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simma

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wtf is wrong with market chan? isn't a *real* market a place where you can go to buy/sell/trade goods and talk?

 

i have never been to a market, had a chat with some1, then had "TOPIC" shouted in my ear o.O

 

the total strictness of the chan is completely drawing away from the rpg aspect of el and for what? so a few people who wanna go trade crazy, can?

 

this is totally not fair. it may be a minority who want to talk in market chan, but does tht make it any less relative or important?

 

i can't see new people joining the game and liking having TOPIC shouted at them, this game has always been centred around a good community, as all rpg's should be, so why the need for the strictness? i am truely baffled by this....

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Blame Platyna. She started the topic frenzy in the market channel. Before then when me and lrnr ran it you only got told topic if you were spamming.

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B) I fully agree with the original post, and prolly as strongly as SirDan disagrees with it and me. But he is wrong, because I am right, and this makes him a n00b. But I digress... lol

 

:( I don't think it's entirely fair to blame Platyna for the topicnazi craze, (which is a term I like to think I came up with). Afterall, how many mods in ch3 want to follow her example? There are a lot of people who don't want anyone to say anything but buy, sell, and pc. And these people can take a flying leap off my.. um, they have their place, anyway. Truly, I can't stand the way some of the mods scream topic at me like I'm a smegging kindergartener, but I pity them for the balance they're trying to maintain. For every SirDan there is a makourain, and a Chaoogie for every... someone else who bitches about topic.

 

:P So for the sake of all mods who aren't jaded assholes yet, try top be understanding about their position.

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You will find that i have NEVER once shouted TOPIC in market or noob channels.

 

I DO expect that ppl who are talking off topic be moved to another channel - once they have been warned.

 

Ppl go to that channel to buy/sell - thats why there are seperate channels - not just 1.

 

If ppl want to chat - got to chan 4 or 5 !!!!

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With channel 4 or 5 has a little problem. Noone is there. Because if anyone wanna trade and talk sometimes, dont want to jump between channels.

 

I dont understand, why is it a big problem?

 

I want back the old community! (when noone said to us: topic)

 

I hope, this problem will be solved soon :P

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One of the problems with offtopic on marketchannel (not talking about newbiehelp channel now) is that now you have some 50 ppl in there, sometimes even more than that.

If every single one of those goes "a little bit" offtopic, you get chaos...mix that with some 465654 bots yelling around, you are in serious trouble.

We do get called in by ppl who are totally annoyed by all the spam, errr, "offtopic" :P

in there, and so we of course try to bring the channel back on topic.

 

I would strongly suggest we bring back channel 8 as market/offtopic channel, that should leave the silent traders happy and the marketplace happy ppl aswell...

 

Good idea, or bad idea? i would announce the new channel once per hour for a while, so it won't be empty :)

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I dont understand, why is it a big problem?

 

its a problem because ppl cant see whats being sold !!! - it gets out of hand

 

its a problem becuase some ppl want to cause trouble and go OT for fun...

 

dont want to jump between channels.

 

dont be so lazy...

 

it will all be solved when we get multi-channel support - until then, deal with it, and follow the rules

Edited by crannog

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It's not so hard to type #jc 3 or #jc 4 ...

 

You can't please all of the people all of the time, heck you can't please them all some of the time. :P

 

So since that is the case, the rules win out and market channel is for what it says it's for...market business. End of story.

 

I think channel 8 should be brought back in, again, it's not so hard to go to #jc 3, type "blah blah blah for sale, pm me" then go to #jc 8 and say "blah blah blah for sale, hey hi so-and-so, how's it going?"

 

That took me all of an extra 5 seconds to type, if that.

 

Oh btw, yes I think bringing back channel 8 is a good idea :)

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splitting the market into 2 channels is a BAD idea imho,

nobody stops ppl selling the odd item on chan 4...

Edited by crannog

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the reason this is being brought up AGAIN

 

is because anyone who is anyone who wants to buy or sell ANYTHING has to be on channel 3, it is the place with the most people....

 

some of em noobs who can't even pm so u gotta sit and read everything, the offtopic stuff never really goes THT overboard (and if it does, u mods are there to warn peeps VIA PM FIRST [seriously, how hard is tht?], then kick or whatever..), and it's being used as some daft excuse to hold your positions in thinking your right... which i truely believe u aren't

 

market chan used to be so much more peaceful... yet offtopic happened, and tht was before bots, so only players sat selling/buying, and there was no major complaints back then...

 

how come now there is complaints? some grumpy a**holes joined and people have just followed suit?

 

as i sed in the first place, this is a ROLE PLAYING GAME, now i take tht to be fake reality, and in reality, you TALK in a market....

Edited by simma

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Whats funny as hell is that she fought to keep it offtopic for sooo long then when she got NH she was the topicnazi, weird eh?

No. She always wanted off-topic to be allowed on market channel, but a vote was made and the majority didn't want off-topic. As an official newbie helper, she had to enforce the rule even though she disagreed with it.

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If you read the rules, you'd have no complaint.

 

The rules state this:

 

7. Only SOME offtopic chat in the newbie channel and marketing channel will be allowed. The general chat is channel 4.

 

If you press F5 in-game, you'll get a more descriptive rule, and realise that your breaking the rules by constant offtopic. YES, a 'little offtopic' is allowed, but like crannog said, the more people on the channel, the quicker a little offtopic becomes a nuisance.

 

Furthermore, I remember a thread about the time Platyna was demoded, that was asking for stricter rules on market channel....We cant win!

 

If you stick to the rules (and read them!), you will see that the NH's/Mods are doing what they are supposed to do.

 

Soldus, bring channel 8 back! :D

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Ok, we have problems on both sides.

 

On one side, we have people pushing for off-topic in the market channel, and ruining this side is the spammers who seem to think it's funny to plaster the market with ridiculousness.

 

On the other, we have people that want a relatively quiet market, just for buying/selling/price-checking goods, with minimal off-topic allowed. And the detracters here are topicnazis who have to scream "topic" or ban people for the slightest comment that isn't directly buy/sell/pc.

 

Already, you can see that one side is unbalanced, as it has the power to enforce its own will, claiming "the will/good of the market". Anyone who speaks against the topicnazis can easily be banned from the market, thus limiting their use/enjoyment of a public service in the game. The other side has .... probably nothing, as they can't talk on a channel and buy/sell/pc at the same time, and can't enforce that either.

 

So the idea comes up for separate channels: a topic-only market, and an off-topic/market. This would seem to solve the problem, but it creates a couple in the process.

 

A) Separate markets create a possible division between buyer and seller. If seller_steve wants to sell on one channel, but buyer_bob is looking for what seller_steve is selling on the other, they won't meet unless one switches channels. If both only have one channel to go to, then there's less chance they miss, and more that they meet, so that seller_steve and buyer_bob can trade, and everyone's happy.

B) Merchants can't compete as easily on two markets, as you can only access one channel. Again, seller_steve may offer an item on one channel, then go to the other. Right after seller_steve offers an item, marketer_mark is banal and drops his price. In a fully competitive market, seller_steve is then out of luck, as he's left the channel, and now can't compete.

 

IMO, the separate channel idea would either create separate markets, or as people more or less go to one channel or the other (buyers follow sellers, sellers follow buyers), one channel functionally dies.

 

Really, I don't see we have any solution that makes anyone happy and works, unless both sides can come to some compromise, and still be in ONE channel.

Edited by Arnieman

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*edited by crannog*

 

because it will only lead to flames...more of this will just be deleted

Edited by crannog

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it's pretty easy actually:

#jc 3
@selling/buying whatever, pm me
#jc 8
@selling/buying whatever, pm me
#jc guild (or whatever your homebase is)

 

The good thing about a channel without constant offtopic chatter is, ppl might actually SEE what you are offering... :P

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it's pretty easy actually:

#jc 3
@selling/buying whatever, pm me
#jc 8
@selling/buying whatever, pm me
#jc guild (or whatever your homebase is)

 

The good thing about a channel without constant offtopic chatter is, ppl might actually SEE what you are offering... :P

and yet, the bad thing is they may be elsewhere chattering, so no one sees your offers anyway...

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The good news is that all these problems should be solved once we get hte multi-channel support with the chat box :angry: Becaue then you can easily swap from buying/selling to offtopicing in another channel.

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Warning: Not-so-secret secrets to follow!

 

1 - Noob Helpers & Mods are NOT perfect! *gasp* (Did I just say that out loud)

 

2 - In some rare cases NH/Mods can be overzelous. (Yes, I have been guilty of this on occassion).

 

 

However, I've noticed that during my shifts it's not the SOME off-topic that is usually the problem. It's the flood of off topic that creates issues.

 

In the last 24 hours, I've been on both #jc 1 and #jc 3.

 

On #jc 1 the conversation was so flooded with talk about the Matrix movies that a real noob question was being ignored.

 

On #jc 3 the conversation degraded into talking about "pooping flames" (i.e. F9).

 

Both conversations dominated the channels. The whole idea of "SOME" off topic is to let the conversations drift some, but not at the expense of the channels purpose.

 

A couple of observations: insults and flames should never count as "some offtopic".

 

Most of those who want to chat for any length of time on channel 1 are NOT noobs, but more experienced players who seem to get bored and go there just to chat. That's what channel 4 is. If every player who said "there is never anyone on channel 4" went to channel 4 it would be busier than market channel.

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Whats funny as hell is that she fought to keep it offtopic for sooo long then when she got NH she was the topicnazi, weird eh?

No. She always wanted off-topic to be allowed on market channel, but a vote was made and the majority didn't want off-topic. As an official newbie helper, she had to enforce the rule even though she disagreed with it.

Not only; as a moderator I was a community helper, so I had to do things for the good of whole

community instead of mine. So when people in poll decided they don't want offtopic on the market

channel (not one poll - there were a few in that subject and always the result were "no offtopic" I started

to enforce that rule strictly and I was popularizing channel 4 in hope that the people who wants offtopic

talk + trading will move there and everyone will be pleased. It was some kind of compromise and it

surprised me alot when Tornado and Aquarden got mad at me for that while that was the thing that all

offtopic battle leaders - Aelric, Aquarden, Tornado and me agreed upon.

As a moderator I had to do that what is good for the community, that what community wants not my

personal ambition wants.

 

Regards.

Edited by Platyna

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On #jc 3 the conversation degraded into talking about "pooping flames" (i.e. F9).

 

.....

 

A couple of observations: insults and flames should never count as "some offtopic".

Shouldn't that have been on the "flames" board? (bad joke.)

 

Wow, I spend most of my time on ch. 3, glad I missed that... probly in my logs, somewhere...

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i have never been to a market, had a chat with some1, then had "TOPIC" shouted in my ear o.O

 

Umm..If your looking for a friendly chat...Cant you PM the person..and not spam up the channel Wiping out the previous post before Buyers/Sellers can see them...

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