Stats showing

[Lorck]

A suggestion: instead of simply hiding completly the stats, why not show the stats a little imprecise (like in a 25 basis). For instance, Enyo has around 90 attack, and the new stats page would show this as 75-100 or something like that. In this way it will ensure privacy and prevent rampant scamming, and you can know who is a newbie or not in a pk map.

Its also a bit realistic, if you know chemistry, for exemple, you can imprecisely learn his/her chemistry lvl after see the person working for a few minites in real life.

[rasberrybeard]

You guys aren't going to make an impact. I mean lets look at it. How many times have they asked us our opinion then gotten all defensive and rude when our opininions differed from theirs. I dont why the devs even bother. Sorrry for saying it, but look in other topics, the devs always just do what they want, they might as well not even ask.

[Ornitorrinco]

You guys aren't going to make an impact. I mean lets look at it. How many times have they asked us our opinion then gotten all defensive and rude when our opininions differed from theirs. I dont why the devs even bother. Sorrry for saying it, but look in other topics, the devs always just do what they want, they might as well not even ask.

211090[/snapback]

Well, they have the right to do so.

[Mr.Mind]

What about mules?

[Lorck]

You guys aren't going to make an impact. I mean lets look at it. How many times have they asked us our opinion then gotten all defensive and rude when our opininions differed from theirs. I dont why the devs even bother. Sorrry for saying it, but look in other topics, the devs always just do what they want, they might as well not even ask.

211090[/snapback]

I agree. But i will always at least try.

My major concern is not 'privacy'. My concern is cheating, with lots of yes looking your stats is harder to increase it in a unfair way.

[Acelon]

What about mules?

211095[/snapback]

 

 

Thats already covered on the mod side of things.

[Minion]

Well I went from #55 OA to #47 ... w00t ..

 

Bad ruling.

 

Minion

[Aislinn]

You guys aren't going to make an impact. I mean lets look at it. How many times have they asked us our opinion then gotten all defensive and rude when our opininions differed from theirs. I dont why the devs even bother. Sorrry for saying it, but look in other topics, the devs always just do what they want, they might as well not even ask.

211090[/snapback]

Don't confuse suggestions with opinions.

And don't confuse bitching and moaning with opinions either.

 

You don't really know what gets chosen out of all the suggestions and opinions. Take this thread for example...if there are some legitimate issues that are brought up that maybe hadn't been thought of before, they will talk about them and analyze them. If people are just complaining because they are worried about the top 50 list, I doubt that will matter. The idea is if a lot of people state their opinion/suggestion (whichever is asked for), hopefully out of that bunch 1 or 2 things will stand out as noteworthy. But you go back and look at all those threads you mention...how many posts are really constructive criticisms and how many are just "this sux"? And you wonder why that isn't considered?

[Jaha]

I have an idea of how to improve the top 50 part of it at least. Is there any way to make it so rather than saying the person's name next to their level, could you make it so it says something else like just "hidden player". that way it doesnt give the name, and that way people can really know if they are in the top 50/10/whatever.

[Lorck]

Don't confuse suggestions with opinions.

And don't confuse bitching and moaning with opinions either.

 

You don't really know what gets chosen out of all the suggestions and opinions.  Take this thread for example...if there are some legitimate issues that are brought up that maybe hadn't been thought of before, they will talk about them and analyze them.  If people are just complaining because they are worried about the top 50 list, I doubt that will matter.  The idea is if a lot of people state their opinion/suggestion (whichever is asked for), hopefully out of that bunch 1 or 2 things will stand out as noteworthy.  But you go back and look at all those threads you mention...how many posts are really constructive criticisms and how many are just "this sux"?  And you wonder why that isn't  considered?

211108[/snapback]

How many constructive criticisms are taken in account? None? I'm starting to think the only person important enough to take her oppinions considered by devs and mods is Enyo

Edited October 19, 2005 by Lorck

[Aislinn]

How many constructive criticisms are taken in account? None? I'm starting to think the only person important enough to take her oppinions considered by devs and mods is Enyo 

211111[/snapback]

Dev's/roja/ent can pick and choose as they see fit...nobody is under any obligation to apply a suggestion to the game if they don't like it. It's a search for ideas that appeal to them, for things they think are important that could go wrong...this stuff all gets looked at but it's not worth getting all worked up about if your opinion isn't theirs. That doesn't mean it wasn't considered.

[Banshen]

I have to admit its good not to know people stats for pking purposes. Adds an element of surprise and gives you that paniccy excited feeling when you see people in pk who you dont know if they are going to attack and dont kno wtheir stats. however i think top 50 should stay but not be able to show peoples stats. so if your number 10 in top 50 attack/defense for example just have it stay 10 but if your name is clicked on then nothing happens(ie your stats not revieled)

 

the negatives however is when you want to find someone to train with its nice to go to top 50 and click peoples stats near you to see if you can train with them.

 

And if you want a challenge and are waining to catch the person in front of you ni the top50 then you still can have that aim.... you just have to keep levelling faster and rather then stat watch that person you watch the position that they are in top 50 and when you level check top50 to see if you actually did catch them. if you didnt.... then you have something to strive for another challenge right there!

Edited October 19, 2005 by Banshen

[Guest Enyo]

For instance, Enyo has around 90 attack

211086[/snapback]

you have just proved one of my points.. you obviously know my stats yet i don't know yours and don't even know YOU for that matter.. .. wait, someone just told me that you are in GARD .. JaneMuffin's guild .. so that explains why YOU know me

 

showing the levels won't prevent rampant scamming.. people find a way to scam regardless.. most know who is a newbie just by their health bar.. funny clothes and they are somewhat annoying with their pole hopping.. sticking tongue out behaviour.. that's why many of us send them a one way ticket to the underworld .. but.. they come back for MORE so they must love it, lol

 

My major concern is not 'privacy'. My concern is cheating, with lots of yes looking your stats is harder to increase it in a unfair way.

211097[/snapback]

cheating? people who want to cheat will do so regardless of stat watchers. watching someone's stats doesn't prevent nor help prevent cheating. first you said it was to find a training partner or to cheak for strength, etc.. or to encourage you to level up and NOW it's cheating??!! make up your mind!!

 

 

How many constructive criticisms are taken in account? None? I'm starting to think the only person important enough to take her oppinions considered by devs and mods is Enyo 

211111[/snapback]

why do you like to use me so much as an example? lol.. i'm not the only one here who agrees with this or who is showing support for it. btw, i don't think the mods/devs are only considerng MY opinions. that's a silly thing to say. because there are many issues, impliments and changes which have taken place that i DON'T agree with and "yes" there are some which I do agree with. i remember when they removed the rostogol stone from monster drops.. i was so upset..or when they changed the drop rate.. i was pissed about that, too.

 

but.. i just try to show some moral support for ALL things whether i agree or not. if i don't agree, i state my reasons and then get on with it.. trying to have a more pollyanna approach. actually, there are only a handful of people here whining about it... and you are one of the loudest whiners.

 

why not try to see things from a positive perspective instead of your constant whining? the game is in beta so expect changes and changes are fun and exciting as far as i can see.

Edited October 19, 2005 by Enyo

[Ignoble]

Well for my pennyworth, I think such a facility is open to abuse by higher level players (pk).

 

Personally I see no reason why there is a need to hide your stats: privacy paranoia?

 

With regard to the point that in real life you have no idea of a person's capabilities, then I agree with another poster's comment that it only takes a fairly short period of time to "size someone up." If I saw a thug approaching me in an alleyway at night, then I would probably have good grounds to be nervous .

 

If stats must be hidden, then an indicator of the levels needs to be employed.

[Zep]

Wot's the point in levelling if u have no target to beat?

 

The concepts of MMORPG's arnt really about leveling, So much as interaction.

 

Thats probably why baning isnt so common now, Unless its for a very serious offence.

Its also why it doesnt matter if stats are displayed, Or if people choose to not have them displayed.

It also adds more chance when pking, And more risk.

That typically means more interaction, people will be more inclined to travel in big groups, less inclined to take negative style role play, And less inclined to make trouble, when they can quickly become the enemy of many.

 

If you are just in it to be at the top 50, Maybe you missed the point of MMORPGs =)

[Lorck]

you have just proved one of my points.. you obviously know my stats yet i don't know yours and don't even know YOU for that matter.. 

 

showing the levels won't prevent rampant scamming.. people find a way to scam regardless.. most know who is a newbie just by their health bar.. funny clothes and they are somewhat annoying with their pole hopping.. sticking tongue out behaviour.. that's why many of us send them a one way ticket to the underworld    .. but.. they come back for MORE so they must love it, lol 

cheating?  people who want to cheat will do so regardless of stat watchers.  watching someone's stats doesn't prevent nor help prevent cheating.  first you said it was to find a training partner or to cheak for strength, etc.. or to encourage you to level up and NOW it's cheating??!!    make up your mind!! 

why do you like to use me so much as an example? lol.. i'm not the only one here who agrees with this or who is showing support for it.  btw, i don't think the mods/devs are only considerng MY opinions.  that's a silly thing to say.  because there are many issues, impliments and changes which have taken place that i DON'T agree with and "yes" there are some which I do agree with.  i remember when they removed the rostogol stone from monster drops.. i was so upset..or when they changed the drop rate.. i was pissed about that, too. 

 

but.. i just try to show some moral support for ALL things whether i agree or not.  if i don't agree, i state my reasons and then get on with it.. trying to have a more pollyanna approach.  actually, there are only a handful of people here whining about it... and you are one of the loudest whiners. 

 

why not try to see things from a positive perspective instead of your constant whining?  the game is in beta so expect changes and changes are fun and exciting as far as i can see.

211131[/snapback]

First, i did know the stats of almost everyone in the top50 list, because i thought this would be good for the construction of my char, and because it is no trouble as i have excelent memory. Sorry for invading your 'privacy' and to all other ppl who hide their stats.

Secound, when i saw the post, i thought only scammers and cheaters would take advantage of it. Why? Its too easy to scamm and cheat when you dont have a trustworthy way to know somebody. Now ppl can gain 30 or 40 lvls because of a bug and nobody would see that. And someone was trying to find training partners without disclose their stats.

Third, i take you as exemple because normally you is the one who flame me.

Fourth, i talk when i like some change, like the new p2p races or the new skill or the new shared vision. But when i see something i do considere wrong in the game i criticize (read i try to find solutions and suggestions)... ppl who only do praise the devs harm the game imho, because it make up the game problems (or do you think the game is perfect?).

I am aware of the game changes, and i will say if i like each change or not... i dont care if nobody will hear it or not.

[Arnieman]

I would personally say I see good and bad points to this:

 

Good -

- people can no longer harass a player who changed name based on stats

- players don't have to list their stats to everyone

- some mystery added to PK

 

Bad -

- scamming by "training" just got a whole lot easier

- players changing names to hide from previous actions (further positive reinforcement of negative character roles)

- some people like looking at higher chars to note stat development technique - now harder to do

 

Personally, I don't really see what the purpose of this is, but I'm fully willing to give it a chance. I for one feel no reason to hide - so I won't be.

[Sildegaar]

OK, let me post my thoughts here. Pros and Cons hiding stats.

 

Thought n°1: Pro :I am more of a RPG player than a "Woohoo ! up a level !" guy. I don't really care about my stats being better than someone else's.

 

Thought n°2: Pro : I agree with Entropy that when you meet somebody on the street, you don't know how good he is at crafting.

 

Thought n°3: Con : BUT, I also agree with Lorck and others when they think that you should be able to guess somebody's "stature" : I would not enter into an arms-wrestling fight with somebody who's arms are twice the size of my chest.

 

Thought n°4: Pro : I meet a guy in the street. Average size, light weight. How could I guess he is a Lightweight Champion or a Gold Medal Sword fighter ?

 

Conclusion: the Health bar is good enough for me to judge whether or not I should enter into a fight with somebody. Maybe you could add a rough estimate of Physique attribute. Eye Icon: "You see a well built guy named Sildegaar" (hehe). But then that would have to also work with Charm for example : "You see an ansome, well built guy named Sildegaar" (that sounds even more realistic, hehehe)

 

Before this short exercice I thought I would agree with Lorck idea of having a +/- 25 points estimate; like Sildegaar's Physique 0-25. But now I think having an improved eye icon could do the trick with just qualifiers :

- weak, average, well built, strong and "arms like trees" for physique

- ugly, average, good looking, beautiful and "breath taking beauty" for charm.

 

Yes, that would be equivalent to 25 points ranges, but at least that would be more RPG and only related to visible attributes.

 

Now, I just thought that for the moment, when seeing many high level players you would get: "You see a ugly man with arms like trees, called XYZ". But worst, you could get :"You see a ugly woman with arms like trees, called Cindirella", lol.

 

I'm getting off topics and straight to "Suggestions". So here I stop.

[Lorck]

I dont wanted to flame anybody... look at my suggestions.. look at my points... they dont have any value? If i flamed is for ppl praising it (and btw flaming me) without providing any valid point after "this gives some chalenge" (it have prenty of chalenge before, ever tried to fight a chymmy barehended, or a fluffy without armor, stand a fight with multiple opponents, or...), and without providing any solution to the bad things it comes.

I would like to say, omfg, those changes are so awesome, but i cant sadly...

[Derin]

Not showing actualt stats is a good thing imo. It akes a little while to adjust, but soon enough you learn who is strong and who is not.

 

Quite a few games do have their stats hidden, and ppl don't complain about that in those games.

 

Finally, there could be a wayof getting a hint or idea as to how good other players are in some areas. There could be a spell called "scry" or something. This spell will when cast reveal some info, like 3 random skills per cast (accuracy based on caster level).

 

Example:

 

<player casts scry>

Select a target for scrying

<player clicks Gunther>

Gunther is good at attacking, mediocre at manufacturing, average in summoning.

 

The next time this spell is cast a set of three random skills are displayed to the caster, if the caster level is low, it may show:

Gunther is average at attacking, good at defense, excellent in summoning.

 

So to "know" Gunther's levels you will:

1. have to cast the spell multiple times

2. have a reliable caster level, ie a high enough magic level

[Zep]

Top idea Derin, If they limit it to pk maps, Or maybe which stats are displayed based on were you are, That will be ausome =)

[TooMass]

U guys should take a look at top50 side now.i think it's absolutely useless now. And these hidden stats r even worse for privacy because i hide it in the morning and i got 7 pms from that time and everyone asked me what's my a/d lvls....this is annoying.

[Ornitorrinco]

From mihaim's post:

 

If you want to go back in normal way

1) In game use #set_privacy off

2) log out

3) log in

 

I don't see how the training scam would be anymore likely to happen if you can turn off privacy.

 

Random_Person: Ornitorrinco, wanna fight with me?

Ornitorrinco: Okay, let me check your stats...

Random_Person: No, I have privacy turned on and won't turn it off

Ornitorrinco: Not even for a short period of time so I can see if you're the right oponent for me?

Random_Person: No.

Ornitorrinco: Okay, so I won't fight with you.

Edited October 19, 2005 by Ornitorrinco

[Ornitorrinco]

Not showing actualt stats is a good thing imo. It akes a little while to adjust, but soon enough you learn who is strong and who is not.

 

Quite a few games do have their stats hidden, and ppl don't complain about that in those games.

 

Finally, there could be a wayof getting a hint or idea as to how good other players are in some areas. There could be a spell called "scry" or something. This spell will when cast reveal some info, like 3 random skills per cast (accuracy based on caster level).

 

Example:

 

<player casts scry>

Select a target for scrying

<player clicks Gunther>

Gunther is good at attacking, mediocre at manufacturing, average in summoning.

 

The next time this spell is cast a set of three random skills are displayed to the caster, if the caster level is low, it may show:

Gunther is average at attacking, good at defense, excellent in summoning.

 

So to "know" Gunther's levels you will:

1. have to cast the spell multiple times

2. have a reliable caster level, ie a high enough magic level

211159[/snapback]

 

This reminds me of classical RPG's items like spyglass, that you used to know some or all of your oponent's stats. If implemented as an item, could be good for manufacturers or crafters (more items, more value to this people work). If it's a spell, could be a specially difficult one, so you would have to bring you personal "spy" with you, and it would be a good reason to make someone focus in magic more than in fighting (more value to magic, more player interaction). I'm all pro this idea.

Edited October 19, 2005 by Ornitorrinco

[WoodeH]

I don't like it, lol.

 

(Not that I wil ever be in the Top50. )