One man guilds?

[LemonStar]

Now I am not sure how many people have seen the number of guilds on the EL homepage but the list is entering the ridiculous at the moment. Now the dictionary describes a guild as:

 

"An association of persons of the same trade or pursuits, formed to protect mutual interests and maintain standards."

 

Correct me if I am wrong, but can you have that with a 'guild' of only one player?

People have said that the general chat chan has gone downhill since the guilds started up, but that because the talking is all in guild chat. Now I don't know about all guilds but the two that I have been in where always talking to each other. I have chat logs full of conversations, even met my guild mates in real life. For me that is what makes a good guild.

 

So what is the point of a one player guild?

 

Even a two/three player guild is losing out on the social and helping aspect of the game. Ok so some people do it so they can say that they are the leader of guild X, Y or Z, but it doesn't seem to mean anything anymore.

 

To my actual suggestion now. Is there a way to make the guilds be, well proper guilds. Remove the say 1-5 player guilds and let the proper ones have the respect that they deserve. It will annoy people if they paid money for it, so you can give it back to them. If you put a rule in saying that say within a fixed amount of time you need X amount of members, wouldn't that make the guilds better? Ok so some people might just sign up loads of 2nd char and the like to boost numbers but it does seem silly to me to have all these hundreds of guilds.

 

Perhaps even the guilds should pay tax? Not a lot, but then the more members you have that are 'active' (hence not just signing up random char) the less the tax will be per player.

 

An idea anyway. Flame away if you wish.

[duckyo]

most of them are guild that will take awhile to get better, some that have had 1 player for ages are basicly spam guilds(if thats the right way to explain it)

[scarr]

some people like to walk with a TAG, or hate it that people keep ask "join my guild please"

[trollson]

Nothing wrong with a club of one.

 

I'd be more interested to know how many characters in the guilds are actually active. Maybe there should be a figure for how many guild members have been active in, say, the last month?

 

 

Clarification: A guild needs time not only to recruit, but to recruit the right members. A guilds reputation can be severely damaged by admitting, unknowingly, undesirables and outlaws through an over exuberant recruitment campaign.

Edited August 16, 2005 by trollson

[duckyo]

i think a guilld of 1 is ok unless the guilds never will recruit members

[Aislinn]

I agree 1000000% and yes you will get flamed (and so will I again lol). This has been brought up before, and the result was "What's the harm? How does it affect YOU if there are guilds of one?"

 

--The standard for actually creating a guild needs to be raised, both the skill level needed and the $gc amount.

--The ability to transfer over ownership to a person who doesn't have even these current minimum restrictions should be stopped.

--A guild leader should actually be required and able to lead his guild, hence the name. It is pretty disgusting when a "guild leader" is so helpless they don't even know where to find the guild commands. That should not be a guild leader. But these are the people who will flame and cry "no fair, we have the right to have a guild too!!!111".

--A guild should actually have members, as you say. There is no point to a guild with one member other than to have a tag next to your name. That is not a guild, by definition.

--Definition of a guild:

1. An association of persons of the same trade or pursuits, formed to protect mutual interests and maintain standards.

2. A similar association, as of merchants or artisans, in medieval times.

In other words, people (plural).

--It used to mean something to be part of a guild, to be chosen and have that tag next to your name. And it meant something to be a respectable guild. Even the pk guilds used to have respect and honor.

--The current guild system is part of the reason the community isn't as tight as it once was...you knew who was in what guild, and what that guild stood for. (Kind of like players, you knew who was who, people weren't trading/selling/buying/name-changing every 5 minutes either )

 

And how does it affect me? Or Lemon? Or any one of us? It affects the community as a whole, therefore it affects us each individually. I agree, the current guild situation is just plain silly.

But good luck Lemon, maybe they'll listen to you.

[Sistema]

...... Exactly what Aislinn said, I 101% agree,

 

what's the point of a guild if it has only one person?

 

Lemon has posted the definition of 'guild'...

 

why would you want to have a guild channel if you're the only one in it?

 

 

it is teh way of teh n00bs, I presume.

[Dimov]

WoW : EL - 1 - 0. To create a guild in wow, you need to have atleast 9 ppl to have signed to join, haven't made one myself, but I've talked to the guildmastah npc.

[PolkaDot]

What if it takes 5 people or somethign to start a guild together. Maybe you have to have 5 people with a skill over 50 with 50k each to start a guild. That would be a tough requirement.

 

heh, made my post before even seeing dimov's

Edited August 15, 2005 by PolkaDot

[ttlanhil]

once upon a time, a skill at 39+ and 30k gold would have been worth something. and that would have meant that the person was one of the older players and was ready to be a guildmaster.

now, how long do you suppose it'd take to reach those requirements purely from harvesting? a while, sure, but not that long, and you don't learn much doing lilac and veggie runs

lets have the requirements rise with inflation! as people have more cash, guilds should cost more

 

I've also got nothing against forcing a minimum number of players, but how will you prove it? how much time would it take to have 4 chars on at once doing vegies in order to get level 20, just so they can then be forgotten but count towards the number in guild? (there are problems now with hue numbers of inactive players in guilds... though hopefully this will be sorted soon)

 

perhaps, to deal with some of the other issues, we can have pseudo tags, like a green ???? to indicate that they're looking for a guild or something. and something else to say they're happy being as they are(which doesn't mean they won't join a guild, it just means don't ask them. they may already have a guild in mind). all those messages about "join my guild" are annoying.

on my second day with a new char (and at the time, harvest 15, a/d/manu 6 or so) I had someone from a polish(? it was some guild with their #guild_info in another language anyway) guild trying to recruit me... that is just seriously wrong

[Phaet]

In other games I played someone who creates his own guild got one week to recruit at least 2 people. If he fails, the guild's cancelled and he won't get his money back (or like... somewhere, don't remember where, to form a guild you need some special artiffact). And if everyone quits exept for one guy... same thing: one week to get 2 people.

[scarr]

EL should remove all guilds, change the price to 200k

and 1 level over 80 or 90

[LemonStar]

Wow, I am shocked that people agreed with me here! Thanks guys.

 

The guild system does need to be raised, I went on a money drive (making stuff not just lilac) and have easily made 10k in a couple of days (not that I was on much). What do people think about taxing the guild once made... With that in place the more active people you have the smaller each individual person would have to pay. If you had to pay say 10k a month tax, and you had 1 member, that is a lot of money, with 100 its 100gc. If you ain't got active charecters though, less people to make the money, and you lose the guild.

[duckyo]

but then they'll be about 2 guilds

[duckyo]

lemon i think you should make a poll for this

[Soldus]

EL should remove all guilds, change the price to 200k

and 1 level over 80  or 90

188146[/snapback]

 

that's what i said ages ago

 

i can't find my old post now (too lazy to search lol), but how about something like this:

 

level 80 for a master guild; 250k ; level 50 to join (golden tag) unlimited members

level 50 for a guild ; 150k ; level 35 to join (blue tag ?) 50 members max

level 39 for a clan ; 75k ; level 20 to join (red tag ?) 20 members max

[LemonStar]

that's what i said ages ago

 

i can't find my old post now (too lazy to search lol), but how about something like this:

 

level 80 for a master guild; 250k ; level 50 to join  (golden tag) unlimited members

level 50 for a guild ; 150k  ; level 35 to join  (blue tag ?) 50 members max

level 39 for a clan ; 75k ; level 20 to join (red tag ?) 20 members max

188165[/snapback]

 

 

Yup Acutally I really like that idea Soluds. Give back meaning to guild system, while still allowing people to get onto the ladder. Plus if you all work hard in a guild you should be able to upgrade your guild for less money, say 10k off?

[trollson]

Interesting idea Soldus, but wouldn't it be necessary to recognise characters who are active (and distinct) in the Guild?

[Aislinn]

Interesting idea Soldus, but wouldn't it be necessary to recognise characters who are active (and distinct) in the Guild?

188226[/snapback]

No more or less than it is now. If there was a way to do that, that would be great. Unfortunately in some areas, we have to work with what we have. Although I really don't see why it would matter how many people were in each guild/clan.

[Guest Kidania]

I think that its joining guilds that is the problem, not making them.

 

L40 is sufficient for a guild master in my opinion (though harvest should not be included as a skill for this purpose), however joining guilds should be more restricted by default.

 

To join a guild should require more than a few hours worth of harvest experience. It should take at least 2 levels over 20 (or 25) in my opinion, neither of which can be harvesting (Well, maybe you could have 1 as harvesting since its 2 stats, but my point still remains that harvest alone shouldnt let you join a guild). Perhaps a monetary cost should also be required (for both the joiner and the guild master), something like 1K for the member and 5K for the guild master.

 

Those things together would mean that guilds wont just do random recruiting, they will want to find quality players who are worth the investment.

 

As for 1 player guilds... I dont have a problem with them, though they do go against the definition of a guild.

 

I dont think a certain number of players (Except maybe a minimum of 2) should be required, that encourages random recruiting spam and it also discourages tight knit groups of 3 or 4 players, which is what I think of as an ideal guild.

[Daxon]

(or like... somewhere, don't remember where, to form a guild you need some special artiffact)

188128[/snapback]

 

I remember where that is.

[scarr]

if i was developer i sure would change prices+lvls for guilds :}

[duckyo]

whats the difference between a guild and a clan?

[chatterbug89]

I think people make a too big of a deal off of the guild thing...though...witht he thing about the levels...do you mean OA or a level over that...that realy isen't fair for the people who play and talk compared with the people who just powerplay. Though...if it's OA I guess i don't care...i think like 18 more OA's and I can have a master guild

 

Anyways...I like my 1 person guild...acutaly it's two..but I have no clue how that person got in :S However...I am recruiting...just ahven't foudn anyone qualified for the newb guild yet (Beorn was in it for a little while though...).

 

Let the guilds be...you guys are making too big of a fuss over this....it's a game...let people have fun.

 

EDIT: Either way...making people lose their guilds just to support a new system woudl be a horrible idea...even if your paying them back. Plus...what if they do have plans for their guild. Anyways....anyone can go ahead and recurit 10 to 50 new players into their guild...what is so special about that

 

Anyways, a reason i have a one person guild is so I can talk with the other guilds...plus...I do plan to have it be a guild with a purpose...some day....

Edited August 17, 2005 by chatterbug89

[Arnieman]

I would have to disagree for the most part, that there's a problem with 1 player guilds. Looking at the guild page, I notice one thing seems to determine how high on the page a guild is listed - their membership.

 

Top 10 guilds:

PL (162), RICH (157), LNX (114), Ant (107), Dao (102), STA (90), Riva (88), Jedi (78), AID (68), SegV (66) ...

 

Where are all the 1-2 player guilds? near the bottom.

 

For all effect and purpose, when people look at that page, IF they look there, they will see the guilds with more members total FIRST. Why is there a problem (even with the biased wording of this poll) with having 1 player guilds? General rule, if you want your guild having more visibility, RECRUIT.

 

To me, having a guild should mean little, but having a long-time guild should mean something. I mean, if I have a guild for 5 minutes, should that really flag me better than anyone else? But if I can make that guild last ACTIVE for several months, or a year or more, THAT should mean something.

 

My personal idea - let's change the guild count to display active members (or both total and active counts), and define active as having logged within the past 2 weeks or so. Also, make the active count not count bots. Thus (except in the case of multiple played characters, which may bring in questions about the multiplay rule) you could tell that the number of people in a guild were actual active people, not a "bot" or a player that might have been active months ago. This could also come with a command that would allow a guildmaster to #purge_inactives from their guild (remove players who haven't logged in within the past month.

 

On a semi-related note, the bots should not count in the guild counts unless they are counted separately, IMO.