bep Report post Posted June 7, 2007 (edited) A high level summoner needs the following: 8x essence (life, death, matter, fire, enr life, enr death, enr magic, enr water ess,) 6x ore and minerals (gypsum, silver ore, gold, iron, mercury, quartz,..) 3x potions(summon, spirit, extra mana) 6x misc like serpentstone, enriched stones, bindingstone, COM, conjurer cape, threads 9x stones(armed orc, fluffy, sslesar, yeti, giants, artic chim, tiger, giant spider, bear, pfantom warrrior) 6x weapons (tit short, iron sword, broad sword, steel long, tit long, battle hammer(yes this also)) to train summon with hig level monster from time to time. 18x animal(bones, raw meat, bear fur, polar bear fur, rat tail, snake (3x), racoon, skunk, rabbit, white rabbit, puma, wolf, deer, deer anthler, white tiger fur, fox) 4x food and sunflower, tigerlily, cactus. 62 slots needed to become a good summoner( and didnt count other flowers to make those essence and those "worthless'' panter/tiger furs) Edited June 7, 2007 by bep Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ttlanhil Report post Posted June 7, 2007 oh, for the... you do not have to store every single item you may possibly use... so don't do that... don't say you need to have every single related item. because you don't. what you need is far more limited than that I do all skills except summon, which I used to do, and still have much of the stuff for. I'm now up to 170 slots, thanks to some of the stuff in the update... and no doubt I could clear out some more space if I sold things I won't use (which I have a few of) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bkc56 Report post Posted June 7, 2007 oh, for the... you do not have to store every single item you may possibly use... so don't do that...Yea. I have to laugh at people who have a storage sale because they're out of room and are selling things like: 1 rabbit fur, 3 sunflowers, 2 mullen, etc. When I finish an essence mixing session, and I have a few random flowers left over, I drop them in a bag and forget about them. It's not worth the slots for leftover stuff like that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ttlanhil Report post Posted June 7, 2007 When I finish an essence mixing session, and I have a few random flowers left over, I drop them in a bag and forget about them. It's not worth the slots for leftover stuff like that.oh, I don't. I keep that stuff for next time. but that still doesn't fill up my storage Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bep Report post Posted June 7, 2007 don't say you need to have every single related item. because you don't. what you need is far more limited than that Yes i need too for summoning. With crafting you can make rings on demands. With summoning you cant do that, because: - summon stones must be made on place at harvest, gypsum is so heavy (10 emu). So you hardly ever make stones on demand. - Normal summoning you do in summon arena. Furs, bones and meat you have to gather them first before you go there. So after sumoning i can save 10 slots sometimes. - Most of the special essence, weapons and animal stuff i buy from bots or people. You cant harvest them easy like ore and flowers. And they are not always available on market. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeone3000 Report post Posted June 8, 2007 (edited) So, by your own account, you mine the stuff on location and count it as a storage slot. What the heck. You just saved 9 slots in minerals. Do you actually make all of those summoning stones? Even the ones that don't sell? Why? You summon ALL those animals? As opposed to just wolves, or whatever gives the best experience? Again, why? Edited June 8, 2007 by freeone3000 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TirunCollimdus Report post Posted August 23, 2007 I was not aware when I started EL that I would need a day planner to allocate storage slots and plan which skill to work on what day and how much. This so called 'strategy' is nothing more than time management and administrative work. Oh fun!! Lets all get calendars so we can decide what kind of fun to have and on what days. Limiting how fast any player can raise their skills by limiting their available options is better than an open ended game how? No one knew how hard they would hit the slot barrier if they tried to raise their character equally fast in all skills when they started and what do you know not everyone started out trying to be an all arounder. Your 'raison detre' for limiting storage slots is a load of crap. There are too many types of different people in an MMORPG environment to worry about everyone becoming self-sufficient and not interacting with anyone else. I joined the EL game and community because it was classless. I saw an opportunity to play a game that did not dictate to me how I was supposed to develop my character. I am very disappointed to find out just how wrong I am. It seems to me that there are a lot of answers to increasing storage slots that would not be too hard to implement but as iterated here the developers simply choose not to. If the game keeps expanding again and again with the slots set at 200 permanently then EL will definitely loose its attraction for me. I have over 60 GIGs of games on my computer. I could play them all of the time since I buy the kind that have almost limitless strategy options like the Civilization series. I choose to play EL whether wanting to be self-sufficient or not because I like the way it is Massively Multiplayer. If EL was a solo game I would not be playing it. Doing a lot of things in EL would be mind numbingly boring if there were not friends, guild mates and others to chat with all of the time. BTW the last time I checked most people who want to be completely self-sufficient usually don't bother with the internet requirements and rules that come with MMORPGs they just buy Morrowwind or any of the other hundreds of titles out there that only require the internet for patches and updates. I really cannot understand this paranoia of some players, mods and developers that everyone who plays MMORPGs does it for the sole purpose of becoming the best while ignoring everyone else who plays the game. I realize there are more than a couple of persons who would be happy to see me go but I really love what EL has become for me and I have enjoyed my suggestions becoming part of the game. I have had a great time helping to sway discussions one way or the other in the voting and all of the debates that have gone with it. Simply put the complexity of the game requires more storage and forcing players to become character administrators instead of just players is not in any way my idea of creating fun. IMO you either remain true to being a classless game or you don't call yourself one. This is admittedly by the powers that be a multiclass game without penalties for changing classes. That isn't what I signed up for and it is not what a lot of others signed up for either. I do not think my opinion or the opinion of all of the other players who want to pursue all skills equally will change anything but hopefully a change in the game description at least could be made. TirunCollimdus CoGM of PATH Perseverance And Tolerance Honored Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rehdon Report post Posted August 23, 2007 Simply put the complexity of the game requires more storage and forcing players to become character administrators instead of just players is not in any way my idea of creating fun. IMO you either remain true to being a classless game or you don't call yourself one. I agree with that. When I started playing I only looked to be a fighter/mage, after a while I started doing some manufacturing and potioning, in the future I'd like doing some crafting ... that's very nice and a strong point of EL, but having only 200 storage slots and a ever growing number of items is a quite serious problem that can only get worse. Rest assured, I gave up really really soon to the idea of collecting every weapon and armor available (although I regret that, what can I do? the graphics are nice and I'm the collector type ) and I manage my storage so to get rid of stuff I'm not using/needing, but as Tirun said that's far from being fun ... Rehdon Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Usl Report post Posted August 23, 2007 That's why food e.g. will never become storeable. ... never say never Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Llywar Report post Posted August 23, 2007 I wouldn't call the concern about nobody interacting a matter of "paranoia". However, it is certainly a concern. People complain about the EL economy, and then they complain that it is hard to do everything on their own. Well, the economy is nothing more than the interactions between characters - so anything that encourages trade furthers the economy. You can still do everything on your own in EL, but you can get ahead faster if you work well with others. This is good for the game. I still have something around 75 storage slots free - I'm not really sure what people are doing to fill so many slots. Sure, if you want to literally collect items/armors/etc then that is a problem. But use hyperbags if you just need lots of slots and don't care about convenience - stick them behind some tree in the middle of nowhere and nobody will find them. Lots of stuff in-game would become easier without any limits. Do you need a day-timer to plan a mining run so as to have the right ratio of food/ingreds/free space? Do you need a day-timer to plan a hydro run so as to have all the stuff you need on-hand as well as enough S2Es to make the trip worth it? Do you need a day-timer to plan a day of training so that you have enough spares/potions/essences/rings with space for loot? Why not just get rid of emu limits entirely and then nobody has to think about such things? Sure, as the number of items increases a few more storage slots would probably be good. However, I don't think there is a big problem with the game as-is. If you're getting full just type #sto, copy/paste into a market post, and have a storage sale... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jamincollins Report post Posted August 23, 2007 (edited) Alright lets examine the current state of my storage. I've trimmed the number of each item as it's largely irrelevant to the discussion at hand. I've also grouped the items under a purpose heading for what I see them being used mainly for. Many items fall into more than one category. You have 194 out of 200 slots used. As you can see my storage is nearly full. [potion] Blue Star Flower Yellow Rose Valerian Rat tail White Chanterelle Poppies Deer Antlers Bones Powder Wheat Swamp Candles Nightshade - Mullein - Dandelion Extract Empty Vial Poison Ivy Red Currents Blue Lupine Blue Quartz Nightshade Tiger Lilly Yarrow Sunflower Mercury Rose Quartz Ale Fruits Poison Ivy - Henbane - Poppies Extract Red Currents - Blue Berries - Rue Extract Polished Ruby Mixture of Power Ogre Toes Raw Meat Rue Wheat - Daffodils - Feran Horn Extract Wheat - Valerian - Mugwort Extract Tulips Impatiens Mugwort Mortar & Pestle White Chanterelle - Ogre Toes - Tree Mushroom Extract Blue Berries Vegetables Wine Toadstool Yarrow - Wormwood - Tulips Extract White Asiatic Lilly Tree Mushroom Wormwood Dandelion Mullein Daffodils Gypsum Mead Henbane Vial Mold Beaver fur Snow Leopard fur Bear Fur Feran Horn Falcon Feather Hawk Feather Black Rose [armor and weapons / combat] Rostogol Stone Cutlass Jagged Saber Leather Boots Augmented Leather Pants Augmented Leather Armor Steel Cuisses Steel Greave Steel Plate Mail Moon Medallion Titanium Chain Mail Iron Helm Steel Shield Invisibility Potion Potion of Evasion Potion of Extra Mana Potion of Attack Potion of Coordination Potion of Great Healing Potion of Spirit Restoration Potion of Vitality Potion of Wildness Potion of Will Crown of Life Crown of Mana Ring of Disengagement Potion of Defense True Sight Potion Mirror Cloak Ring of Damage Tiger Summoning Stone Bear Summoning Stone Potion of Body Restoration Body Piercing Cloak Unicorn Medallion Titanium/Steel Alloy Short Sword Titanium/Steel Alloy Long Sword Titanium Serpent Sword Quarterstaff [harvesting requirements] Steel Long Sword Leather Gloves Steel Two Edged Sword Pickaxe Iron Sword Potion of Harvesting [crafting] Ruby Ring Mold Cotton Potion of Crafting Water Essence Medallion Mold Sapphire Gem Sanding Paper Gemstone hammer & chisel Polished Sapphire Polished Emerald Isla Prima Ring Building Enriched Life Essence Naralik Ring Building Gold Bar [manufacturing] Leather Thread Hammer Needle Potion of Manufacturing Enriched Fire Essence Binding Stone Book of special swords Book of Iron sword of fire Iron Bar Steel Bar [summoning] Conjurer Cloak Potion of Summoning Brown Snake Skin Racoon fur Puma Fur Polar Bear Fur Fox Fur Life Essence Brown rabbit fur Green Snake Skin Deer Fur Skunk fur Wolf Fur White rabbit fur [alchemy] Potion of Alchemy Hydrogenium Ore Earth Essence Matter Essence Red Snapdragons Fire Essence Titanium Ore Gold Ore Emerald Diamond Chrysanthemum Sulfur Iron Ore Silver Ore Wolframite Serpent Stone [magic] Magic Potion Death Essence Magic Essence Air Essence Spirit Essence Energy Essence Health Essence [engineering] Ashes [travel rings] Ring of Portland Ring of White Stone Ring of Naralik Ring of Isla Prima [food] Potion of Feasting Poison Antidote Powersaving Cloak [misc] Gold Coins Skull key Skeleton key [books for guild members] Book of Cyclops Fighting Book of Bear Summoning Book of Titanium Mining Book of Potion of Summoning Steel Shield Construction Titanium Serpent Sword Construction [drops to be sold to trik] Iron Battle Hammer Iron Broad Sword Wooden Battle Hammer [currently useless] Black panther fur Leopard fur Tiger fur Warm Fur Gloves Fur Boots Skunk hat So, by my count I have about 6 slots that are containing rather useless items and potentially another 9 that could be freed but would again start filling with monster drops. This doesn't take into account the items that are currently on my character: Excavator Cape Fast Regeneration Cape Monster Magnetism Cloak Or certain ingredients for key items that are not currently in my storage: Red roses Bones In short I've had to be very selective about how I enter into new skills (for me) such as Manufacturing, Crafting, and Engineering due to the limited number of slots. Edit: forgot there were no bones in my storage currently Edited August 23, 2007 by jamincollins Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vanyel Report post Posted August 23, 2007 You just need to be a bit more organized. I have all what I need for my skills and gridnig and still only 136 slots busy. If I get rid of some flowers I dont really use (like 1 red rose) and do some more cleaning I will go below 100. The fact you're unable to manage the space you have doesn't necessarily mean there is a need for more space. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Desertus Report post Posted August 23, 2007 I've been mainly potioner and fighter(training only), but Ive been also working on alchemy and magic and I usualy had ~110 FREE slots so I would be doing great with old slots limit. IMO getting back old slots limit would be better. The fact that game is classless doesnt mean you should be allowed to work on all skills. If you want to be an "all rounder" then learn how to use the storage. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jamincollins Report post Posted August 23, 2007 The fact you're unable to manage the space you have doesn't necessarily mean there is a need for more space. The fact that you don't have a need for more space doesn't mean many other players don't. Not everyone plays the game the same way. And what makes you think I am unable to manage my space? I've made do with the limit, I can work around it. This doesn't mean I don't see a need for additional storage space in some way. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TirunCollimdus Report post Posted August 23, 2007 (edited) I wouldn't call the concern about nobody interacting a matter of "paranoia". However, it is certainly a concern. People complain about the EL economy, and then they complain that it is hard to do everything on their own. Well, the economy is nothing more than the interactions between characters - so anything that encourages trade furthers the economy. Tirun In case everyone missed it, and it seems like they have, players who can make everything in the game will take a very long time before they can fight everything. The higher level drops are past their reach unless they interact with other players. PKers and high level trainers need items so having players who can make them is not a bad thing. Trying to say that the EL economy is conducive to players who make things interacting with each other is a load of crap. If you want interactivity then make the game profitable and give players who make money something to do with it. Buy land, trade in gold coin for dollars, or buy nexus and remove them. It does not matter what you do but until you have a profitable economy you will not have a functional one. Some players will pay others to harvest but almost no one will buy ings that have to be mixed. The value of the items that are mixed is too high in comparison. Real businesses make money or they cease to exist. If players did not make stuff just for experience the EL economy would not exist. Forcing people to play a certain way to force interaction because your economy is a complete failure is not the best solution for your players. Fix the pricing and you fix the problem with lack of interaction and everyone can make money from lowest to highest levels. Llywar You can still do everything on your own in EL, but you can get ahead faster if you work well with others. This is good for the game. Tirun What is this idea that being able to make everything means you work alone???? I was in RICH as soon as I hit harvest 20 and now I am in PATH. RICH parties are famous in EL and I was a big part of that after Mind left. I started the RICH wish list parties and we shocked everyone with our teamwork. PATH uses the same type of parties when we have the people online to do it. We are really small because we very selectively recruit but given time we can have parties like those RICH ones. You would have to be massively stupid if you could make everything in the game and you chose to work alone. There is so much harvesting and mixing to be done for higher level items that only an idiot would try to do it all by themselves. As I pointed out why would anyone want to do that with an online game when you can do it on a game you buy instead? No harvest locations changing, no lag, no server downtime, the secrets stay where you found them, and there is no waiting for help to get to resources. Llywar I still have something around 75 storage slots free - I'm not really sure what people are doing to fill so many slots. Sure, if you want to literally collect items/armors/etc then that is a problem. But use hyperbags if you just need lots of slots and don't care about convenience - stick them behind some tree in the middle of nowhere and nobody will find them. Tirun We are trying to do every skill in the game at the same time and still keep items that our guild members might need especially new ones. Trying to use hyperspcace bags to hold stuff when you are rotating your activities all of the time is ridiculously expensive and not supportable. Sticking them in the middle of nowhere is useless when you want to use them or need them. The only thing I can see that working for is books that are being held for future guild members. The fact that new items are being added all of the time and storage remains the same makes that solution untenable all by itself. Llywar Lots of stuff in-game would become easier without any limits. Do you need a day-timer to plan a mining run so as to have the right ratio of food/ingreds/free space? Do you need a day-timer to plan a hydro run so as to have all the stuff you need on-hand as well as enough S2Es to make the trip worth it? Do you need a day-timer to plan a day of training so that you have enough spares/potions/essences/rings with space for loot? Why not just get rid of emu limits entirely and then nobody has to think about such things? Sure, as the number of items increases a few more storage slots would probably be good. However, I don't think there is a big problem with the game as-is. If you're getting full just type #sto, copy/paste into a market post, and have a storage sale... Not really sure what a day-timer is but it sounds like a watch which you don't need to play EL unless it has an alarm to tell you when you have to get ready for work. You just need a calculator to figure out the best amounts for mixing on site and manage your emu for activities like training. The stuff for fighting can usually be figured out without a calculator though so that is just something you do by feel. This thread however has absolutely zero to do with managing inventory or emu. Seems very off topic to mention it and senseless as well. This is about storage not inventory and the limits on inventory are based on something a player can increase on their own. It has no correlation at all with storage. Really bad example of anything for this thread. The whole point of having a full storage is because you are using everything in it day in and day out or you have plans long term or short term where you require all of the things in your storage. You can change skills every day if you have enough slots but if you don't then you have to start planning which skills you will train so that you can plan on emptying and refilling your storage for each skill. That is not what anyone I know of considers to be fun. The slot limits keep a lot of all arounders from pursuing their goals and developing their characters the way they want to. Limited storage reduces teamwork by forcing people to get rid of stuff they could be giving to their friends and guild members making it less effective to work together. You said more storage would be nice but the fact is that it is needed. TirunCollimdus CoGM of PATH Perseverance And Tolerance Honored Edited August 23, 2007 by TirunCollimdus Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rehdon Report post Posted August 23, 2007 The fact you're unable to manage the space you have doesn't necessarily mean there is a need for more space. The fact that you don't have a need for more space doesn't mean many other players don't. Not everyone plays the game the same way. And what makes you think I am unable to manage my space? I've made do with the limit, I can work around it. This doesn't mean I don't see a need for additional storage space in some way. Ditto. The "I don't need it, so you don't need it either" principle is even more useless than usual in this specific case: as jamincollins noted people don't play the game in the same way, and they sure do manage a 200-slot store in a way or the other, simply because there's no other choice. Some of us feel quite limited, some of us feel this is a problem, so let's be constructive. Rehdon Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bahamut_Zero Report post Posted August 23, 2007 Imo 200 is already too much - players should be supposed to actually visit the ressources locations before being able to make something. Mass production is nothing we want to support even more than we already do. That's why food e.g. will never become storeable. lol i like the part where u say that the food will never be storeable, couse now it is! lol and it was before too, but that was a bug that was fixed, and do u know how it was fixed? by allowing ppl to do it. and about the space limit, i think the storage should have space for every item there is in the game, but since so many new items get into the game i think that at least doubling the limit would be cool Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TirunCollimdus Report post Posted August 23, 2007 I've been mainly potioner and fighter(training only), but Ive been also working on alchemy and magic and I usualy had ~110 FREE slots so I would be doing great with old slots limit. Tirun You are working on two skills mainly and then two other skills and none of them is crafting which is one of the most slot heavy skills. You don't do manufacturing, summoning or engineering either. You only do half of the available skills in the game and your limited style of play works for you. That is really nice but it doesn't mean your limited way of playing is the way everyone should play so your amount of free slots is meaningless. Desertus IMO getting back old slots limit would be better. The fact that game is classless doesnt mean you should be allowed to work on all skills. If you want to be an "all rounder" then learn how to use the storage. Tirun If being classless does not mean you should be able to work on all skills does not mean that you can work on all skills then what is it supposed to mean? You do not have any experience in being an all arounder so maybe you should get some experience at it before telling others they need to learn how to manage their storage. Having classes in a game means you cannot do everything with your character. Having no classes means you can do everything in a game. They are opposites: class and classless. Get it? The old slot limits would be completely untenable and would make EL's claim of being classless a complete fraud and ridiculous joke. You can say your game is classless until you are blue in the face but it won't be true unless anyone who wants to can work in any skill they choose up to and including all of them. Tirun CoGM of PATH Perseverance And Tolerance Honored Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Desertus Report post Posted August 23, 2007 If being classless does not mean you should be able to work on all skills does not mean that you can work on all skills then what is it supposed to mean? You do not have any experience in being an all arounder so maybe you should get some experience at it before telling others they need to learn how to manage their storage. Having classes in a game means you cannot do everything with your character. Having no classes means you can do everything in a game. They are opposites: class and classless. Get it? The old slot limits would be completely untenable and would make EL's claim of being classless a complete fraud and ridiculous joke. You can say your game is classless until you are blue in the face but it won't be true unless anyone who wants to can work in any skill they choose up to and including all of them. I get it that way: In classes game you are limited with your pre-choice while making character and only way to change it is to make new character. While in classless game you can do whatever you want but IMO that doesnt mean you should be able to work on all skills at the same time, you should be limited(by storage size, limited number of pick points etc) to one, two or few of the skill but not all. Of course you should be able to change your choice but that should be painful(eg reset). I see all rounders as people who buy mostly raw resources(if they dont get them themselve) while they less likely buy finished products because they make them themselve. So they create more suply but they dont create demmand at all for finished products. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rehdon Report post Posted August 23, 2007 I get it that way: In classes game you are limited with your pre-choice while making character and only way to change it is to make new character. While in classless game you can do whatever you want but IMO that doesnt mean you should be able to work on all skills at the same time, you should be limited(by storage size, limited number of pick points etc) to one, two or few of the skill but not all. Of course you should be able to change your choice but that should be painful(eg reset). This is a very interesting and original point of view but, as should be evident from the thread, many people respectfully disagree with you. Rehdon Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ermabwed Report post Posted August 23, 2007 (edited) I'd like to point out that the claim "can't be all rounder because of storage limitation" was refuted on page 4 of this thread by all rounders (ttl and myself at the least; by the way, the task for somebody to spend some time with my post there and work out the numbers/items is still unclaimed ). Currently I have ingredients, supplies and tools to level any skill in game in my storage, I have free storage slots and could easily free up more storage slots. So the change from leveling one skill to leveling another isn't painful at all, no reset needed. I wouldn't complain about more storage slots, but I don't think more slots are necessary and the limit provides at least a rather small (!) incentive for self-discipline, which is a good thing. edit for blackthorne: yes, my storage contains every ingredient for mixture of power, refined vegetal mixture, true sight potions and potions of spirit restoration, also ingredients for evasion/accuracy potions and ingredients or free slots to store ingredients for most other potions (that I use or sell) in addition to the actual potions themselves. By the way, your list has some potential for optimization Edited August 23, 2007 by Ermabwed Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jamincollins Report post Posted August 23, 2007 Just to be able to make (and store) the Refined Vegetal Mixture and Mixture of Power requires 32 storage slots: Refined Vegetal Mixture Nightshade - Mullein - Dandelion Extract Poison Ivy - Henbane - Poppies Extract Red Currents - Blue Berries - Rue Extract Yarrow - Wormwood - Tulips Extract Mixture of Power Wheat - Daffodils - Feran Horn Extract Wheat - Valerian - Mugwort Extract White Chanterelle - Ogre Toes - Tree Mushroom Extract Black Nightshade Dandelions Empty Vial Gypsum Mullein Mortar & Pestle Henbane Poison Ivy Poppies Blue Berries Red Currents Rue Tulips Wormwood Yarrow Daffodils Feran Horn Wheat Mugwort Valerian Ogre Toes Tree Mushroom White Chanterelle This does not include the normal potting staples such as Spirit Restoration, True Sight, or anything else. Queue the people to tell me that all rounders shouldn't store all the stuff necessary to make the Mixture of Power or Refined Vegetal Mixture potions. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TirunCollimdus Report post Posted August 23, 2007 I get it that way: In classes game you are limited with your pre-choice while making character and only way to change it is to make new character. While in classless game you can do whatever you want but IMO that doesnt mean you should be able to work on all skills at the same time, you should be limited(by storage size, limited number of pick points etc) to one, two or few of the skill but not all. Of course you should be able to change your choice but that should be painful(eg reset). I see all rounders as people who buy mostly raw resources(if they dont get them themselve) while they less likely buy finished products because they make them themselve. So they create more suply but they dont create demmand at all for finished products. Oxymoron. You cannot be able to do whatever you want and be limited at the same time. All rounders may not buy things very often but they do make stuff to sell. The economy does not function so you cannot blame all rounders for not buying stuff. All rounders have to buy the stuff they cannot make yet. When they can make everything then they have worked hard enough to be able to not have to buy things and can sell. If they have extra money they can still spend it on stuff that is drop only, buy lottery tickets, or help support the warning system or just buy nexus and removal stones to get pick points. They earned the right to a profitable character by working for it. They are still part of the economy because they are still selling even after they have bought all of the drop only items. When the game allows for a functional economy then all rounders can start buying ings to make stuff instead of supplying all of their own needs. TirunCollimdus CoGM of PATH Perseverance And Tolerance Honored Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Learner Report post Posted August 23, 2007 I get it that way: In classes game you are limited with your pre-choice while making character and only way to change it is to make new character. While in classless game you can do whatever you want but IMO that doesnt mean you should be able to work on all skills at the same time, you should be limited(by storage size, limited number of pick points etc) to one, two or few of the skill but not all. Of course you should be able to change your choice but that should be painful(eg reset). I see all rounders as people who buy mostly raw resources(if they dont get them themselve) while they less likely buy finished products because they make them themselve. So they create more suply but they dont create demmand at all for finished products. Oxymoron. You cannot be able to do whatever you want and be limited at the same time. All rounders may not buy things very often but they do make stuff to sell. The economy does not function so you cannot blame all rounders for not buying stuff. All rounders have to buy the stuff they cannot make yet. When they can make everything then they have worked hard enough to be able to not have to buy things and can sell. If they have extra money they can still spend it on stuff that is drop only, buy lottery tickets, or help support the warning system or just buy nexus and removal stones to get pick points. They earned the right to a profitable character by working for it. They are still part of the economy because they are still selling even after they have bought all of the drop only items. When the game allows for a functional economy then all rounders can start buying ings to make stuff instead of supplying all of their own needs. TirunCollimdus CoGM of PATH Perseverance And Tolerance Honored Actually, they carn work on all skills at all times, they just cant store everything. Limited storagr like a limited closet space doesn't ristrict the skill you can work in. It just limits how much junk you can put in there! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Desertus Report post Posted August 23, 2007 Oxymoron. You cannot be able to do whatever you want and be limited at the same time. All rounders may not picky one, my bad. Change it to "...you can work on any skill you want blah, blah.." Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
