn]

If you do not like the idea, you can always manufacture outside those areas, where everything will be as it is now.

Doesn't giving people the choice (ie leaving everything as it is now as well) defeat the purpose of the original suggestion? So now we end up with not only too many items ingame, but now people will level twice as fast as well...

[Roja]

The problem with too many items seems to come from people lving up with those items. If they now go to these areas to lvl up, the items will not be made so they shouldn't flood the market. That is the idea anyway.

[chaoogie]

well it doesnt actually defeat the purpose casue if they choose to level twice as fast they dont get the items made, and maybe you can lower the xp earned outside the areas by 5xp or sumthing like that that way people have to decide less xp or double xp but no items..... i think one thing is very clear ent has nice shoes

[The_Piper]

Well, this idea is a good money sink, coz it stops bringing money into the game, coz you cant sell those items to players/Trik/shops.

 

Its the decision of the players then, if they want money or XP.

 

I dont know if i like it, but i feel, this will be a dramatic change of the game. Going away from stupid leveling with one favorite item to a more strategic leveling/playing.

 

Its another option how to play, so lets go for it.

 

Piper

[trollson]

On problem I can see is that unless storage is incorporated into the schools, the effort of lugging the ingredients around will negate the experience bonus; it will remain most time efficient to mixing at a storage point.

 

Or you could make yourself *really* unpopular and decide that all storage points are no-item/double-experience areas... err forget I said that!

Edited January 15, 2006 by trollson

[duran]

somtimes i wonder if a storage ring, only sold by a npc, would be one hell of a money sink...

Edited January 15, 2006 by duran

[Aislinn]

On problem I can see is that unless storage is incorporated into the schools, the effort of lugging the ingredients around will negate the experience bonus; it will remain most time efficient to mixing at a storage point.

 

Or you could make yourself *really* unpopular and decide that all storage points are no-item/double-experience areas... err forget I said that!

Or not give players the option to do it either way. If they can ONLY get the exp by lugging the ingredients there, they won't decide that flooding the market with items is the more time/cost effective method.

[dns_server]

It is a resonable compromise for those that need to get thair level up and don't care about the cost and will reduce the mass production for some skills mainly manufacturing but it will probly not effect crafting. When you start off with crafting you are working in createing the base items (rings and medalions) that you will use in later levels so if you are smart you mass produce base rings to get your level up to make the higher levels easyer when you have the skills.

 

For something like this to work it needs to be reletively easy to do the mass production in this area and this requires ether being close to storage such as a building in a town with a storage ether portland or tarsengard or haveing a storage npc in the area. It is something that belongs in a seperate area so it must be located in an enclosed space this could be ether a house or possibly a fenced off place possibly with a npc at the entrance.

The avantage of haveing a npc is it is there to tell you about it and it could also act as a storage bot or sales bot ether general store or one that sells everything.

 

I woud prefer if there was no food requirement at all in these zones and there was some other cost associated with them say 100gc each visit? Another way would be to still be allowed to keep your items but you pay half the npc sell price (so you make a 50% loss on the item) when you make it.

[Baron_Samedi]

I'm not sure that the exp gained would be enough to offset the economic loss of items not made to sell,except for cheap leather goods.

 

1) Swords are used for some god quests.Also the possibility of making modables.Why use serp stones and efe to make tit serps in a exp only area? The same would apply to axes and high end armor. Making enriched essence is rare so why would you use them here just to get double exp?

 

2) The amount of material you need to collect to make the bars to manu/craft what you intend to make.(eg just to make iron swords for Mortos quest.) Less exp and selling the stuff would probably still be the way people choose to go.

 

3) Crafting.The large amount of materials/fails to make the base items.All gems require 10 gc to polish eccept diamonds which cost 30 gc to polish.I can't see crafting here as any money I make goes into buying

more feast pots to polish, make base items etc.

 

4) Random days.Assume I decide to take the cash loss and get double exp making leather stuff.How would scholar's day,when you get increased manu exp affect this? Or the day when you get reduced exp for making stuff?

 

Just my thoughts.Thanks for allowing my input.

[Ice]

Sounds like a winner to me!!!!!